College Bball Thread

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Yeah the winning combination has been and will continue to be to recruit the best 3-4 year players you can while adding an elite recruit here or there without forcing players out. Especially if OAD comes to an end. The Calipari and now Duke formula only has a shot with these elite talents that are so far ahead of the rest that they can overcome the experience gap, but even then the tournament is still unpredictable.


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[hoosierbgh 1,264]

9 hours ago, AKHoosier said:

Anyone who thinks our fans cost us Keion Brooks, here is exhibit A on how all fanbases have their idiots

Of course other fan bases have their idiots but the fact that UK fans act like idiots frequently shouldn't be used as an excuse for IU fans to act like idiots. UK fans should be example of what to avoid not to emulate. 

If there is any chance that the behavior of fans online could negatively effect recruiting then why take the chance? Is acting like an idiot online so important to some that it is worth any potential risk? is constantly b******* and moaning about everything online so enjoyable that it must be pursued at all potential costs?  Is it really that hard to practice a little self control and not act like UK fans?

[Alford Bailey 12,356]

3 hours ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Yeah the winning combination has been and will continue to be to recruit the best 3-4 year players you can while adding an elite recruit here or there without forcing players out. Especially if OAD comes to an end. The Calipari and now Duke formula only has a shot with these elite talents that are so far ahead of the rest that they can overcome the experience gap, but even then the tournament is still unpredictable.


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People tend to forget Cal had a senior Darius Miller on his only National Championship team. Wouldnt have won it without him.

[Free Jurkin! 1,496]

11 hours ago, Crimson and Cream said:

They could transfer seeking greener pastures elsewhere (pun not intended)

They could, but I would doubt it. Both of these guys want to make it to the NBA as quickly as possible, so sitting a year won't help that. Plus, the incoming recruits don't play their positions, so they should have plenty of playing time.

[pumpfake 3,930]

2 hours ago, Alford Bailey said:

People tend to forget Cal had a senior Darius Miller on his only National Championship team. Wouldnt have won it without him.

And according to a poster on the Big Blue Loonybin, he had the best college baketball player in history on that team.

[Old Friend 8,389]

11 hours ago, Uspshoosier said:

Get old and stay old. People actually argue with you that’s not the way to win big? Every coach besides K and Cal use this formula or try

https://www.mlive.com/spartans/2018/04/michigan_state_in_position_to_1.html

 

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Believe it or not.  I know on the old board and I believe here...  I have consistently commented that Indiana does not need to spend $600,000 a year to recruit basketball players (Crean did at the same time Bo Ryan was spending $65,000) because he was going after 5* kids from the east coast.  Kids who didn't know who Indiana was, and didn't care.  Only wanted a stepping stone to the NBA.   Crean has players IN the NBA, so he can get them there; and he's now doing the same thing at Georgia. 

That can be exciting if the players in question turn out to be special; but that formula (adding single players that don't fit with the rest of the team..see : Noah Vonleh, Romeo Langford, etc) generally doesn't win championships.   I got killed for saying Indiana should stay close to home and recruit 3-4 year kids because that's how you win consistently.  And that's where I am...I want to win consistently.  To be in the conversation for Big Ten titles every season.  I have little interest in winning one year and finishing 10th the next, as Crean did.   Many said "go get the best players you can, and it doesn't matter where they're from or how long they stay."   I backed off a bit on where kids are from, but I still say midwestern kids are coached better in high school.  

Anyway, yeah.  Lots of the "win now!" crowd wants the one year phenom's like Kentucky gets every season.   We will never be Duke and I really don't want to be.  

[theriverpilot 5,589]

12 hours ago, Crimson and Cream said:

Auburn is the second team ever to beat Kansas, UNC, and Kentucky in the same NCAA tournament (Arizona was the first)

And could've easily lost to New Mexico St in the opening round.

[Joe DeLow 1,278]

And according to a poster on the Big Blue Loonybin, he had the best college baketball player in history on that team.

I don’t know about best in history, but Anthony Davis was pretty darned good. MKG was a crazy good college player too. He destroyed us in both games.


