Fred Glass Retiring

[ElectricBoogaloo 4,307]

15 hours ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

 

Dakich seems to think Gonso is also the problem. Time will tell


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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,225]

I'll give you the first 2.  There was no reason....none...to be worse in year 3 than we were in year 2.   People that say Crean needed the 3 years would say he needed 8 if that were the narrative.   Crean is the guy who made excuses about "the first 3 years," and the blind loyalists drank the Kool Aid.  His BT record was worse year 3 than it was year 2; and he was already making excuses.   Tom Crean needs the best talent to win a game.   It is and was very rare for him to win when his talent wasn't quite matched up and he got out-coached all the time.

I can agree with your premise on the 3rd yr. However, in response to the post I quoted, counting those first 2 yrs to further an argument is ludicrous IMO. Beilein didn't walk into a cupboard as bare as Crean's when he took the job at Michigan.

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,225]

Disagree.  Knight didn't bring in many "stars" either.  He won with a system.  He won with upper classmen.  He won with defense and offensive efficiency.   He won with kids who understand how to play basketball.   He won with those kids' toughness and leadership.  

Knight's system is Indiana's DNA.   Not instant winning and stars.   He didn't care one bit how many stars were by a kid's name.  Belien, from a basketball perspective, is as close to Knight as there is in college basketball.   What makes you say Indiana wouldn't have been patient enough?   As long as Indiana fans can see what a coach is trying to do and making progress; they'd have been plenty patient.  Especially when we had the opportunity to hire him....which - depending on what you believe - was when we fired Mike Davis.   I think Belein would have absolutely been embraced; especially following Davis and TELLING fans we're going to build this the right way.   I think that's exactly what people wanted to hear at that time, and when we went for "stars," it ruined the culture of this program and has not yet recovered.

That was then. I'd argue because fans then allowed him to build his program which produced the National Championships, that many of the younger Generations of fans aren't as patient. I actually agree with mdn that those fans wouldn't have been patient enough for Beilein to build his program. And Yes Crean was here at least 3 seasons too long.

 

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[mdn82 25,510]

That was then. I'd argue because fans then allowed him to build his program which produced the National Championships, that many of the younger Generations of fans aren't as patient. I actually agree with mdn that those fans wouldn't have been patient enough for Beilein to build his program. And Yes Crean was here at least 3 seasons too long. 
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Yeah my whole thing with the difference in time is not only social media but recruiting analysts. Back then you didn’t have that and people were more patient. I enjoyed pre social media days lol. Now everyone wants something now. Then they go on to social media. We have a vocal fan base which is both good and bad. It makes people want to play here and vice versa. It is intimidating. Then it becomes a tool to use against us. I just don’t feel Belein gets 6 years here to make it before the fan base turns on him and then recruiting dips. Then it’s over.


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[Old Friend 8,389]

15 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

That was then. I'd argue because fans then allowed him to build his program which produced the National Championships, that many of the younger Generations of fans aren't as patient. I actually agree with mdn that those fans wouldn't have been patient enough for Beilein to build his program. And Yes Crean was here at least 3 seasons too long.

 

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Yes.  That was then,  Which is why I made the point.  IU fans are smart.  We / they can see what's happening; and when you can see what a coach is trying to do and see who he's recruiting, it's fun to watch development.   Knight's national championships all came with very experienced teams, and by his standards there were some years where fans just had to be patient and let the team build.  (1985, 1988, 1990 as most recent examples in his tenure here)   I won't argue with you, but given that culture which we had for 29 seasons, I'm not sure why you think fans would have been impatient.

[Old Friend 8,389]

2 hours ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

I've heard that Izzo, Alford, Pitino, all wanted the job and that Calipari would have "crawled" from Memphis to get the job. I've also heard Brad Stevens had in his contract that he could leave to go to IU if he had the opportunity... Which just begs the question; how the heck did we end up with 9 years of FCTC?

