Indiana vs Duke Game Thread

[BlueDevil 8,877]

If we can get some early shots to fall, we'll have a great showing. I don't know that it will be good enough to win (though, I took us in the pick'ems) but we will definitely be there the whole time. If we have trouble early starting our offense, we won't start our defense and we'll be massacred.

Cameron is one of the (or the) hardest places to win on the road. The crowd is incredible, the design of the arena makes them right in the player's faces, and the students are outrageous. Duke will be pumped up, we'll be pumped up, it's going to be huge.

Duke's biggest weakness is the 3 on both ends of the court. They also like to play slow. I want to see us forcing them to speed up and moving the ball to open up 3s when we can't find an open lane. And to force them to take more 3s than they would like. If we can get them to do that, we can win or at least seriously compete.

The trouble is, Duke hasn't faced a team like us so it's hard to predict.

You touched on some really good points. Do think Kentucky sped us up some in Chicago that gave us some problems. This is a very intriguing game no matter what anyone says. I think the game will start off very sloppy before someone or both teams settle in.

[coonhounds 9,513]

I'm making the drive to Cameron tomorrow morning from Btown! Can't wait!!

hope we show up and play good for your sake. Enjoy the game I am jealous

[Class of '66 Old Fart 86,204]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..."      http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

 

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,985]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..." http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

THIS!!!! Speaks volumes. Also should be duplicated into the Fire Crean thread.

[Feathery 4,005]

Defense always travels, but we don't really play defense. Duke rolls by 10 plus.

[Feathery 4,005]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..." http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

Wow.... That's all I got.

[coonhounds 9,513]

We have saved up all our luck on the road for tomorrow night

[coonhounds 9,513]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..." http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

so we must have been great on the road before 2011? Lol I doubt that

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..."      http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

 

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

Not to downplay this too much, since I think you're right to be concerned based on these stats. But, the way we remove random years makes everything so muddled.

 

If people generally agree the first three years don't count, then 2011 should not be included. We only won 12 games that year, so no surprise our 11 road games were not wins. I don't understand why you would remove 2012-13 either. I guess because it is interesting to see the 0 there. 5 or 6 of the 0-16 are from 2011 too.

 

I think we're terrible on the road or neutral courts, I think that tells us a lot about how the team is coached and develops, I don't know these numbers are very honest portrayals though.

 

You touched on some really good points. Do think Kentucky sped us up some in Chicago that gave us some problems. This is a very intriguing game no matter what anyone says. I think the game will start off very sloppy before someone or both teams settle in.

Kentucky and Duke actually favor the same tempo. The level of competition was high enough to never seem slow though. And, neither are slow teams, they both play exactly average tempos, likely slowed some because when you're actually playing defense the opposing possessions are longer while they look for a shot.

 

I'm optimistic about the game, I can see routes where we can win, but realistically I don't expect us to win. But, who wants to be negative and already count it as a loss? That's no way to live.

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

so we must have been great on the road before 2011? Lol I doubt that

We won 2 away games and 1 neutral court game during Crean's first two years (before 2011). Of course, we only won 16 games total those years, so that's like, 18.75% of our wins.

[Class of '66 Old Fart 86,204]

Numbers are numbers and you can bend them, fold them and shape them into any form you want.  Economists and politicians make a living doing just that all the time. 

[Striper 192]

Think I'm just going to re-watch the 2002 sweet 16 game instead. That will be a much happier experience.

I am warming up for the game by watching "I Hate Christian Laettner", because I do.

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

Numbers are numbers and you can bend them, fold them and shape them into any form you want. Economists and politicians make a living doing just that all the time.

Yes. That was my exact point to whomever posted those numbers initially.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,985]

Yes. That was my exact point to whomever posted those numbers initially.

not too much "number bending" going on there IMO. Included Creans third year which was a bad year but we should have been better. Included 2 of Creans best years ever. Pretty fair set of numbers.

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

not too much "number bending" going on there IMO. Included Creans third year which was a bad year but we should have been better. Included 2 of Creans best years ever. Pretty fair set of numbers.

I mean, it all depends on how you define a "fair" set of numbers right? The presentation of statistics especially with conscious decisions to remove particular years almost always has some sort of bias or 'bending". The only way to avoid it is to present a complete data set.

 

So, the question is ultimately whether 2011 is reflective of Crean's coaching on the road or if the games were unwinnable no matter where they were played. (1) Ohio State beat us by both 18 and 19 at home and on the road respectively in 2011. Did being on the road have an effect or was it just the game? They beat (19) Illinois at home by 3 and then lost to Illinois on the road by 24 that year. That's a home/away disparity worth talking about. They dominated (26) Michigan by 17 at home and then went up north and lost by 4. Interesting stuff. Overall, in Big Ten play they were 0-9 away and 3-6 at home. 

 

Does including those statistics paint a more complete picture or do they distort the picture some? Distortions don't always make a picture less useful, especially if you know to look for them.

 

And if you aren't willing to look at the statistics more closely, then what's the point?

[coonhounds 9,513]

I would have to see what other schools top 25 road wins numbers are before I drawl to big of conclusion because let's face it it isn't easy to beat a quality team on the road. That being said we should be better

[Brass Cannon 24,978]

From Assembly Call - "Cover Your Eyes..."      http://assemblycall.com/indiana-v-top-25-teams-on-road-under-crean/

 

Capsule summary of how we've fared as a road team since 2011 and it ain't pretty.

• Overall road record v top-25 teams: 4-16
• Overall road record v top-25 teams outside of 2012-13 season: 0-16
• Average margin of defeat in 16 losses: 14.6 points
• Overall road record against all opponents: 17-33
• Overall road record against all opponents outside of 2012-13 season: 10-31

We really have to play to near perfection if we're going to end Duke's home streak and get a W.

Wow I am even shocked at this and I have been down on our situation the last few years.

[Bobman1 2,909]

I am warming up for the game by watching "I Hate Christian Laettner", because I do.

The next time we play Duke after Wednesday. I will do the same but with "I hate Grayson Allen".

[Feathery 4,005]

I would have to see what other schools top 25 road wins numbers are before I drawl to big of conclusion because let's face it it isn't easy to beat a quality team on the road. That being said we should be better

Does it matter what they are? Do we want to be just another top 25 team? Which we aren't even that right now. Or do we want to be elite? Elite teams don't lose that much on the road or neutral sites.

[coonhounds 9,513]

Does it matter what they are? Do we want to be just another top 25 team? Which we aren't even that right now. Or do we want to be elite? Elite teams don't lose that much on the road or neutral sites.

I guess just curious to see how far off we are.