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[Joe DeLow 1,278]

Believe it or not.  I know on the old board and I believe here...  I have consistently commented that Indiana does not need to spend $600,000 a year to recruit basketball players (Crean did at the same time Bo Ryan was spending $65,000) because he was going after 5* kids from the east coast.  Kids who didn't know who Indiana was, and didn't care.  Only wanted a stepping stone to the NBA.   Crean has players IN the NBA, so he can get them there; and he's now doing the same thing at Georgia. 
That can be exciting if the players in question turn out to be special; but that formula (adding single players that don't fit with the rest of the team..see : Noah Vonleh, Romeo Langford, etc) generally doesn't win championships.   I got killed for saying Indiana should stay close to home and recruit 3-4 year kids because that's how you win consistently.  And that's where I am...I want to win consistently.  To be in the conversation for Big Ten titles every season.  I have little interest in winning one year and finishing 10th the next, as Crean did.   Many said "go get the best players you can, and it doesn't matter where they're from or how long they stay."   I backed off a bit on where kids are from, but I still say midwestern kids are coached better in high school.  
Anyway, yeah.  Lots of the "win now!" crowd wants the one year phenom's like Kentucky gets every season.   We will never be Duke and I really don't want to be.  

Staying close to home won’t win us a title. Being like Wisconsin won’t make this fan base happy. Having the success of Kentucky, Duke, Kansas or UNC will. Wanting to be like Wisconsin is settling.


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[Free Jurkin! 1,496]

6 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

Staying close to home won’t win us a title. Being like Wisconsin won’t make this fan base happy. Having the success of Kentucky, Duke, Kansas or UNC will. Wanting to be like Wisconsin is settling.


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I think Roy has the perfect model at UNC, and he somehow doesn't get nearly the respect he deserves. UNC has had a lot more success than Duke in his time there, but Duke gets all the headlines. Roy specializes in finding stars and McD AAs who are often good enough to contribute as freshmen, but not quite good enough to be one and done, and so he always has a talented, experienced roster. Yes he has some one and dones (and this year he has 2), but it's mostly guys who stay 3-4 years, even though they were big time recruits. 

[Old Friend 8,389]

41 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

Staying close to home won’t win us a title. Being like Wisconsin won’t make this fan base happy. Having the success of Kentucky, Duke, Kansas or UNC will. Wanting to be like Wisconsin is settling.


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Unless you believe we can get better players / results at Indiana than Wisconsin.  Which I do.   Even if we didn't?  (The discussion I am referring to was when Bo Ryan was there, not now.  So let's make sure we get the reference right.)

Ryan coached at Wisconsin for 14 full seasons.  Here's all he did there :

* Never finished lower than 4th in the Big Ten

* Won 4 conference titles in 14 seasons

* Went to 7 Sweet 16's in 14 seasons

*  Went to 3 Elite 8's and 2 Final Fours in 14 seasons

* Won 73% of his games while coaching at Wisconsin

*  Really didn't recruit players much further away than Chicago.  Staying close to home and going further out for selected kids only has been a formula for success for MSU as well.  They currently have one active player outside the states of Michigan, Indiana, and Ohio.   

I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think most people here would "settle" for that.   You can go root for Kentucky if you want to.  That's not Indiana's culture, nor is it something Archie would do well; and I have no interest in it BEING Indiana's culture.   Being in the conversation and being in position to win are all anyone can ask for.    Kentucky won a couple under Pitino....with experienced teams. and has won one under Calipari.  Yeah..they're in the conversation every year, which is exactly what I'm saying.   Kansas won a bad conference for years and had plenty of success, but they too won just one title.  They were "in the conversation" every season which again....is what I want for Indiana.   Tell me how that's settling, again?  I'm not sure I follow.  

If your bar is "winning the NCAA Tournament," that's ridiculous.  Sorry..it is.  Do you believe the best 4 teams made the Final Four this season?  It takes so much to win a tournament like this...   First, a team has to stay healthy; which as we've seen is no small feat.  Then you line up everything else...    Wisconsin, Kansas, Kentucky....they were under Ryan/are in the conversation every season.    Indiana gets there?  I think our fans would be just fine.   And they would not think they were "settling."

[Joe DeLow 1,278]

I think Roy has the perfect model at UNC, and he somehow doesn't get nearly the respect he deserves. UNC has had a lot more success than Duke in his time there, but Duke gets all the headlines. Roy specializes in finding stars and McD AAs who are often good enough to contribute as freshmen, but not quite good enough to be one and done, and so he always has a talented, experienced roster. Yes he has some one and dones (and this year he has 2), but it's mostly guys who stay 3-4 years, even though they were big time recruits. 

It is good to find those Justin Jacksons in a class. Wayne Selden was supposed to be a one and done and stayed 3 years.


