Transfer Portal w/IU Interest

[WRSMick55]

3 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

I’m not sure that calms anybody?   Since it’s gonna be hard to do.  Wish they were convinced they had a plan.  
 

Feels like we have another built in excuse in the making 

Or an objective in the making.

[Stuhoo]

1 hour ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

The roster isn’t as good as they think it is. 

How good do they think it is?

I’m thinking it is 11-9 or 12-8 conference record and 6-9 seed good.

That’d be pretty good, especially if most of the same group returned for a second year at IU the year after.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

35 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Highly unlikely it’s a championship quality roster, but it’s better than what I’m used to or expected.

Having to find 12 players for $20m isn’t as easy as one would think!

Glad we had money to spend.  We didn’t spend 20 yet though, did we?  Maybe we did.

AS 4.5

Burton 3

Yigi 2.5-3

Mustaf 1.5

Lindsay 1.5

Sisley 1

Harris 1 

3 Freshman 1 to 1.5.  

17?  
 

It’s better.  It has holes.   We have 3 spots. Let’s find a way to improve.  It’s an expensive sport these days.  A 5 star freshman like Thompson would have been nice on this roster.  Or a proven SG.  Or a stretch 4.  Some bargain guys came off the board that didn’t have big price tags. Like the USC guy added today. 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

1 minute ago, Stuhoo said:

How good do they think it is?

 

1 minute ago, Stuhoo said:

How good do they think it is?

Good enough to not need impact players with 3 scholarships left. 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

2 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

How good do they think it is?

I’m thinking it is 11-9 or 12-8 conference record and 6-9 seed good.

That’d be pretty good, especially if most of the same group returned for a second year at IU the year after.

The second year thing is enticing. But one thing in the NIL era and as an IU fan, be careful projecting ahead.  Have to take care of business first or no one will bother. 

[Home Jersey]

17 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Glad we had money to spend.  We didn’t spend 20 yet though, did we?  Maybe we did.

AS 4.5

Burton 3

Yigi 2.5-3

Mustaf 1.5

Lindsay 1.5

Sisley 1

Harris 1 

3 Freshman 1 to 1.5.  

17?  
 

It’s better.  It has holes.   We have 3 spots. Let’s find a way to improve.  It’s an expensive sport these days.  A 5 star freshman like Thompson would have been nice on this roster.  Or a proven SG.  Or a stretch 4.  Some bargain guys came off the board that didn’t have big price tags. Like the USC guy added today. 

I'm with you here for the most part. I do think we probably are very close to 20M though 

• Sherrell 4.5
• Burton 3.5
• Yig 3-3.5
• Mustaf 1.5
• Lindsay 2.5
• Sisley 2 (I'm thinking he got a nice retention bump) 
• Harris 1.5
• Freshmen 1

That's 19.5-20M... I think Yig and Lindsay got sweet deals committing without a visit. Just speculation from me. 

We should definitely look to improve the team with the remaining 3 spots. I say remaining because they're not the "last" roster spots. Minimally need one capable of playing 8/9th man minutes. Hoping for some Euro lotto tickets to hit. 

[ronzo4IU]

12 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

How good do they think it is?

I’m thinking it is 11-9 or 12-8 conference record and 6-9 seed good.

That’d be pretty good, especially if most of the same group returned for a second year at IU the year after.

I would think that adding a GM from the NBA to the roster at IU would be shooting for challenging for a NC?

This seems like…?

i could be happy though with true dogs that leave blood sweat and tears out on every floor.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

6 minutes ago, ronzo4IU said:

I would think that adding a GM from the NBA to the roster at IU would be shooting for challenging for a NC?

This seems like…?

i could be happy though with true dogs that leave blood sweat and tears out on every floor.

Have to set the bar low enough so we can maybe surpass it. There’s  Always a reason we won’t be that good and usually most excuses are based off previous seasons failures.  A convenient way to keep expectations down.   
 

We are paying to be a 6 seed or better.  Thats the resource allocation. That should be the expectation. 

[Home Jersey]

3 minutes ago, ronzo4IU said:

I would think that adding a GM from the NBA to the roster at IU would be shooting for challenging for a NC?

