IUBB @ Florida State in ACC - Big 10 Challenge - 12/9/20

[Trish 11,506]

If we shot 6 percent better we maybe move up 1 or 2 spots in the B1G. We’re extremely inexperienced with most of our lineups on the floor. 
 

not national contenders by any means. This isn’t the 2012-2013 Hoosiers. I think we’re finishing 4-6 in the B1G assuming the season fully concludes, which highly doubt happens. 

[Brass Cannon 24,271]

5 minutes ago, ray said:

You think I had to dig deep? Nah, not at all. There are only 12 players on the roster and several of them haven’t shot a three. It wasn’t too tough to dig up 3pt stats. 

Rob 44%
Jerome 44%

I’m not trying to justify any failings of the team. I was merely saying I disagree with your post that if we had two players who shoot better than 38% we would be title contenders...because we do...and I certainly don’t think we’re considered a legitimate national title contender. 

Are you seriously trying to use a sample size of 9 for anything?  Like for real.  They are both career 33% shooters.  If they are still shooting 44% after 20 attempts this year you might be onto something 

[Brass Cannon 24,271]

18 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

In modern day college basketball if you can’t consistently hit the three you are severely putting pressure on all other aspects of the game.  

Regardless of how well you play on defense in that game more pressure is going to be applied.   It’s not just threes.  When you miss Little runners and 5 foot bunnies to extend leads and you are putting more pressure on your defense and on the mental part.   Teams can overcome lack of shooting from game to game but to consistently rely on winning without the three in college basketball is playing with fire.  
 

People want Hunter in the game for his shooting but from my viewpoint he handed the ball to FSU multiple times and didn’t look locked in on defensive end.    FSU had their stud step up in OT and hit a deep three after being like 2-7 from the field and made the big shot at the end.   IU has a stud freshman that is clearly in college a year too early and wasn’t in the game

FSU has a 19 game home winning streak for a reason: they are good, and with every team with a home court advantage they get a little help.   IU isn’t the first team to get a questionable whistle and they won’t be the last 

Coaches change their recruiting philosophies after getting burned a couple cycles.   Might be time for Archie to pull a Jay Wright and tell his assistants I don’t care what they are ranked I want you to recruit me dudes who can (....ing) shoot the ball.  
 

Don’t you think it’s too late to change. The soonest we can get some new recruits in here would be Archies sixth year.  By that time Wright had placed top 3 of his league twice and won it once.  
 

And is the issue really the kids. Evan Fitzner was a career 41% shooter. He came here and barely hit 30% 

[Uspshoosier 45,157]

1 minute ago, Brass Cannon said:

Don’t you think it’s too late to change. The soonest we can get some new recruits in here would be Archies sixth year.  By that time Wright had placed top 3 of his league twice and won it once.  
 

And is the issue really the kids. Evan Fitzner was a career 41% shooter. He came here and barely hit 30% 

That Jay Wright story was after they made it to the first Final 4 and then had a string of early bounces in the tournament.  Never too late to change.   
archie has recruited shooters but for whatever reason they have went elsewhere.   He has yet to bring in a shooter that would be labeled an elite shooter.  Leal might be the closest thing but his scouting report is just a plus shooter not elite.   I’m not holding the coaching staff accountable for Fitzners shooting woes in the B1G.  For me he stepped up in competition and looked like a fish out of water trying to adjust.   If you blame the staff on that one it should be the evaluation of the player overall and thinking he could help 

[Brass Cannon 24,271]

13 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

That Jay Wright story was after they made it to the first Final 4 and then had a string of early bounces in the tournament.  Never too late to change.   
archie has recruited shooters but for whatever reason they have went elsewhere.   He has yet to bring in a shooter that would be labeled an elite shooter.  Leal might be the closest thing but his scouting report is just a plus shooter not elite.   I’m not holding the coaching staff accountable for Fitzners shooting woes in the B1G.  For me he stepped up in competition and looked like a fish out of water trying to adjust.   If you blame the staff on that one it should be the evaluation of the player overall and thinking he could help 

What I’m saying is Wright had success to sell recruits on.  We don’t have momentum on recruiting and we don’t have success to sell kids on either.  

