Official 2016-17 IUBB Preseason Thread

[Brass Cannon 24,834]

New Kenpom rankings are out. We came in 16th. Behind Purdue, MSU, OSU and Wisconsin in the Big Ten. 

Kinda surprising since he had us as top 10 during his initial numbers at the end of last season. 

 

[Hoosierfan2017 21,502]

How much did Bryant weigh last year? He looked kind of lanky to me which I think made it more difficult to bang in the paint. He should be an absolute monster at 255 this year. 

[Crimson and Cream 5,826]

Purdue being ranked ahead of us is just laughable and will be looked back on at the end of the season as a "what were they thinking" moment

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,432]

Purdue being ranked ahead of us is just laughable and will be looked back on at the end of the season as a "what were they thinking" moment

Absolutely. I was really high on them last year. Thought they were a great team. I don't see that this year but they will be good.


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[HoosierAloha 30,068]

Absolutely. I was really high on them last year. Thought they were a great team. I don't see that this year but they will be good.


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They're big but slow. Haas is slower than most bigs. Swan is slower than most of the B1G's stretch 4s. They're two shooters are liabilities on defense. They'll get better when they get more speed and athleticism. They're Wisconsin-lite but not as good. They're probably top 5 in the B1G though and should be ranked for most of the season. They'll make the tourney but probably be out first or second round.

[Crimson and Cream 5,826]

1 hour ago, HoosierAloha said:

They're big but slow. Haas is slower than most bigs. Swan is slower than most of the B1G's stretch 4s. They're two shooters are liabilities on defense. They'll get better when they get more speed and athleticism. They're Wisconsin-lite but not as good. They're probably top 5 in the B1G though and should be ranked for most of the season. They'll make the tourney but probably be out first or second round.

I think Haas is overrated and won't be anything to worry about. Like you said, he's super slow, and also gets in foul trouble easily. 

[Stuhoo 81,056]

 

Purdoo will be good, but are as susceptible as ever to a team that runs 'em and presses.

I'll take TB over Haas, OG over Swanigan, and RoJo/JBj over Thompson and Mathias ever day and always. 

And yet, the two teams are being given approximately the same pre-season placement. I know I'm IU-biased, but I don't see them as equal squads.

 

 

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

15 minutes ago, Crimson and Cream said:

I think Haas is overrated and won't be anything to worry about. Like you said, he's super slow, and also gets in foul trouble easily. 

They might actually benefit from Haas getting in foul trouble.  They're a completely different team with Swan at the 5 and Edwards at the 4. 

[Crimson and Cream 5,826]

23 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

They might actually benefit from Haas getting in foul trouble.  They're a completely different team with Swan at the 5 and Edwards at the 4. 

Either way I feel like we hold the matchup advantage

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,432]

 

Purdoo will be good, but are as susceptible as ever to a team that runs 'em and presses.

I'll take TB over Haas, OG over Swanigan, and RoJo/JBj over Thompson and Mathias ever day and always. 

And yet, the two teams are being given approximately the same pre-season placement. I know I'm IU-biased, but I don't see them as equal squads.

 

 

Agree again with Stu. Our roster seems far superior.

As for Haas, his efficiency per time played was remarkable. He shoots FTs well for a big. He is very formidable but has plenty of liabilities and certainly is foul prone.

I would love to have Haas as a back up big. Hoping DeRon can ourplay him eventually as he should.


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[AKHoosier 6,945]

1 hour ago, HoosierAloha said:

They might actually benefit from Haas getting in foul trouble.  They're a completely different team with Swan at the 5 and Edwards at the 4. 

Swanigan hates playing the 5 though, it's why he went to Purdue so he didn't have to slug it out with bigs in the B1G.

Haas is ok but when he gets winded or in foul trouble, they'll definitely take a step back when he goes out.  The luxury of having two massive 7 footers isn't there to fall back on anymore.

[OliviaPope40 6,530]

Buy Photo

IndyStar college basketball Insider Zach Osterman ranks Grayson Allen and Duke No. 1 in his preseason AP ballot. (Photo: Matt Detrich / IndyStar)

 

The first AP Top 25 ballots of the season (well, preseason) are due today. I turned mine in Sunday afternoon.

Constructing a preseason ballot can require serious mental gymnastics. How do you account for freshmen? For injuries? For schedules, without an even remotely perfect idea of how conferences will shake out?

