TOM CREAN FIRED

[biteoftheapple]

If Troy takes advantage of the new rules, and gets himself evaluated, he could return. I am not hopeful, although.

[HoosierAloha]

Watfordish....but with hops?

 

I would take a CWat at the 4 everyday of the week.

[X-Hoosier]

Not many teams play with a traditional 4...

And teams are playing Ben Simmons, Brandon Ingram, Jalen Brown, Caleb Swanigan, Deyonta Davis, Robert Carter, Perry Ellis... and so on.

[Brass Cannon]

If Troy takes advantage of the new rules, and gets himself evaluated, he could return. I am not hopeful, although.

Not sure I want him to return

[HoosierAloha]

And teams are playing Ben Simmons, Brandon Ingram, Jalen Brown, Caleb Swanigan, Deyonta Davis, Robert Carter, Perry Ellis... and so on.

 

Ingram, Carter, and Ellis are pretty much the dictionary definition of stretch 4.  Davis plays a lot with Costello who can step out and knockdown the open jumper.  Swanigan attempts to play on the perimeter.  Haven't really seen Brown.  Simmons is more of a point forward who can beat his man off the dribble...

 

Not sure of your point here

[Hovadipo]

If either DD or TB can stretch the floor and defend on the perimeter that could be a huge front line. If not I think we see Hartman or OG at the "4" or both of them at the 3/4. I guess a lot depends on Troy.

DD has a pretty nice midrange game as far as I've seen/heard. Not sure that he'll be a 3 shooter, but knocks down the 15 footer pretty regularly.

[HoosierAloha]

DD has a pretty nice midrange game as far as I've seen/heard. Not sure that he'll be a 3 shooter, but knocks down the 15 footer pretty regularly.

 

That's definitely a start.  I don't think either needs to be a great 3 point shooter but with what Crean regularly tries to do would be difficult with two bigs spending the majority of their time in the paint.  Does he have good foot speed to guard on the perimeter?  I'm not saying DD won't start at the 4 next season.  I'm saying it's unlikely unless he's more of a stretch 4. 

[X-Hoosier]

Ingram, Carter, and Ellis are pretty much the dictionary definition of stretch 4. Davis plays a lot with Costello who can step out and knockdown the open jumper. Swanigan attempts to play on the perimeter. Haven't really seen Brown. Simmons is more of a point forward who can beat his man off the dribble...

Not sure of your point here

Just some good 4's out there.

[X-Hoosier]

That's definitely a start. I don't think either needs to be a great 3 point shooter but with what Crean regularly tries to do would be difficult with two bigs spending the majority of their time in the paint. Does he have good foot speed to guard on the perimeter? I'm not saying DD won't start at the 4 next season. I'm saying it's unlikely unless he's more of a stretch 4.

If Crean is still around... it'd be interesting to see if he can actually adjust to a roster for once.

[mdn82]

And teams are playing Ben Simmons, Brandon Ingram, Jalen Brown, Caleb Swanigan, Deyonta Davis, Robert Carter, Perry Ellis... and so on.

So a 5 star stretch 4 or point forward? Not exactly traditional by any stretch.

[X-Hoosier]

So a 5 star stretch 4 or point forward? Not exactly traditional by any stretch.

They aren't traditional. But why would we start Hartman over Davis? Hartman isn't talented enough to go ahead and sharpie his name into the lineup. Honestly when it comes to next year... Bryant and Williams are the only two.. if they come back.

[HoosierAloha]

They aren't traditional. But why would we start Hartman over Davis? Hartman isn't talented enough to go ahead and sharpie his name into the lineup. Honestly when it comes to next year... Bryant and Williams are the only two.. if they come back.

 

You're removing a two year starter in RoJo from the starting lineup?  Ditto for Hartman?  It's not always about talent, as we've seen.  Team chemistry, including not always needing the ball on offense, willingness to understand and play defense coming into deciding starters.  JBJ if he comes back healthy? 