[Uspshoosier 45,157]

1 minute ago, Brass Cannon said:

What I’m saying is Wright had success to sell recruits on.  We don’t have momentum on recruiting and we don’t have success to sell kids on either.  

I’ve never really bought in to whole recruiting momentum theory.  I’m sure a lot do and that’s ok but from talking with people in the recruiting business some feel it’s a fan thing but in reality some cycles you hit your targets and others you don’t.     Kids go to programs all the time that are not successful on the court.  If I’m Archie in the next cycle I target elite shooters regardless of their ranking and location.   Now if the coaches scouting is saying some of these kids are elite shooters then that’s another problem.   

[Indiana muskie 205]

What about that Brown kid . From Blackford. He would of been the ticket.

[Alford Bailey 12,355]

The one that got away.....

[cappymo14 2,276]

In modern day college basketball if you can’t consistently hit the three you are severely putting pressure on all other aspects of the game.   Regardless of how well you play on defense in that game more pressure is going to be applied.   It’s not just threes.  When you miss Little runners and 5 foot bunnies to extend leads and you are putting more pressure on your defense and on the mental part.   Teams can overcome lack of shooting from game to game but to consistently rely on winning without the three in college basketball is playing with fire.    

People want Hunter in the game for his shooting but from my viewpoint he handed the ball to FSU multiple times and didn’t look locked in on defensive end.    FSU had their stud step up in OT and hit a deep three after being like 2-7 from the field and made the big shot at the end.   IU has a stud freshman that is clearly in college a year too early and wasn’t in the game

FSU has a 19 game home winning streak for a reason: they are good, and with every team with a home court advantage they get a little help.   IU isn’t the first team to get a questionable whistle and they won’t be the last 

Coaches change their recruiting philosophies after getting burned a couple cycles.   Might be time for Archie to pull a Jay Wright and tell his assistants I don’t care what they are ranked I want you to recruit me dudes who can (....ing) shoot the ball.  

 

 

 

I had lobbied for Hunter to take some of Trey’s minutes tonight. I feel that will start to happen as the season rolls on. I’m not at all saying it’s why they lost. Hunter has better length. He’s older. Can hit from the perimeter. These were the shortcomings I felt IU faced tonight. Rebounding and Shooting. I love Trey, love his attack from the perimeter. I say he’s going to get smacked down with some offensive fouls with that flying pass in the lane once conference play starts, but overall I do like what he can give us.. But, we gave him 20 minutes tonight, and he gave us 0pts, 1reb, 1 turnover and 2 fouls. That said, those won’t be his stats every night. If Trey is in there hustling and making the smart plays, Im fine with him getting those minutes against some conference opponents. I’m fairly confident though that Jerome’s end of season numbers will surpass Trey’s in every meaningful statistical category. Hoping for Jerome sake it’s not on less minutes. 

 

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[JaybobHoosier 11,839]

I watched the game on DVR after I knew the result so I didn’t have to deal with all the emotional frustrations I’m sure I would have had. Still, I felt overall this game was encouraging because I was very nervous coming into this game. FSU had more length and a better coach than Texas, so I felt this was going to be a typical let down game.

 

I was very proud of how our team fought and played overall. If we had rebounded better then we win this game. Yes, our shooting still sucked but we’ve come to expect that. If the team would have fought harder and grabbed a few more rebounds, IU wins.

 

I’ve seen on Twitter a lot of people dogging Rob, and I felt this was his best game yet as he was attacking more and trying to be more aggressive. Him and Jerome had probably their best games of the short season.

 

This was a big test for IU and they lost to a top 25 team on the road in overtime. While disappointing to lose, it’s nothing to be mad about. In the past 3 seasons, an IU team would have gotten blown out, but this team showed they really want to win and will fight. Very encouraging!

 

 

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[Honkyman 1,670]

IU was lucky not to get blown out against Florida State. The inability of the guards to make shots underscores this team's limitations. IU only has one reliable offensive weapon and one weapon is not enough to compete for the top half of the conference. Attacking the rim doesn't do much good if you can't score when you get there. Our guards not only can't hit 3-point shots, they can't make two foot shots. Part of the problem is that Miller's offense lacks imagination. It is too predictable so that when the guards get to the hoop the defense is there to throw off the shot.  The silver lining is Trayce Jackson Davis who really is becoming an excellent college player. If only he had a little more help from the guard play.