So I tend to try and group teams early, as much as rank them. Collect them into tiers of similar talent and expectation, and then rank from there. There's obviously no perfect way to do it. That's just mine. And this is my ballot:

1) Duke
2) Kentucky
3) North Carolina
4) Kansas
5) Villanova

• First group: Top-level contenders. In my mind, these are the heaviest favorites for the Final Four in Phoenix. I'm buying the Duke and Kentucky freshman hype, but if you wanted to put more faith in experience, you could move UNC or Villanova up. Kansas is a nice blend. Together, they're the frontrunners.

Buy Photo

The Hoosiers got a big boost when Thomas Bryant decided to return for his sophomore season. (Photo: Mykal McEldowney / IndyStar)

 

6) Oregon
7) Wisconsin
8) Xavier
9) Virginia
10) Indiana
11) Arizona

• The next group in my mind – teams with enough talent and balance to have a special season, but still with things to prove. Wisconsin closed out last season so well, but being consistent is much tougher when something is expected of you. Oregon and Xavier have notable early-season absences. Virginia and Indiana return a lot but also need to retool without some crucial pieces. And the Allonzo Trier situation in Tucson is weird.

Freshman point guard Carsen Edwards could be key for the Boilermakers this season. (Photo: John Terhune/Journal & Courier)

 

12) Purdue
13) Louisville
14) Gonzaga
15) Saint Mary's
16) Michigan State
17) Maryland

• This group has enough about it for one or two teams to become dangerous at tournament time, but some combination of attrition and potential holes keeps me skeptical. If the Carsen Edwards hype is real, Purdue will jump to the next tier. Louisville loses key backcourt players, but still returns a lot of nice pieces. Gonzaga (transfers) and Saint Mary's (returning talent) will fight it out atop the West Coast Conference. Maryland loses Diamond Stone, Robert Carter and Jake Layman, but keeps Melo Trimble – and maybe regains some of its balance after a season when so many talented pieces never really fit together.

Michigan State would be as many as 8-9 spots higher, but for a frontcourt that's now missing two really important veterans to long-term injuries.

18) Texas
19) UConn
20) West Virginia
21) Syracuse
22) San Diego State
23) Creighton
24) Cal
25) Rhode Island

• From here, it gets tougher. There are a few in here I like, including Syracuse with Andrew White III transferred in from Nebraska, and West Virginia under the perennially underappreciated Bob Huggins.

A couple of others to keep an eye on: Creighton, which should have a very good backcourt this winter, and Cal, with Ivan Rabb back for his sophomore season. Took a punt on Rhode Island, but I was hardly the only one.

My preseason All-America ballot: 

Grayson Allen, Duke
Josh Hart, Villanova
Dillon Brooks, Oregon
Thomas Bryant, Indiana
Ivan Rabb, Cal

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/college/indiana/hoosier-insider/2016/10/24/ap-top-25-preseason-indiana-hoosiers-purdue-boilermakers/92681220/

[Brass Cannon 24,834]

5 minutes ago, OliviaPope40 said:

Buy Photo

IndyStar college basketball Insider Zach Osterman ranks Grayson Allen and Duke No. 1 in his preseason AP ballot. (Photo: Matt Detrich / IndyStar)

 

The first AP Top 25 ballots of the season (well, preseason) are due today. I turned mine in Sunday afternoon.

Constructing a preseason ballot can require serious mental gymnastics. How do you account for freshmen? For injuries? For schedules, without an even remotely perfect idea of how conferences will shake out?

So I tend to try and group teams early, as much as rank them. Collect them into tiers of similar talent and expectation, and then rank from there. There's obviously no perfect way to do it. That's just mine. And this is my ballot:

1) Duke
2) Kentucky
3) North Carolina
4) Kansas
5) Villanova

• First group: Top-level contenders. In my mind, these are the heaviest favorites for the Final Four in Phoenix. I'm buying the Duke and Kentucky freshman hype, but if you wanted to put more faith in experience, you could move UNC or Villanova up. Kansas is a nice blend. Together, they're the frontrunners.

Buy Photo

The Hoosiers got a big boost when Thomas Bryant decided to return for his sophomore season. (Photo: Mykal McEldowney / IndyStar)

 

6) Oregon
7) Wisconsin
8) Xavier
9) Virginia
10) Indiana
11) Arizona

• The next group in my mind – teams with enough talent and balance to have a special season, but still with things to prove. Wisconsin closed out last season so well, but being consistent is much tougher when something is expected of you. Oregon and Xavier have notable early-season absences. Virginia and Indiana return a lot but also need to retool without some crucial pieces. And the Allonzo Trier situation in Tucson is weird.

