6'4" Guard Nick Zeisloft joins Hoosiers

[MikeRoberts 7,006]

No one is pretending this is something big. This kid has experience and was captain of a D1 program. Those are facts that have been stated, and those facts are where people see his value. No one here has stretched the truth of the impact he can have. Honestly, you're just trying to rain on everyone's parade with posts like these. Sent from my place of advanced, analytical thinking: the toilet.

Who is throwing a parade over this? This is a wet bandaid

[OliviaPope40 6,517]

This board is already going in to full meltdown mode and it's July. Can't wait for the game threads.


Sent from my mind using BtownBanners

I don't think I want to know what that will be like.

[323SGrant 1,176]

I just hope CTC can recruit a D.J. White type of front court player. We need more talent there. A good rebounder/scorer/defender will do nicely.

[Andrew-_-44 25]

[quote name="JSHoosier" post="73460" timestamp="1404850865"]How could I possibly think a player that wasn't good against bad competition will be bad against good competition? That's unfathomable.[/quote]

You ever think that possibly recruits see the type of negativity and pessimism that is present in team message boards? It's stuff like this, which is failure to support your team and its players, even in bad times, that would drive a kid away. Who wants to have to live up to some of the expectations that some of us fans put on the poor kids? Maybe having a fanbase with this type of attitude can cause the players to lose interest or transfer from the program.

How can you expect players to perform if we don't even have faith in them or in our coach.


BtownBanners

[JSHoosier 20,215]

You ever think that possibly recruits see the type of negativity and pessimism that is present in team message boards? It's stuff like this, which is failure to support your team and its players, even in bad times, that would drive a kid away. Who wants to have to live up to some of the expectations that some of us fans put on the poor kids? Maybe having a fanbase with this type of attitude can cause the players to lose interest or transfer from the program.

How can you expect players to perform if we don't even have faith in them or in our coach.


BtownBanners

This seems to be a foreign concept to many, but I'll try it explaining yet again.

 

Supporting the team and being critical are not mutually exclusive.  It is entirely possible to do both.  I want the team and players to do well, but that doesn't mean I have to sugarcoat things.  After last season every last bit of criticism is warranted.

 

I would never root for a player to fail, I cannot see a role player from a bad team in a bad conference translating well to one of the top conferences in the country.

[MikeRoberts 7,006]

You ever think that possibly recruits see the type of negativity and pessimism that is present in team message boards? It's stuff like this, which is failure to support your team and its players, even in bad times, that would drive a kid away. Who wants to have to live up to some of the expectations that some of us fans put on the poor kids? Maybe having a fanbase with this type of attitude can cause the players to lose interest or transfer from the program.

How can you expect players to perform if we don't even have faith in them or in our coach.


BtownBanners

I understand where you are coming from on this. However, there is support and support with concern. I am in the camp of support with major concern. I support IU and will cheer them on through thick and thin, but we just added 3 project players to an already huge class. Our biggest issue is lack of progress/growth over time because we do not keep kids for the duration. We need kids that are good enough to grow and stay 4 years and contribute at least a few of them. Problem is, many of these kids are such big projects they never progress and then leave. Meanwhile they held on to a scholly for a year or two. It's a bad cycle and we are doing it again with the last 3 scholarships.

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

[quote name="MikeRoberts" post="73530" timestamp="1404875582"]Who is throwing a parade over this? This is a wet bandaid[/quote] It's a metaphor. Don't worry, you haven't missed an actual parade.


Sent from my place of advanced, analytical thinking: the toilet.

[TheStillman 991]

First off it's a coaches job to find a "better option for 2015-16".  That's what 3 million a year should at least bring you. And if he can't, I'm really worried where we headed as a program who can't bring great talent.  I don't deny his shooting but we have guards in spades. With  SR, Yogi, Rj, Blackmon we really do have enough guards.  It's really nice that he's dreamt of playing at IU, but so what? We are not handing out gold stars for having dreams  This reeks of desperation and it's obtuse of people, like yourself, to keep blindly supporting decisions that lead to mediocrity.  

 

The point is first and foremost that Crean will have the opportunity to recruit a guy who is a better option by your standards.  Crean will not avoid going after someone because of Nick and we will not miss out on a recruit because Nick is on roster.  If there is anything we all should have learned from Crean's time here it is that he will not hesitate to take a commit from a player even if there is a tight scholarship situation.

 

You named 4 guards yet we all expect to go small this year.  So that's 4 gyus for 3 spots on the floor.  What happens if one of them gets injured?  What happens if two of them get injured?  What happens if one of them goes pro or transfers after this season?  You are looking at this commitment from a binary perspective that it is good or bad.  It is neither.  It is a strategic, low risk decision.  If you think you know how this will turn out, either good or bad, then please send me your picks for the next powerball drawing.  

