(2014) SF Josh Cunningham to Bradley

[HoosierRob 1,042]

[quote name="Baltimore Hoosier" post="57679" timestamp="1396734167"]Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners[/quote]what are you talking about? I don't care how you try to sugarcoat it.. When your iu you shouldn't have to worry about South Carolina or Bradley for recruits.. If you don't think something's off about that.. Then wow


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[TheWatShot 14,013]

If Crean can't convince a recruit to come here instead of South Carolina, he may as well start thinking about life after IU. What a joke. 

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,393]

If Crean can't convince a recruit to come here instead of South Carolina, he may as well start thinking about life after IU. What a joke.

I am with you on this. He has lost so many recruiting battles that he supposedly led, it is unbelievable. We seemingly have so much to sell. I don't get it. Either something is totally amiss within the program or we are one of the few schools that are not getting dirty on the recruiting trail.

If its the latter, so be it, but I wish I knew.

[djsalway 4,161]

He hasn't committed to South Carolina yet. Stop freaking out, everyone.

[NotTheReal HoosierHoopster 67]

You just can't have seasons as bad as we just had and be able to recruit whatsoever.

You just can't. Had we at least made the NIT and won a couple of games, we wouldn't be such a laughingstock now . These kids arent stupid, they want to win.

[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

[quote name="HoosierRob" post="57681" timestamp="1396734502"]what are you talking about? I don't care how you try to sugarcoat it.. When your iu you shouldn't have to worry about South Carolina or Bradley for recruits.. If you don't think something's off about that.. Then wow


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The question is, what are you talking about? No need to sugarcoat it.. Crean won major recruiting battles for RJ and Blackmon. And he hasn't even committed yet.

Say IU doesn't land this 3 star 100+ recruit, does that mean the sky is falling? Come on man... Step off the ledge.



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[KelleyHoosh 2,263]

The question is, what are you talking about? No need to sugarcoat it.. Crean won major recruiting battles for RJ and Blackmon. And he hasn't even committed yet.

Say IU doesn't land this 3 star 100+ recruit, does that mean the sky is falling? Come on man... Step off the ledge.



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The 2014 class is a shell of what it could have been between Lyles and Goodluck. Plus however many other good players. 

 

The reason you are siting to calm down is exactly why he should be upset. How is it that IU is struggling to pull a 3 star recruit from Bradley and SCar? Kids with that ranking in the midwest should be lining up for IU.

[8bucks 6,456]

Crean did win those battles. Those were before this season had really started. The question for many of us is whether or not recruits have soured on us as a result of this year.

None of us can definitively say yes or no but we have three spots open now for Crean to fill and help counter that theory.


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[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

[quote name="KelleyHoosh" post="57755" timestamp="1396746368"]The 2014 class is a shell of what it could have been between Lyles and Goodluck. Plus however many other good players.

The reason you are siting to calm down is exactly why he should be upset. How is it that IU is struggling to pull a 3 star recruit from Bradley and SCar? Kids with that ranking in the midwest should be lining up for IU.[/quote]

How do you know IU/Crean are struggling? Players check out ALL options before choosing a school most of the time.

That dude Maten from Michigan just chose Georiga over Michigan State and IU. Does that mean Michigan State is also struggling?

The reality is, these guys are high schoolers who weren't even born in '87 and were probably too young to remember 2002. The 'it's IU' bit doesn't work with all of these players. My hope is that guys like Vic and Cody continue to develop and act as sort of the blueprint on what can happen when you come play ball for IU and Crean.

For now, I'm pretty happy with what Crean has done with the 2014 class.. You can't really blame Crean for losing Lyle to Kentucky who is, as we speak, playing in the Final Four yet again, and Goodlick recruitment was a huge battle. You win some you lose some. I don't think it's a reflection of the coaching or recruiting.


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[KelleyHoosh 2,263]

How do you know IU/Crean are struggling? Players check out ALL options before choosing a school most of the time.