This seems like…?

i could be happy though with true dogs that leave blood sweat and tears out on every floor.

Year 2 is a complete rebuild.

The DDV era is going to be like year 1 B.C. (before Ryan Carr) and year 1 A.D. (after Ryan Carr) lol.

Hiring Ryan Carr is definitely a big move to turnaround IUBB after decades of mismanagement. 

~$20M is an extremely competitive budget, so the resources are there. Unfortunately, it's a complete rebuild. 

Hoosier fans love their basketball so much. Us hardcore fans on the message boards are basically masochists for being this invested in a program that's been as bad as IU over the last quarter century.

Whether we are top 10-15 or top 20 spenders on the roster it's impressive given the awful results on the court.

We're spreading that budget over 12 new players and probably paid up to retain Sisley.

Hopefully year 1 A.R.C. provides a solid foundation for next year so we can be more efficient with our player payroll and use the portal to really elevate the program's ceiling. Year 2 A.R.C hopefully we are on a clear trajectory to compete for a B10 title and make a run in March. With the portal and the budget I think that's not too much to ask. 

[str8baller]

8 hours ago, Home Jersey said:

Sisley 2 (I'm thinking he got a nice retention bump) 

Nobody really knows the market but I’d hope like heck we’re not paying Sisley $2M. He was an end of the rotation guy who surely couldn’t have gotten a million anywhere else. 
 

 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

13 minutes ago, str8baller said:

Nobody really knows the market but I’d hope like heck we’re not paying Sisley $2M. He was an end of the rotation guy who surely couldn’t have gotten a million anywhere else. 
 

 

It’s funny because the argument last summer was it’s so cheap to keep guys on the roster.  Now they are getting massive retention bumps.  
 

I do admit it’s generally cheaper to keep a player, but if that player and their camp is about money it’s going to end being a number in the similar ballpark. And that was my stance last year.  And that assumes the player is happy with things. 
 

The real advantage is the advanced scout.  You know exactly what your getting from said player when they’ve been on your team. No question marks. 
 

 But financially it’s not the savings many project.  I don’t know what Sisley. My guess is he got 300 or so last year. My guess is a million would be an appropriately huge bump.  He’s a borderline starter but not a guaranteed starter. Shows potential but didn’t get the chances to demonstrate. He’s the perfect keep candidate player because the staff knows all. 

Edited Friday at 10:51 AM by WayneFleekHoosier

[Home Jersey]

53 minutes ago, str8baller said:

Nobody really knows the market but I’d hope like heck we’re not paying Sisley $2M. He was an end of the rotation guy who surely couldn’t have gotten a million anywhere else. 
 

 

Maybe 1.5 ... projects as the 6th or 7th man on this team. The only player retained. IU fan growing up. The rumor Michigan was after him. Optics of him leaving would have been terrible. I'm sure his camp knew that and was able to get a very healthy bump. Just guessing of course. Either way I think the budget is close to tapped at this point

[Pagoda]

1 hour ago, str8baller said:

Nobody really knows the market but I’d hope like heck we’re not paying Sisley $2M. He was an end of the rotation guy who surely couldn’t have gotten a million anywhere else. 

I'd hope Sisley is closer to $1M.  I can barely remember, but I thought Woody threw a nonchalant $500-750K offer at him back during his recruitment and Painter was mad about it.  So if he was ~$500-750K last year he get's a bump to ~$1M or something.

I dunno, just a guess.

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

Wang commits to UMass as has been expected.

[Pagoda]

Agree the roster continuity/advanced scout is the most important benefit with retention.

But I wouldn't downplay the savings.  If the player is happy -- the program is winning, they're developing, and they're comfortable with staff/program and their life/future, it's going to take some pretty lucrative tampering to shake them loose such that they give all that up and hit the unknown in the portal.  $100K or even $250K may not do it.  So there is that angle to the savings.  The other thing is replacing a lost player is so damn expensive in the hyper competitive portal.   I think good retention saves 15-20% across the whole roster, which lets a team afford another impact player.

Also, the other way to save on the roster is to develop guys.  If they get better they're still on the same money, at least for one year.