 

And Nick isn't getting handed anything because he dreamt of playing at IU.  I simply stated that because it shows he will come in and be committed to the program from day one.  That to me is important.  

 

If we go through the 2015 recruiting cycle and get no SG commits because Nick is on roster I will absolutely eat my crow, but to state this as a reason to not worry about improving the 2014-15 squad is frankly just not the right move.  

 

THIS move will not be the reason IU is mediocre this year, if they are.  No one is blindly following anything and frankly not being up in arms about it is not obtuse in any way.  

 

I would also like to point out that the people who are up in arms about this would be the first people to get on Crean if we did not recruit Nick, one of our guards got injured and we had to play a walk on because he pocketed a scholarship.  They would say "Crean can't manage a roster" "Why waste a scholarship in 2014-15 when we need it now".  

 

In conclusion, I can't wait for the next IU news to break so people can be SO ANGRY that Crean did something, doesn't matter what it is at this point, WE NEED HOT TAKES ON IT!!!!  LAST SEASON WAS BAD!

[Banksyrules 4,796]

The point is first and foremost that Crean will have the opportunity to recruit a guy who is a better option by your standards.  Crean will not avoid going after someone because of Nick and we will not miss out on a recruit because Nick is on roster.  If there is anything we all should have learned from Crean's time here it is that he will not hesitate to take a commit from a player even if there is a tight scholarship situation.

 

You named 4 guards yet we all expect to go small this year.  So that's 4 gyus for 3 spots on the floor.  What happens if one of them gets injured?  What happens if two of them get injured?  What happens if one of them goes pro or transfers after this season?  You are looking at this commitment from a binary perspective that it is good or bad.  It is neither.  It is a strategic, low risk decision.  If you think you know how this will turn out, either good or bad, then please send me your picks for the next powerball drawing.  

 

And Nick isn't getting handed anything because he dreamt of playing at IU.  I simply stated that because it shows he will come in and be committed to the program from day one.  That to me is important.  

 

If we go through the 2015 recruiting cycle and get no SG commits because Nick is on roster I will absolutely eat my crow, but to state this as a reason to not worry about improving the 2014-15 squad is frankly just not the right move.  

 

THIS move will not be the reason IU is mediocre this year, if they are.  No one is blindly following anything and frankly not being up in arms about it is not obtuse in any way.  

 

I would also like to point out that the people who are up in arms about this would be the first people to get on Crean if we did not recruit Nick, one of our guards got injured and we had to play a walk on because he pocketed a scholarship.  They would say "Crean can't manage a roster" "Why waste a scholarship in 2014-15 when we need it now".  

 

In conclusion, I can't wait for the next IU news to break so people can be SO ANGRY that Crean did something, doesn't matter what it is at this point, WE NEED HOT TAKES ON IT!!!!  LAST SEASON WAS BAD!

For three spots.  I named you four names for two spots (guards) if you want the the third spot we can include Troy Williams, Devin Davis, and Hoetzel.  That's seven guys for three spots.  I think were good in that department.  If you want to make Devin Davis a power forward ( which proves how desperate we are for big men)then that's six.  That's not managing a roster, it's a jocular act of stupidity.  

I'm not challenging the veracity of your fan hood, but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade.  If you used that scholarship for another low level big man, at least in some way it would make sense.  By adding another guard it just simply states, that he further plans to recycle players each given year to make room for something shiner. This is not stability, it's exacerbating an already glaring problem.  Much like ramming your head through a cement wall in hopes that one day you can break through.

I'm not trying to pick on you, and I apologize for calling you obtuse. I love a lot of things that Coach Crean does.  He recruits guards really well, and he's an excellent PR man, but this signing means to me that he's obstinate towards other people concerns and not looking at himself on how he can improve.  He's a great guy, but his stuborness will get the best of him if he doesn't attempt to change his tactics.    

[CampHoosier 3,697]

On one hand you have people angry at Crean and say he is absolutely on the hot seat. And then these same people criticize Crean for getting an experienced guard who at the very least can provide minimal minutes and a great body in practice. We played Johnny freaking Marlin last year and we are, in my opinion, worse off talent wise this year. So if Crean is on the hot seat, why would he not give his team every opportunity to learn and succeed from anyone who can help? Who are these magic bigs floating around who are interested in IU. It's freaking July. That boat sailed a long time ago. And I don't want to hear Crean can't recruit. That's the one thing he has proven he CAN do. We are going to have to run teams out of the gym to have a chance to win against better opponents with or without this kid. Let's focus on this season rather than giving up and worrying about 2015

[TheStillman 991]

For three spots.  I named you four names for two spots (guards) if you want the the third spot we can include Troy Williams, Devin Davis, and Hoetzel.  That's seven guys for three spots.  I think were good in that department.  If you want to make Devin Davis a power forward ( which proves how desperate we are for big men)then that's six.  That's not managing a roster, it's a jocular act of stupidity.  