Freshman point guard Carsen Edwards could be key for the Boilermakers this season. (Photo: John Terhune/Journal & Courier)

 

12) Purdue
13) Louisville
14) Gonzaga
15) Saint Mary's
16) Michigan State
17) Maryland

• This group has enough about it for one or two teams to become dangerous at tournament time, but some combination of attrition and potential holes keeps me skeptical. If the Carsen Edwards hype is real, Purdue will jump to the next tier. Louisville loses key backcourt players, but still returns a lot of nice pieces. Gonzaga (transfers) and Saint Mary's (returning talent) will fight it out atop the West Coast Conference. Maryland loses Diamond Stone, Robert Carter and Jake Layman, but keeps Melo Trimble – and maybe regains some of its balance after a season when so many talented pieces never really fit together.

Michigan State would be as many as 8-9 spots higher, but for a frontcourt that's now missing two really important veterans to long-term injuries.

18) Texas
19) UConn
20) West Virginia
21) Syracuse
22) San Diego State
23) Creighton
24) Cal
25) Rhode Island

• From here, it gets tougher. There are a few in here I like, including Syracuse with Andrew White III transferred in from Nebraska, and West Virginia under the perennially underappreciated Bob Huggins.

A couple of others to keep an eye on: Creighton, which should have a very good backcourt this winter, and Cal, with Ivan Rabb back for his sophomore season. Took a punt on Rhode Island, but I was hardly the only one.

My preseason All-America ballot: 

Grayson Allen, Duke
Josh Hart, Villanova
Dillon Brooks, Oregon
Thomas Bryant, Indiana
Ivan Rabb, Cal

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/college/indiana/hoosier-insider/2016/10/24/ap-top-25-preseason-indiana-hoosiers-purdue-boilermakers/92681220/

Similar to my views especially in regards to big ten

[Crimson and Cream 5,826]

2 hours ago, OliviaPope40 said:

Buy Photo

IndyStar college basketball Insider Zach Osterman ranks Grayson Allen and Duke No. 1 in his preseason AP ballot. (Photo: Matt Detrich / IndyStar)

 

The first AP Top 25 ballots of the season (well, preseason) are due today. I turned mine in Sunday afternoon.

Constructing a preseason ballot can require serious mental gymnastics. How do you account for freshmen? For injuries? For schedules, without an even remotely perfect idea of how conferences will shake out?

So I tend to try and group teams early, as much as rank them. Collect them into tiers of similar talent and expectation, and then rank from there. There's obviously no perfect way to do it. That's just mine. And this is my ballot:

1) Duke
2) Kentucky
3) North Carolina
4) Kansas
5) Villanova

• First group: Top-level contenders. In my mind, these are the heaviest favorites for the Final Four in Phoenix. I'm buying the Duke and Kentucky freshman hype, but if you wanted to put more faith in experience, you could move UNC or Villanova up. Kansas is a nice blend. Together, they're the frontrunners.

Buy Photo

The Hoosiers got a big boost when Thomas Bryant decided to return for his sophomore season. (Photo: Mykal McEldowney / IndyStar)

 

6) Oregon
7) Wisconsin
8) Xavier
9) Virginia
10) Indiana
11) Arizona

• The next group in my mind – teams with enough talent and balance to have a special season, but still with things to prove. Wisconsin closed out last season so well, but being consistent is much tougher when something is expected of you. Oregon and Xavier have notable early-season absences. Virginia and Indiana return a lot but also need to retool without some crucial pieces. And the Allonzo Trier situation in Tucson is weird.

Freshman point guard Carsen Edwards could be key for the Boilermakers this season. (Photo: John Terhune/Journal & Courier)

 

12) Purdue
13) Louisville
14) Gonzaga
15) Saint Mary's
16) Michigan State
17) Maryland

• This group has enough about it for one or two teams to become dangerous at tournament time, but some combination of attrition and potential holes keeps me skeptical. If the Carsen Edwards hype is real, Purdue will jump to the next tier. Louisville loses key backcourt players, but still returns a lot of nice pieces. Gonzaga (transfers) and Saint Mary's (returning talent) will fight it out atop the West Coast Conference. Maryland loses Diamond Stone, Robert Carter and Jake Layman, but keeps Melo Trimble – and maybe regains some of its balance after a season when so many talented pieces never really fit together.

