TOM CREAN FIRED

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Kinda hard as a double digit seed. But once again Crean has no leg to stand on when it comes to tourney success.

And Martin my thinking is that with increased talent and resources Drew could improve his offense. Where as Crean obviously can't improve his defensive lapses.

Crean has a Final Four and two Sweet Sixteens. No one is getting hyped about that, but that's still better than all but 26 other active coaches in college basketball. Also, please for the love of all that is good in this world try to say he just got lucky that he had DWade. Discrediting Final Fours is just silly.

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

Crean has a Final Four and two Sweet Sixteens. No one is getting hyped about that, but that's still better than all but 26 other active coaches in college basketball. Also, please for the love of all that is good in this world try to say he just got lucky that he had DWade. Discrediting Final Fours is just silly.

The fact he couldn't repeat it with Zeller and oladipo would hint it was a fluke.

[WayneFleekHoosier 47,769]

My hope and then also my fear has come true this year.  Crean has done enough to warrant keeping his job.  I knew he would with the roster though.  Any coach would dream of our roster this year.  Credit to Crean, he created it.  We have underperformed in some games this year with this roster.  As have many other teams with talented rosters.  Its a mixed bag of emotions because I've seen all the Crean flaws for years and many aren't resolved.  If every year was like this season or 2011-2013, NO ONE would complain.  (or few would)

 

Here's the thing-

 

I just want a consistent winner like Duke, Kansas, Arizona, Kentucky, UNC, Louisville, MSU.  (man those are some dirty programs, lol)

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

The fact he couldn't repeat it with Zeller and oladipo would hint it was a fluke.

It's a single elimination tournament... Literally anything can happen. So he's had two solid chances at making a Final Four and he's now 1 for 2. I need a bigger sample size. Come on...

 

Not saying that 2013 finish wasn't a complete failure, but using that to negate a previous accomplishment is ridiculous.

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

It's a single elimination tournament... Literally anything can happen. So he's had two solid chances at making a Final Four and he's now 1 for 2. I need a bigger sample size. Come on...

Not saying that 2013 finish wasn't a complete failure, but using that to negate a previous accomplishment is ridiculous.

So drews failures in a single elimination tournament are why we shouldn't consider him but Crean gets a pass?

And how about the fact that Crean has has 3 shots at a final four in what 17 years of coaching. Shouldn't that in itself be totally unacceptable to everybody?

Stevens isn't even going to talk to us till we fire Crean if we want Stevens we have to risk firing Crean. It's just how it is. But Crean isn't the guy. So how is it even a risk?

[323SGrant 1,176]

I just hope CTC wins the BIG this year. He hasn't done that yet, i.e., this year.

[Stuhoo 79,303]

Bring your ass up to God's country and you are definitely on my boat with me fishing for salmon, halibut, rockfish and whatever else our beer will let us.

I'd sure like to join you guys.

Why?
Just for the halibut.

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

So drews failures in a single elimination tournament are why we shouldn't consider him but Crean gets a pass?

And how about the fact that Crean has has 3 shots at a final four in what 17 years of coaching. Shouldn't that in itself be totally unacceptable to everybody?

Stevens isn't even going to talk to us till we fire Crean if we want Stevens we have to risk firing Crean. It's just how it is. But Crean isn't the guy. So how is it even a risk?

Drew's failures are across the board.

 

And do you have some examples of coaches for whom resources were what was holding them back? I looked at every coach in the Big Ten and could not see a discernible difference in their Adjusted offensive and defensive numbers between their previous jobs and their current. 

 

Love to be proven wrong though. 

[ALASKA HOOSIER 11,254]

There is in my freezer! suck it naples

 

Stu- you are always invited.. LET'S DO IT! And there isalways time for KINGS![attachment=3484:11698895_113665512305969_2097808359147711199_n.jpg]

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

Drew's failures are across the board.

 

And do you have some examples of coaches for whom resources were what was holding them back? I looked at every coach in the Big Ten and could not see a discernible difference in their Adjusted offensive and defensive numbers between their previous jobs and their current. 

 

Love to be proven wrong though. 

 

Define across the board?

 

Hes had 2 shots, hes ran into the steamroller that is MSU and last years Maryland team. Coach K didn't even make the NCAA tourney until his 9th year.  You going to hold a guys first 3 years against him?

 

I don't have access to Kenpoms advanced metrics.  But even if its not Drew, we need to try somebody new because Crean is not the guy.  Drew did have them playing with the 41st best offense his first year.  Perhaps its a personnel issue.  He can't recruit guys who are both good at offense and defense to Valpo, maybe he could here. 

 

When I realized my ex wasn't the one I didn't keep dating her till I found the one.  I broke up with her and went looking again you don't stay with the wrong person just because you don't know who the right person is. 

[Uspshoosier 44,883]

The fact he couldn't repeat it with Zeller and oladipo would hint it was a fluke.

or it just means he lost in the tournament to another team with nba talent on it. I've seen better teams with more talent then Zeller and oladipo's team and better coaches then crean lose a lot earlier.