I'm not challenging the veracity of your fan hood, but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade.  If you used that scholarship for another low level big man, at least in some way it would make sense.  By adding another guard it just simply states, that he further plans to recycle players each given year to make room for something shiner. This is not stability, it's exacerbating an already glaring problem.  Much like ramming your head through a cement wall in hopes that one day you can break through.

I'm not trying to pick on you, and I apologize for calling you obtuse. I love a lot of things that Coach Crean does.  He recruits guards really well, and he's an excellent PR man, but this signing means to me that he's obstinate towards other people concerns and not looking at himself on how he can improve.  He's a great guy, but his stuborness will get the best of him if he doesn't attempt to change his tactics.    

 

If you think those 7 guys will play only those 3 spots on the floor then who will play power forward and center?  If that's the case then we will have 3 guys playing those two positions, two of them being freshman projects.  The reality of our lineup is that we will be playing small and Troy, Devin and Hoetzel will have to play minutes at the PF position.  I think when planning out this roster you have to look at it that we will be playing with 3 guards and 2 forwards at pretty much all times.  In that case, carrying another guard is not a bad move to provide depth on roster.  5 guards for 3 positions on floor is par for the course.  We all want another big but it's just not happening at this point.  

 

We play with the roster we have, we will be thin on the front line.  The staff will need to get creative with lineups.  This move provides depth at other spots, which due to the big situation will be exacerbated and will allow for more weapons in our arsenal.  We don't need to sacrifice 2014-15 for 2015-16 just because we are thin on the front line.    

[CampHoosier 3,697]

And to piggy back on another poster: these guys see this stuff. When you googled Tim Priller back when we first got him, a thread on this site was in the first three google matches that showed up. 2 days later, he said he would have to "prove the haters wrong" on his Twitter. When recruits or targets see us continuously bash Crean rather than criticize in a manner that still suggests WE HOPE HE DOES WELL, then we are just shooting ourselves in the foot. Think about if there were message boards about your job and how you were doing. Wouldn't you be interested in what people had to say about you? Especially if you are 18,19, 20? What if it was mostly negative. How would you react. Serious question. 

[Hutch89 2,939]

excellent point.  we don't want to do any negative recruiting.  that's for sure.

[Hutch89 2,939]

Since we're talking about the plethora of guards now, I recall several posts that had compared our size and roster structure going into this next year with UConn's title winning team last season.  

Looking at the roster for UConn in 2013-2014, they indeed are really guard loaded, but they had a few options in big men on the roster (2 people at 6-9" and 2 people at 6-10").   How would their guard heavy strategy differ from ours? any similarities in style of play we can expect going into this season?

[Hutch89 2,939]

also... (from ITH), here's a good point about Zeisloft's impact at Indiana.

"Another piece of Zeisloft’s game which could hold importance for Indiana is his ability to take care of the ball. While he’s not a primary ball handler, his turnover rates of 9.8 and 9.7 the past two seasons would have easily been the best on IU’s roster. After a season in which the Hoosiers were woeful in terms of taking care of the ball, swapping in Zeisloft for a guy like Austin Etherington, who had a similar usage percentage, is a major upgrade when you consider his turnover percentage of 9.8 versus 25 percent for Etherington."

http://www.insidethehall.com/2014/07/09/closer-look-nick-zeisloft-addition/

 

(Etherington was listed at 6-6" and Zeisloft at 6-4" -  for comparing the two in terms of "swapping")

[Rookie33 932]

If shooting numbers are taken into consideration (particularly from 3-point land), then this is an uneven "swap" (in IU's favor)...

[CampHoosier 3,697]

If shooting numbers are taken into consideration (particularly from 3-point land), then this is an uneven "swap" (in IU's favor)...

 

Exactly. This was basically a trade for Etherington. And if he was still on the roster no one would be belly aching. They would ironically state he needs to lead the team with Yogi. Too funny

[JSHoosier 20,215]

It's funny how people just ignore that he did that in a bad conference.  Yeah, let's totally expect the same results in one of the top conferences.

 

Just because he took care of the ball in the MVC doesn't mean he will in the B1G, that's a big step up in competition.

[CampHoosier 3,697]

It's funny how people just ignore that he did that in a bad conference.  Yeah, let's totally expect the same results in one of the top conferences.

 

Yeah, let's disregard the conference has Wichita State, Indiana State, and Bradley. Teams from small conferences just don't match up. That's why Duke killed Mercer in the tournament

[JSHoosier 20,215]

Yeah, let's disregard the conference has Wichita State, Indiana State, and Bradley. Teams from small conferences just don't match up. That's why Duke killed Mercer in the tournament

The MVC, a conference that had one team make the tournament.  Bradley, a team that finished with a record of 12-20.  Indiana State did make the NIT, so that's something I guess.