That dude Maten from Michigan just chose Georiga over Michigan State and IU. Does that mean Michigan State is also struggling?

The reality is, these guys are high schoolers who weren't even born in '87 and were probably too young to remember 2002. The 'it's IU' bit doesn't work with all of these players. My hope is that guys like Vic and Cody continue to develop and act as sort of the blueprint on what can happen when you come play ball for IU and Crean.

For now, I'm pretty happy with what Crean has done with the 2014 class.. You can't really blame Crean for losing Lyle to Kentucky who is, as we speak, playing in the Final Four yet again, and Goodlick recruitment was a huge battle. You win some you lose some. I don't think it's a reflection of the coaching or recruiting.


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How do I know IU is struggling? Um...... look at our recruiting class? Look what we are talking about? Its blind optimism to say we aren't struggling. We have 3 open scholarships and its April. No big men. We can't recruit a big to save our lives this cycle and 2015 isnt looking much better. 

 

Michigan State isn't struggling because they missed on Maten, he was a backup plan for them and they are stocked. Us missing on him means more than them missing on him because he was one of our main targets and we don't have a lot of options. They are fine either way. 

 

I am the same age as these recruits, probably not half the student of the game that recruits who are playing at the next level are, and I appreciate the aura of IU. I was raised in a basketball house sure, but these kids have most likely done nothing but eat sleep and breathe ball the majority of their lives. They are able to appreciate the blue-blooded nature of IU. If we are pitching that or not, I don't know and nor do I care. I just want us to pull kids. 

 

I do think you can blame Crean for failing to keep an in state kid committed and losing him to a rival. Goodluck was by all accounts an IU lock until his visit. If you can't judge a coach by his ability to win recruiting battles, how are you supposed to judge him as a recruiter? Sure we have JB2 and ROJO but we could have been so much more. IU is a sleeping giant of a program. We need to be able to have a full roster at least for it to wake up. 

[Dunn Woods 92]

Izzo has really slipped on the recruiting trail

 

he beats us but aside from us he hasn't won any major recruiting battles lately

[bronkonagurski 894]

How do I know IU is struggling? Um...... look at our recruiting class? Look what we are talking about? Its blind optimism to say we aren't struggling. We have 3 open scholarships and its April. No big men. We can't recruit a big to save our lives this cycle and 2015 isnt looking much better. 

 

Michigan State isn't struggling because they missed on Maten, he was a backup plan for them and they are stocked. Us missing on him means more than them missing on him because he was one of our main targets and we don't have a lot of options. They are fine either way. 

 

I am the same age as these recruits, probably not half the student of the game that recruits who are playing at the next level are, and I appreciate the aura of IU. I was raised in a basketball house sure, but these kids have most likely done nothing but eat sleep and breathe ball the majority of their lives. They are able to appreciate the blue-blooded nature of IU. If we are pitching that or not, I don't know and nor do I care. I just want us to pull kids. 

 

I do think you can blame Crean for failing to keep an in state kid committed and losing him to a rival. Goodluck was by all accounts an IU lock until his visit. If you can't judge a coach by his ability to win recruiting battles, how are you supposed to judge him as a recruiter? Sure we have JB2 and ROJO but we could have been so much more. IU is a sleeping giant of a program. We need to be able to have a full roster at least for it to wake up. 

 

In fairness, we didn't have 3 open scholarships until March.  Prior to that, we had a full roster with the current 2014 kids in the fold.  Suddenly we are jumping into the fray on kids that we likely did not recruit very heavily, if at all during the entire process.  Having said that, sure I'd like to think throwing our name into the hat would overwhelm the recruiting efforts of a South Carolina or Georgia.  I don't know what to make of it yet.  It isn't like we are missing on huge talents at this stage but certainly the larger importance is in filling out the roster again after the departures. 