It's all a flywheel.  (1) Recruit bad, mediocre development, lose too much, roster turnover up, players cost more.  (2) Or recruit well, develop well, win more, roster turnover low, players cost less (relative to their skill).  

IUBB needs to get on the positive flywheel ASAP.

[Pagoda]

10 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

We are paying to be a 6 seed or better.  Thats the resource allocation. That should be the expectation. 

Agree.  Close to $20M spend when it's all done, plus this huge expensive staff, you've just got to deliver a six seed or better.  Or else why are we spending all this money?  If they can't do this and there were no serious injuries, I just cannot see a case for this staff being the right one that's ever going to do anything here.

Hopefully this staff hits their stride this year...

[str8baller]

39 minutes ago, Pagoda said:

But I wouldn't downplay the savings.  If the player is happy -- the program is winning, they're developing, and they're comfortable with staff/program and their life/future, it's going to take some pretty lucrative tampering to shake them loose such that they give all that up and hit the unknown in the portal.  $100K or even $250K may not do it.

This is the key. It’s not happening at IU because there’s no team or culture to retain them to. Yet anyways. 

[Dave from Dayton]

1 hour ago, Pagoda said:

Agree.  Close to $20M spend when it's all done, plus this huge expensive staff, you've just got to deliver a six seed or better.  Or else why are we spending all this money?  If they can't do this and there were no serious injuries, I just cannot see a case for this staff being the right one that's ever going to do anything here.

Hopefully this staff hits their stride this year...

On the surface, if all things were clear cost/benefit...  The above reasoning that 'we' are spending and IU needs 'to deliver a six seed or better' seems appropriate.  Except for the apparent mandate that the team and coaches just have to deliver a six seed.  (Or else 'we' won't gift NIL.)

As we saw with Woody and his teams, they didn't deliver.  And we still get an estimated $20 million.  Football success probably had a lot to do with it.

I wonder about this.  Gifts to athletics are motivated by all sorts of wants and desires.  Some may be because of gratitude for one reason or another.

I have all sorts of questions about the process.  Some may never get answered.  

I don't question that student/athletes deserve pay. 

Gifts are an interesting source of NIL.  Gifts to university athletics are generally not directly part of Name, Image, and Likeness (NIL) because NCAA rules prohibit institutions from paying athletes directly. However, donations to NIL collectives—separate, supporter-run entities—are the primary funding source for athlete NIL deals, representing 70-80% of revenue.

Seems to me that there are no musts to deliver.  Coaches get paid oodles whether they deliver or not...per their contracts.  Students get their $$$ regardless.

There is little or no control or feedback about winning.  Moral suasion, pride, doing a job well...and future opportunities...yes.  

That seems to me to disconnect from fans gifting to NIL and athletics. I am not questioning that it appears that $20 million in NIL appears to be in the range of a middle seed in the NCAAT.  Although that is obviously subject to debate.

In economics, it appears to me to be almost perfect inelasticity between how much NIL is funded by fans depending on performance in previous years.   Football, those that have disposable funds and, of course, businesses marketing, all are wild cards in this.

 

[Pryght]

13 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

The roster isn’t as good as they think it is. And they are wishcasting quite a bit in the development department. 

We’ll be competitive this year and likely in the fringe Top 25 conversation. Considering where the program has been, we’re clearly moving in the right direction.

With our entire roster having at least two years of eligibility remaining, the plan is to retain the core of this group, invest in keeping our top talent, and address weaknesses through next year’s transfer portal. That should position us to take another step forward and potentially become a Top 15 team in 2027-2028.

This is a progression, and the foundation is being built the right way.

[Shooter]

12 hours ago, ronzo4IU said:

I would think that adding a GM from the NBA to the roster at IU would be shooting for challenging for a NC?

This seems like…?

i could be happy though with true dogs that leave blood sweat and tears out on every floor.

We haven't made it to the second weekend in ten years. Haven't made a Final Four in 25 years. Our new coach has never won a tournament game. Yes our long term goal is to build a championship level program, but challenging for a NC this season is not a reasonable goal.

If this is a top 20 team, with a chance to return most/all of our significant contributors in '27-28 - that would be a big success IMO.