[mdn82]

They aren't traditional. But why would we start Hartman over Davis? Hartman isn't talented enough to go ahead and sharpie his name into the lineup. Honestly when it comes to next year... Bryant and Williams are the only two.. if they come back.

Senior Hartman > Freshman Davis from a stability standpoint. Plus he will give our team what we need. The ability to knock down a jumper. I think you are underestimating what that does in the lane for Bryant my young padawa. Plus that gives more flexibility with the minutes down low which we will need.

[HoosierAloha]

If Crean is still around... it'd be interesting to see if he can actually adjust to a roster for once.

 

Without knowing how the returners develop and how the newcomers games fit with the returners it's hard to determine what the strengths of the team will be.  I wouldn't mind seeing OG as the starting 4 with some development.  I wouldn't mind bringing Davis in off the bench and sometimes going big with OG at the 3 and DD/TB down low.  It should be interesting to see how it all plays out.

[X-Hoosier]

You're removing a two year starter in RoJo from the starting lineup? Ditto for Hartman? It's not always about talent, as we've seen. Team chemistry, including not always needing the ball on offense, willingness to understand and play defense coming into deciding starters. JBJ if he comes back healthy?

You can win a lot in CBB just off talent alone. But we'll have a crunch with guards. RJ, JBJ, Jones are all SG's that can play the 2-3 spot. Jones isn't going to play PG. Obviously JBJ wont because he won't pass. RJ is a turnover machine. So start RJ or JBJ? Can't start both. We've seen how bad that is. For Hartman.. we'll have DD, OG, Morgan and possibly Williams all fighting for the 3 or 4 spot...

[KingPG21]

And teams are playing Ben Simmons, Brandon Ingram, Jalen Brown, Caleb Swanigan, Deyonta Davis, Robert Carter, Perry Ellis... and so on.

Did you just insinuate that Simmons is a traditional 4? Cause yeah, he isn't anywhere close to being a traditional 4. 

[NoahW35]

Did you just insinuate that Simmons is a traditional 4? Cause yeah, he isn't anywhere close to being a traditional 4.

neither is Ingram or Brown

[HoosierAloha]

You can win a lot in CBB just off talent alone. But we'll have a crunch with guards. RJ, JBJ, Jones are all SG's that can play the 2-3 spot. Jones isn't going to play PG. Obviously JBJ wont because he won't pass. RJ is a turnover machine. So start RJ or JBJ? Can't start both. We've seen how bad that is. For Hartman.. we'll have DD, OG, Morgan and possibly Williams all fighting for the 3 or 4 spot...

 

If RoJo is a turnover machine, second highest ATO ratio, what is Troy? 

 

I agree you can win a lot off talent alone.  You can also have a ton of talent on the floor who all need the ball on offense and can't defend a chair.  We've seen how much that talent couldn't win against Wake (1 win in the ACC), UNLV (where talent is running for the exits), and completely blown out @Duke. 

 

Next season we will have a lot of talent, experience, and experienced talent.  I'm guessing we will see that in the starting lineup.  If Hartman is asked to come off the bench I'm sure he'll come in giving his all.  I don't think just because DD is a high 4* PF means he's guaranteed a starting spot.  I do think it's more likely we will see returning starters back in the starting lineup, Crean seems to do that.

[biteoftheapple]

It seems clear the X man, just wants to argue, he spouts things as s fact that isnt close to truth. I just ignore the trolls.

[X-Hoosier]

Senior Hartman > Freshman Davis from a stability standpoint. Plus he will give our team what we need. The ability to knock down a jumper. I think you are underestimating what that does in the lane for Bryant my young padawa. Plus that gives more flexibility with the minutes down low which we will need.

I don't think Hartman is truly needed on the floor. He almost cancels himself out at times. He doesn't score much. He'll spot when open. He hustles as much as his athleticism will allow him. He turns the ball over quite often for not really handling the ball. He's not a good defender but that deals more with his athleticism. He knows what to do on defense.. but he doesn't have the athleticism or length to do it exact. It'd be nice if we could join Hartman and Williams together... that'd really help.