 

In the final analysis we certainly could have done a lot better with the 2014 class (and bear in mind I'm perfectly happy with JB2 and Rojo) but the 2014 class, in particular the Indiana kids, has been a bit of a strange bird. 

[NotTheReal HoosierHoopster 67]

How do you know IU/Crean are struggling? Players check out ALL options before choosing a school most of the time.

That dude Maten from Michigan just chose Georiga over Michigan State and IU. Does that mean Michigan State is also struggling?

The reality is, these guys are high schoolers who weren't even born in '87 and were probably too young to remember 2002. The 'it's IU' bit doesn't work with all of these players. My hope is that guys like Vic and Cody continue to develop and act as sort of the blueprint on what can happen when you come play ball for IU and Crean.

For now, I'm pretty happy with what Crean has done with the 2014 class.. You can't really blame Crean for losing Lyle to Kentucky who is, as we speak, playing in the Final Four yet again, and Goodlick recruitment was a huge battle. You win some you lose some. I don't think it's a reflection of the coaching or recruiting.


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The reality is, Crean is struggling badly not only with recruiting but wlitj the perception of his entire program.

Rojo and Blackmon committed before the season unfolded. Hoetzel was a big reach that was taken because nobody else wanted to come.

How is 2015 looking? I know Peegs said not to expect a top 60 level recruit until after NEXT season. What does he know though? ;)

By the way, this actually started with the Syracuse game. Not just losing in the sweet 16 with two top four picks but looking absolutely lost the entire game. That's when the murmurs started.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,393]

Hot damn. What a mess. What I'd pay to be a fly on the wall in Crean's office? Would love to know WTH is going on. Or not going on.

The Max signing after GO and Pinson left us at the alter is pretty telling IMO. Not getting Devin Robinson or any of the other top notch players. Or lesser ones like Ahmed Hill, Lourawls Nairn, Anthony Lee, Marvin Clark, Yant Maten. I could seriously keep naming guys of different calibers.

WHY?

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,393]

I hope he has some crazy master plan up his sleeve with Jucos and grad transfers.

[Bowhunter 2,694]

Well look on the bright side, we will have a new coach.

[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

[quote name="KelleyHoosh" post="57764" timestamp="1396747837"]How do I know IU is struggling? Um...... look at our recruiting class? Look what we are talking about? Its blind optimism to say we aren't struggling. We have 3 open scholarships and its April. No big men. We can't recruit a big to save our lives this cycle and 2015 isnt looking much better.

Michigan State isn't struggling because they missed on Maten, he was a backup plan for them and they are stocked. Us missing on him means more than them missing on him because he was one of our main targets and we don't have a lot of options. They are fine either way.

I am the same age as these recruits, probably not half the student of the game that recruits who are playing at the next level are, and I appreciate the aura of IU. I was raised in a basketball house sure, but these kids have most likely done nothing but eat sleep and breathe ball the majority of their lives. They are able to appreciate the blue-blooded nature of IU. If we are pitching that or not, I don't know and nor do I care. I just want us to pull kids.

I do think you can blame Crean for failing to keep an in state kid committed and losing him to a rival. Goodluck was by all accounts an IU lock until his visit. If you can't judge a coach by his ability to win recruiting battles, how are you supposed to judge him as a recruiter? Sure we have JB2 and ROJO but we could have been so much more. IU is a sleeping giant of a program. We need to be able to have a full roster at least for it to wake up. [/quote]

Ok.. Let's start from the top. Look at the recruiting class? Ok let's do it. 2 top 50 guards. Both were heavily recruited by high majors. Two of the best shooters in the country. Hotzel? Don't know much about him but an extra three point assassin? I'll take it.

So Michigan State doesn't land a guy they offered a scholarship to, and it's ok because he was a backup? Have you looked at their 2014 recruiting class? Indiana has a way more solid group of guys coming in. Michigan State is also losing a ton of talent..