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[DChoosier 7,992]

11 minutes ago, Free Jurkin! said:

I think Roy has the perfect model at UNC, and he somehow doesn't get nearly the respect he deserves. UNC has had a lot more success than Duke in his time there, but Duke gets all the headlines. Roy specializes in finding stars and McD AAs who are often good enough to contribute as freshmen, but not quite good enough to be one and done, and so he always has a talented, experienced roster. Yes he has some one and dones (and this year he has 2), but it's mostly guys who stay 3-4 years, even though they were big time recruits. 

 Get your point, and agree his model is not like Dukes and UK’s, but Roy has tried like hell to get plenty of projected “one and dones” like Zion Williamson, Romeo, Brooks, Little (who he signed) and has also signed some projected one and dones that ended up being multiple year players.

[Free Jurkin! 1,496]

6 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

It is good to find those Justin Jacksons in a class. Wayne Selden was supposed to be a one and done and stayed 3 years.


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Joel Berry, Brice Johnson, Kennedy Meeks, Marcus Paige, Isaiah Hicks, Tyler Hansborough, etc.. Loaded with elite recruits who were perfect college players but didn't have exactly what the NBA was looking for

[HoosierHoops1 5,024]

40 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

Staying close to home won’t win us a title. Being like Wisconsin won’t make this fan base happy. Having the success of Kentucky, Duke, Kansas or UNC will. Wanting to be like Wisconsin is settling.


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Recruiting the midwest (which is staying close to home) is a huge part of our Championship history. We may have had a player here and there outside that footprint, but certainly not many.

Just a couple questions: How often does a final 4 not include a player from indiana? How often does UNC, Duke, Kentucky win a title without a Hoosier?

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,182]

Unless you believe we can get better players / results at Indiana than Wisconsin.  Which I do.   Even if we didn't?  (The discussion I am referring to was when Bo Ryan was there, not now.  So let's make sure we get the reference right.)
Ryan coached at Wisconsin for 14 full seasons.  Here's all he did there :
* Never finished lower than 4th in the Big Ten
* Won 4 conference titles in 14 seasons
* Went to 7 Sweet 16's in 14 seasons
*  Went to 3 Elite 8's and 2 Final Fours in 14 seasons
* Won 73% of his games while coaching at Wisconsin
*  Really didn't recruit players much further away than Chicago.  Staying close to home and going further out for selected kids only has been a formula for success for MSU as well.  They currently have one active player outside the states of Michigan, Indiana, and Ohio.   
I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think most people here would "settle" for that.   You can go root for Kentucky if you want to.  That's not Indiana's culture, nor is it something Archie would do well; and I have no interest in it BEING Indiana's culture.   Being in the conversation and being in position to win are all anyone can ask for.    Kentucky won a couple under Pitino....with experienced teams. and has won one under Calipari.  Yeah..they're in the conversation every year, which is exactly what I'm saying.   Kansas won a bad conference for years and had plenty of success, but they too won just one title.  They were "in the conversation" every season which again....is what I want for Indiana.   Tell me how that's settling, again?  I'm not sure I follow.  
If your bar is "winning the NCAA Tournament," that's ridiculous.  Sorry..it is.  Do you believe the best 4 teams made the Final Four this season?  It takes so much to win a tournament like this...   First, a team has to stay healthy; which as we've seen is no small feat.  Then you line up everything else...    Wisconsin, Kansas, Kentucky....they were under Ryan/are in the conversation every season.    Indiana gets there?  I think our fans would be just fine.   And they would not think they were "settling."

Great post and logic. Logic isn't allowed on here

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[Stuhoo 79,804]

 

My two cents, which applies to numerous threads:

• Most posters here have largely reasonable expectations which are largely based in logic and the information they have.
• A few posters, some of them very vocal, have unreasonable expectations, and are frequently lacking in logic.
• Those outliers should have a voice too, but those 'squeaky wheels' often attract way more attention than our vast majority of sane, logical posters.
• Logic is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[Alford Bailey 12,356]

Not sure if its been mentioned but Texas Tech has  no players on its roster that were ESPN top 100 recruits.

[Joe DeLow 1,278]

Recruiting the midwest (which is staying close to home) is a huge part of our Championship history. We may have had a player here and there outside that footprint, but certainly not many.
Just a couple questions: How often does a final 4 not include a player from indiana? How often does UNC, Duke, Kentucky win a title without a Hoosier?

When was the last time IU won a title? How many players were alive? How many had even started preschool the last time Indiana went to a Final Four? Go after Indiana kids that are good enough. Outside of that, get the best of the best.


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[Bailey7878 2,506]

Not sure if its been mentioned but Texas Tech has  no players on its roster that were ESPN top 100 recruits.

Amazing what a stud coach can do.

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