Michigan State would be as many as 8-9 spots higher, but for a frontcourt that's now missing two really important veterans to long-term injuries.

18) Texas
19) UConn
20) West Virginia
21) Syracuse
22) San Diego State
23) Creighton
24) Cal
25) Rhode Island

• From here, it gets tougher. There are a few in here I like, including Syracuse with Andrew White III transferred in from Nebraska, and West Virginia under the perennially underappreciated Bob Huggins.

A couple of others to keep an eye on: Creighton, which should have a very good backcourt this winter, and Cal, with Ivan Rabb back for his sophomore season. Took a punt on Rhode Island, but I was hardly the only one.

My preseason All-America ballot: 

Grayson Allen, Duke
Josh Hart, Villanova
Dillon Brooks, Oregon
Thomas Bryant, Indiana
Ivan Rabb, Cal

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/college/indiana/hoosier-insider/2016/10/24/ap-top-25-preseason-indiana-hoosiers-purdue-boilermakers/92681220/

Not a whole lot to disagree with there. Is Edwards really expected to have an instant impact for PU? If so I guess I could buy the hype. I didn't realize he was expected to play a lot this early.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,432]

Not a whole lot to disagree with there. Is Edwards really expected to have an instant impact for PU? If so I guess I could buy the hype. I didn't realize he was expected to play a lot this early.

Yes, Edwards was a late bloomer. Apparently had a great off season in preseason games. PU fans think he is the next best PG ever, of course.

Expected to be a heavy rotation guy. Not sure how effective he'll be in big time ball yet.


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[Brass Cannon 24,834]

Haas was effective when he had Hammons drawing attention, just don't see him being that effective without him. 

[Chips&Dipo 1,464]

I know this take is wrong and I will be eating a lot of crow by March, but I am not sold on Wisconsin being the best team in the B1G.

Nigel Hayes is having the kind of off season that spells a mediocre following season. He had an effective field goal percentage less than 40% last year and he has bringing a bunch of unnecessary attention to himself with his antics.

I also wonder how the team will do with a full year with Greg Gard. I know they were slumping under Bo last year and seemed to turn things around when Gard took over, but we don't know what was going on behind closed doors. I think Hayes actions on the off season is kind of telling with the type of coaching style Gard has compared to Bo. I couldn't imagine Hayes doing these things under Bo, but I could be wrong.

Again, I am probably wrong on everything, but I just have a feeling.  

[Brass Cannon 24,834]

7 minutes ago, Andowen1990IU said:

I know this take is wrong and I will be eating a lot of crow by March, but I am not sold on Wisconsin being the best team in the B1G.

Nigel Hayes is having the kind of off season that spells a mediocre following season. He had an effective field goal percentage less than 40% last year and he has bringing a bunch of unnecessary attention to himself with his antics.

I also wonder how the team will do with a full year with Greg Gard. I know they were slumping under Bo last year and seemed to turn things around when Gard took over, but we don't know what was going on behind closed doors. I think Hayes actions on the off season is kind of telling with the type of coaching style Gard has compared to Bo. I couldn't imagine Hayes doing these things under Bo, but I could be wrong.

Again, I am probably wrong on everything, but I just have a feeling.  

THANK YOU.

I totally agree with you.  I personally just think that no matter how similar Gard is to Bo he is still going to institute changes to make his system and I think there will be growing pains. 

And even if Gard shows to be a capable in game coach like we saw last year so much of what a coach does is in the offseason and we have no evidence to show hes the equal of Bo Ryan. 

Now I am not saying hes going to Mike Davis it up by any means, just not sold on Gard ready to win a big ten championship. 

That being said hes got alot going for him we know first hand how beneficial it can be to return all of your starters from the previous year.

[Stuhoo 81,056]

 

Well....if Purdoo is too slow, MSU has lost their two players over 6'8", and Wisky is overrated, who does that leave for the B1G's best team?

I can't imagine which team that might be ;)

[FortWayneHoosier 6,179]

 

Well....if Purdoo is too slow, MSU has lost their two players over 6'8", and Wisky is overrated, who does that leave for the B1G's best team?

I can't imagine which team that might be ;)

Rutgers!!!!!


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