You're the same age as these recruits and were like you said, born into an Indiana basketball family. Can't you see that that's not how most of these recruits were raised? The "allure" of Indiana basketball just isn't there with most of these guys. Recruiting classes like The fab 5 and Duke's 2014 class just don't happen often. By all accounts last year's IU CLASS, on paper, as reported by all the recruiting agencies, wasn't far behind Kentucky'a but it just didn't work out as planned. Crean has consistently landed talent.

So you blame Crean for a 17-18 year old kid changing his mind and deciding to go to a school where the team is consistently in the final 4, has won multiple championships in his lifetime, and probably gets all the money and women he could possibly dream of. Not to mention has put like 90% of his players in the NBA. Why wouldn't any kid want to be a part of that?

I believe Crean will add a few more guys to fill the roster. But really, none of them will see the floor. How many teams go 13 deep? No good ones.. In terms of 2015, let's see how it pans out. IU is in the mix with several top 100 guys. Why the doom and gloom? I don't get it. Let's have realistic expectations and look at what we have for 2014...

One of the best pg's in the country, one of the best shooters in the country coming out of high school, an athletic freak who needs to add a jump shot, a couple mix and match big men, who really only need to rebound and block shots... I could go on and on but I feel like I've already proven my point.


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[Myrmidon76 614]

Crean deserves the flak for the recruiting failures, but we do have a "Director of Recruiting" who has somehow NOT been looked at as part of the recruiting failures. This is his only job people. Its all he is supposed to do.

[KelleyHoosh 2,263]

Ok.. Let's start from the top. Look at the recruiting class? Ok let's do it. 2 top 50 guards. Both were heavily recruited by high majors. Two of the best shooters in the country. Hotzel? Don't know much about him but an extra three point assassin? I'll take it.

So Michigan State doesn't land a guy they offered a scholarship to, and it's ok because he was a backup? Have you looked at their 2014 recruiting class? Indiana has a way more solid group of guys coming in. Michigan State is also losing a ton of talent..

You're the same age as these recruits and were like you said, born into an Indiana basketball family. Can't you see that that's not how most of these recruits were raised? The "allure" of Indiana basketball just isn't there with most of these guys. Recruiting classes like The fab 5 and Duke's 2014 class just don't happen often. By all accounts last year's IU CLASS, on paper, as reported by all the recruiting agencies, wasn't far behind Kentucky'a but it just didn't work out as planned. Crean has consistently landed talent.

So you blame Crean for a 17-18 year old kid changing his mind and deciding to go to a school where the team is consistently in the final 4, has won multiple championships in his lifetime, and probably gets all the money and women he could possibly dream of. Not to mention has put like 90% of his players in the NBA. Why wouldn't any kid want to be a part of that?

I believe Crean will add a few more guys to fill the roster. But really, none of them will see the floor. How many teams go 13 deep? No good ones.. In terms of 2015, let's see how it pans out. IU is in the mix with several top 100 guys. Why the doom and gloom? I don't get it. Let's have realistic expectations and look at what we have for 2014...

One of the best pg's in the country, one of the best shooters in the country coming out of high school, an athletic freak who needs to add a jump shot, a couple mix and match big men, who really only need to rebound and block shots... I could go on and on but I feel like I've already proven my point.


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We can argue back and forth, we obviously aren't going to change one anothers mind. And thats fine!

 

I want to thank you for the debate, its fun thinking deeply into this type of thing. Please don't misconstrue this as me trying to fight with you, I just enjoyed the debate. 

 

Go Hoosiers!

[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

[quote name="KelleyHoosh" post="57908" timestamp="1396794810"]We can argue back and forth, we obviously aren't going to change one anothers mind. And thats fine!

I want to thank you for the debate, its fun thinking deeply into this type of thing. Please don't misconstrue this as me trying to fight with you, I just enjoyed the debate.

Go Hoosiers![/quote]

No hard feelings. Agreed. I'm just hoping this program gets back to where it used to be but trying to stay tempered in my expectations. Go IU!


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