Post Game Discussion : Indiana 55 vs Michigan 69

[Brass Cannon]

Can we please quit pretending offense is the problem.  Even after yesterday's debacle we are 45th in offense. And sub 200 in defense. 

 

[VO5]

2 hours ago, Bailey7878 said:

No we are not without Romeo. These freshman are not instant impact types and we lose four seniors who play a lot. Making the tourney next year will be very tough imo.

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We don’t have a single senior on our team that would start for a top 25 team. Not one. We will be better off without them, tbh. The only true loss will be Collin’s leadership. Some of Rob’s production might be missed, but he is too inconsistent. 

I think you’ll see guys like Justin and Al improve greatly, along with a freshman or two exceeding expectations. Jmo is good enough now to be a solid piece next year and we’re all hoping De’ron is more consistent by his Junior year.

We are going to have some additions by subtraction and it will be noticeable next year.

[Uspshoosier]

Can we please quit pretending offense is the problem.  Even after yesterday's debacle we are 45th in offense. And sub 200 in defense. 
 

Offense is still a problem as well. Shooters are like gold in college basketball and from what I’ve seen so far this year we don’t have a shooter that is bronze worthy. How many open 3’s have IU missed?


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[WayneFleekHoosier]

We don’t have a single senior on our team that would start for a top 25 team. Not one. We will be better off without them, tbh. The only true loss will be Collin’s leadership. Some of Rob’s production might be missed, but he is too inconsistent. 
I think you’ll see guys like Justin and Al improve greatly, along with a freshman or two exceeding expectations. Jmo is good enough now to be a solid piece next year and we’re all hoping De’ron is more consistent by his Junior year.
We are going to have some additions by subtraction and it will be noticeable next year.

Pretty much agree but we should just roll with the underclassmen at this point. Give Rob and Colin minutes. The rest should go to Clifton, Al, Smith. Even if we are worse and if your theory of addition by subtraction is true, we should be better.

Our coach must not believe in that theory yet though because McSwain and Newkirk are still gobbling up minutes.


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[mdn82]

Pretty much agree but we should just roll with the underclassmen at this point. Give Rob and Colin minutes. The rest should go to Clifton, Al, Smith. Even if we are worse and if your theory of addition by subtraction is true, we should be better.

Our coach must not believe in that theory yet though because McSwain and Newkirk are still gobbling up minutes.


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I think Morgan and Davis too, but I agree in that Josh and Freddie should be decreasing in minutes.


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[mdn82]

Can we please quit pretending offense is the problem.  Even after yesterday's debacle we are 45th in offense. And sub 200 in defense. 
 

That’s like saying Crean’s offense was glorious because it was highly ranked almost every year. It was highly flawed. Defense for sure is a huge problem, but the ranking is due to 2 games. It has improved. I like what we are doing offensively so much better, but if we had shooters we would be top ten.


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[Brass Cannon]

1 minute ago, mdn82 said:

That’s like saying Crean’s offense was glorious because it was highly ranked almost every year. It was highly flawed. Defense for sure is a huge problem, but the ranking is due to 2 games. It has improved. I like what we are doing offensively so much better, but if we had shooters we would be top ten.


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I never said anything about Crean this isn't about Crean in any way. the offense has its flaws but what's keeping us from being a tournament team is our inability to stop teams. 

[Bailey7878]

He wouldn't come if he was redshirting. 

He seems like a crean project.

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[Uspshoosier]

I never said anything about Crean this isn't about Crean in any way. the offense has its flaws but what's keeping us from being a tournament team is our inability to stop teams. 

You could also make an argument that the teams inability to make open shots could be the reason IU doesn’t make the tournament


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[Class of '66 Old Fart]

16 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

 How many open 3’s have IU missed?

Alex, what is 95?    And with that I win a daily double.  We are currently 47-142 for 33.1%.  Our opponents are 74-182 for 40.7%.   So if my basic math is correct, that's an 81 point differential through 8 games.  We've actually hit 14 more total FG's that our opponents but that 3-point shooting -- ugh!

[Bailey7878]

Pretty much agree but we should just roll with the underclassmen at this point. Give Rob and Colin minutes. The rest should go to Clifton, Al, Smith. Even if we are worse and if your theory of addition by subtraction is true, we should be better.

Our coach must not believe in that theory yet though because McSwain and Newkirk are still gobbling up minutes.


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Given Moore's size hed clearly be playing over mcswain if he was ready. Archie obviously thinks he's not ready to compete at this level.

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[Brass Cannon]

4 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

You could also make an argument that the teams inability to make open shots could be the reason IU doesn’t make the tournament


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Once again 45th ranked offense. Yes the offense has flaws. Far fewer than the defense. 

If we had the 45th defense and offense we would be golden. 

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

1 hour ago, Bailey7878 said:

I have no idea why Clifton Moore is not redshirting. He is nowhere near ready to compete

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Based on all of the comments Moore made during the period between his decommitment and then re-upping, if he was going to be redshirted by Archie he was gone.  High school ego much much bigger than reality.

[VO5]

16 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Once again 45th ranked offense. Yes the offense has flaws. Far fewer than the defense. 

If we had the 45th defense and offense we would be golden. 

I think you’re reading too much into stats. I don’t think anyone watching us right now would say we’re a top 50 offense in the country, because we aren’t.

Duke is terrible on D. Not saying you’re doing this, but people shouldn’t expect that type of performance throughout the season. 

[Old Friend]

1 hour ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

These aren't his guards. They're Creans guards.

I think some guy on 2banners.comcom said the same thing about not accepting 52-49 when he heard Knight was coming.

"These are the Hurrying Hoosiers damnit!", I believe was a direct quote.

I am well aware who the players are.  In fact I've said the same thing multiple times.

Knight's offense moved and got good shots consistently.  This offense (at least yesterday and against Indiana State) looks completely lost and out of sync sometimes.  We're doing well getting it into the post; but the offense generally leaves the defense very little margin for error.   

[Old Friend]

4 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Why wouldn't he? Blackmon left. Morgan could go make money in Europe if that's what he wanted to do.

I don't think Morgan will leave, but he could. And that's all I said.


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Anyone "could."   Wondering why you singled him out.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Anyone "could."   Wondering why you singled him out.

Both upper class men with pro potential. Neither probably NBA no matter when they leave. Just a "what if" that could make us worse next year than we project as the discussion was projecting to next season.


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[Josh]

I get that but it doesn't project that way. Granted Romeo changes things but in my mind he is gone, elsewhere.

We are maybe slightly better next year but we are bad this year year and have a long way to go. I don't see it next year unless Romeo and maybe a grad transfer too. The 3rd year things may take shape depending on recruiting.

PS- Romeo and a grad transfer changes my views.




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I'm sorry, but that would make me very angry. When we needed a new coach, I wanted one who could coach up the kids he had. If it takes this coach three years to win, I'll be lighting my pitchfork.

[Brass Cannon]

1 hour ago, VO5 said:

I think you’re reading too much into stats. I don’t think anyone watching us right now would say we’re a top 50 offense in the country, because we aren’t.

Duke is terrible on D. Not saying you’re doing this, but people shouldn’t expect that type of performance throughout the season. 

I am going by kenpom rankings which over the last 18 years have proven to be very good. 

[VO5]

Just now, Brass Cannon said:

I am going by kenpom rankings which over the last 18 years have proven to be very good. 

Yes, but Ken himself always says they aren’t accurate the first 1/3 or so of the season.