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

I might point to Kennedy at A&M though.  He has them higher than he had Murray State.  And hes got their offense 30+ spots higher than he ever had Murray state. And he has their D right where he had his best Murray states D.  Both top 50 atm also something he never accomplished at Murray State. 

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Define across the board?

 

Hes had 2 shots, hes ran into the steamroller that is MSU and last years Maryland team. Coach K didn't even make the NCAA tourney until his 9th year.  You going to hold a guys first 3 years against him?

 

I don't have access to Kenpoms advanced metrics.  But even if its not Drew, we need to try somebody new because Crean is not the guy.  Drew did have them playing with the 41st best offense his first year.  Perhaps its a personnel issue.  He can't recruit guys who are both good at offense and defense to Valpo, maybe he could here. 

 

When I realized my ex wasn't the one I didn't keep dating her till I found the one.  I broke up with her and went looking again you don't stay with the wrong person just because you don't know who the right person is. 

Coach K missed his first nine tournaments, but you want to get rid of Crean for two Sweet Sixteens in eight years...

 

Confused why Coach K missing his first nine tournaments is proof of support for Drew.

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

or it just means he lost in the tournament to another team with nba talent on it. I've seen better teams with more talent then Zeller and oladipo's team and better coaches then crean lose a lot earlier.

 

Syracuse had NBA talent, they also somehow surprised Crean with a Zone. 

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

Coach K missed his first nine tournaments, but you want to get rid of Crean for two Sweet Sixteens in eight years...

 

Confused why Coach K missing his first nine tournaments is proof of support for Drew.

 

By year 16 Coach K had also been to 4 final fours and was 1 year away from a championship.  Not fair to compare Creans 9-16 against Ks first 9 years.

 

Its not proof of support for Drew, but illustrates why its silly to judge a coach by how he performs with a team with no resources in their first few years of coaching. 

[Uspshoosier 44,883]

Syracuse had NBA talent, they also somehow surprised Crean with a Zone.

a zone with guards that were over 6'5 while ours were under 6 ft. There is a reason why Syracuse's zone is nationally recognized. Just curious if that zone made any other teams look silly that year. I will go out on a limb and say yes.

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

a zone with guards that were over 6'5 while ours were under 6 ft. There is a reason why Syracuse's zone is nationally recognized. Just curious if that zone made any other teams look silly that year. I will go out on a limb and say yes.

 

Oh I'm sorry I didn't realize that somebody else constructed that team.  Or that just because your guards are short means you shouldn't make adjustments to try and beat the zone. 

[Brass Cannon 24,191]

Prohm at Iowa state also improved Iowa states D this year dramatically while improving their offense.  But its too soon to say if that will be carried forward and sustained

[Uspshoosier 44,883]

Oh I'm sorry I didn't realize that somebody else constructed that team. Or that just because your guards are short means you shouldn't make adjustments to try and beat the zone.

no prob to me it sounds like you look down on Syracuse because it's a "zone" defense which you seem to think automatically can be adjusted against. Their zone is based on length it is not a normal zone. He does a hell of a job recruiting players for his system. Fwiw Syracuse was a 4 seed but 10th in kenpom. 29 offensive, and that Zone defense was 8th defensively

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

Define across the board?

 

Hes had 2 shots, hes ran into the steamroller that is MSU and last years Maryland team. Coach K didn't even make the NCAA tourney until his 9th year.  You going to hold a guys first 3 years against him?

 

I don't have access to Kenpoms advanced metrics.  But even if its not Drew, we need to try somebody new because Crean is not the guy.  Drew did have them playing with the 41st best offense his first year.  Perhaps its a personnel issue.  He can't recruit guys who are both good at offense and defense to Valpo, maybe he could here. 

 

When I realized my ex wasn't the one I didn't keep dating her till I found the one.  I broke up with her and went looking again you don't stay with the wrong person just because you don't know who the right person is. 

Drew has consistently fielded an offense and defense below a level I would find acceptable at Indiana. In his best season coaching, with a top-5 defense, he is still 12 spots behind us on KenPom. 41st best offense his second year. And... what? Why not say that about literally any coach? He also doesn't have to play against guys who are recruited as highly. Tom Crean can't recruit guys who are good at both offense and defense to Indiana, maybe he could at Kentucky.

 

Billy Kennedy is closer, but still no dice. Until last year, his numbers were consistent between SE Louisiana, Murray, and A&M. He even had quick flashes of decency (like this year) at Murray.

 

And your love life would be a great analogy if it was at all analogous. We can't date around looking for the right match, we can't hang out with a coach for a couple of months and then decide it's not working out so we see if we can meet a new coach at Nick's. It's like if you knew your ex wasn't the one, but after you break up with her you have to enter into another relationship within the month and you have to stay in that relationship for at least 3 years. Selecting a college coach is a big commitment and can tank your program in just a few short years if done incorrectly. Just look at schools who made bad decisions for short-term coaches and how long it took them to climb back up, a good example is Indiana University if you ever watch them. It took them 10 years to make it past the first weekend after they made some bad hiring decisions back in 2000.  And they got stuck with one of them for 6 years! Can you imagine if you knew it wasn't working out with your ex so you hastily decided to hook-up with her best friend and got stuck with her for 6 years even though she kind of sucked?