[ray 1,563]

9 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

Are you seriously trying to use a sample size of 9 for anything?  Like for real.  They are both career 33% shooters.  If they are still shooting 44% after 20 attempts this year you might be onto something 

You drive me insane with your “my rules only” for any argument and anyone who goes against “my rules” is an idiot. 

If you can’t use a sample size of 11 or 12 shots to suggest someone might shoot 38% for the season then you can’t take a sample size of 3 or 4 and assume a shooter will be under 38%.

But that doesn’t even matter for this was not the argument. If we had two guys shooting 38% for the season we still wouldn’t likely be title contenders, which was the point you were attempting to make. You used the sample size and made the assumption those numbers couldn’t possibly improve, yet you dog me for using that sample size to say their shooting this season is higher than what you claim it needs to be in order to win the championship. 

As you often rudely tell others, “You’re moving the goal posts.”

You are so condescending. 

[mdn82 25,510]

The one that got away.

[HoosierCoop 3,889]

Despite the loss, I can see this FSU challenging for the top spot in the ACC compared to what I have seen so far in that league.  No moral victories, but we hung with a decent team on the road in overtime.  A tip of the fence and we travel home with a W.

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,182]

Would be the first travel they had called all night anyway.


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Nah. I can think of at least 1, if not 2, for each team in the 1st half

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[Trish 11,506]

1 hour ago, Honkyman said:

IU was lucky not to get blown out against Florida State. The inability of the guards to make shots underscores this team's limitations. IU only has one reliable offensive weapon and one weapon is not enough to compete for the top half of the conference. Attacking the rim doesn't do much good if you can't score when you get there. Our guards not only can't hit 3-point shots, they can't make two foot shots. Part of the problem is that Miller's offense lacks imagination. It is too predictable so that when the guards get to the hoop the defense is there to throw off the shot.  The silver lining is Trayce Jackson Davis who really is becoming an excellent college player. If only he had a little more help from the guard play.

I wouldn't say our offense is so predictable. We had lots of great looks from the perimeter and in transition, hell even some solid looks in the half-court dead ball possessions. 

FSU collapsed everytime our guards drove, which is smart. They have the length to make any shot at the rim contested and difficult. I imagine they'll use the same philosophy going into ACC play. What surprised me the most was FSU let TJD go one on one with defenders. Despite the size of FSU, TJD was simply better than the post switch defender. 

This is a different game perhaps if we make one or two more of our open 3's or maybe if we don't shoot 75% from the charity stripe. We're a solid team, our boys have to finish plays. 

[Honkyman 1,670]

"This is a different game perhaps if we make one or two more of our open 3's...our boys have to finish plays."

That's my point. Our guards don't make their 3s and they don't finish plays. This is not just the game against FSU.   As pointed out in the 'Five Takeaways" coverage by Inside the Hall: "Through five games, the Hoosiers are shooting just 28.8% on 3s. This is not a new issue for Indiana under Miller, but it is one that persists as year four of his tenure gets into full swing. Indiana's starting guards went 2-of-11 on 3s...the program's inability to recruit and develop shooters continues to hamper its progress."

[Stuhoo 79,768]

 

Parker Stewart's proven skill set would be a breath of fresh air on this team.

 

[Trish 11,506]

25 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

"This is a different game perhaps if we make one or two more of our open 3's...our boys have to finish plays."

That's my point. Our guards don't make their 3s and they don't finish plays. This is not just the game against FSU.   As pointed out in the 'Five Takeaways" coverage by Inside the Hall: "Through five games, the Hoosiers are shooting just 28.8% on 3s. This is not a new issue for Indiana under Miller, but it is one that persists as year four of his tenure gets into full swing. Indiana's starting guards went 2-of-11 on 3s...the program's inability to recruit and develop shooters continues to hamper its progress."

I'd love for Archie to bring in a shooting coach. Whether or not he'll do it, unsure. Coaches can be stubborn on stuff like that. However, we have seen Archie do some things differently so maybe he'll adapt for next season and bring one in?

 

[ebridges24 2,417]

The thing that bothered me the most in this game was Al's driving into 3 and 4 people and trying to finish. He's got to learn how to kick the ball out. Every time he drove the ball, I cringed because I knew he would not kick the ball out when FSU came to help.