 

 

 

 

I know for a fact Pitino called IU twice (once following Davis, once following Sampson/Dakich) proactively and wanted the job.  Both times he was told (and Shoulders was involved) Indiana University did not want a coach who might be bigger than the University.

I think (based on some decent intel) the Izzo thing is false.   Alford wanted the job; and I know Calipari inquired about it.  Have no intel on Stevens' contract at Butler, but Crean did just enough to save his job.  Twice.  Indiana has still not recovered from hiring Mike Davis.

[swingline91 89]

What I hear some people saying on multiple boards is... Our board of trustees is extremely poor when it comes to making hires, our President is terrible and needs to be replaced, and our AD needs to be fired. But the president will not fire the AD, and even if he does, the BOT will just go out and make another terrible hire. thus continuing the circle of suck. Dakich was on ESPN in 2016 after we fired Crean and was asked what are the pros and cons of IUBB and he stated that the administration is terrible. Although some people dislike Dakich, he's correct on that. 
 
Also, I saw on twitter that an alumni was running for the BOT on a Sports type platform. I don't have a link, but I'd like to know how we can promote and vote for him. 

Was it this guy?

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[Gahoosierfan 272]

On 3/18/2019 at 10:18 AM, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

The constant harping to fire Fred Glass through repetitive b***ching on this board is so misdirected.  Those of you in this group of posters need to re-direct your energies to the Board of Trustees because that's who is going to make that decision and I doubt if any of them really pay much attention to your postings on btb.  You'll find the complete list at the link below; have at it.  But note that Harry Gonso, a member of our 1967 Rose Bowl team and Quinn Buckner a member of our '76 undefeated NCAA champs are both trustees.  Another trustee is James Morris, Vice Chairman of the Pacers and a former treasurer of the U.S. Olympic Committee.  Athletics aren't exactly shut out from representation at the highest level.   But please, if it will make you feel better, start bombarding them with letters, emails, texts, etc.  I've started blocking some of you which I really hate to do because you do sometimes offer some good insight and commentary but enough is enough.  This is an open forum and criticism should be expected (even encouraged to a point) and it's often justified but you've made your positions more than clear and I've simply grown weary of your 24/7 incessant carping in virtually every thread.  

https://trustees.iu.edu/the-trustees/current-trustees/index.html

I don't know where I read it, but about 3 weeks ago I saw an article about Glass and the trustees. One of them asked him about the football program and said they had 1 winning season in the last 25 years. Glass, of course, tried to shift the conversation to the winning minor sports teams. 

[HinnyHoosier 4,982]

[quote post="508469" timestamp="1553084444"
   
"depending on who you believe, he (Beilein) was on an airplane with a contract in his hand when Herbert vetoed it and insisted Indiana hire a minority to replace Davis."



So intriguing and, if true, incredibly frustrating.

Also, nice post in its entirety and spot on. People, as a fanbase, just forget. The fact that we have had little to no national relevance the last 20 years makes them forget even more quickly what got the program there to begin with. I would like to see a similar build to the program and I believe we will. CAM gets things done on the recruiting trail and will continue to find his players, but it will take time.


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[JustWinWoody 3,385]

https://twitter.com/IUHoosiers/status/1108455280776491008?s=20 

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

I know for a fact Pitino called IU twice (once following Davis, once following Sampson/Dakich) proactively and wanted the job.  Both times he was told (and Shoulders was involved) Indiana University did not want a coach who might be bigger than the University.
I think (based on some decent intel) the Izzo thing is false.   Alford wanted the job; and I know Calipari inquired about it.  Have no intel on Stevens' contract at Butler, but Crean did just enough to save his job.  Twice.  Indiana has still not recovered from hiring Mike Davis.

Just to play devil’s advocate, but if that policy resulted in turning down Pitino and Calipari, then maybe it’s not such a bad thing after all...

Need to find a happy medium, as this also resulted in poor hires.


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[LamarCheeks 18,925]

3 hours ago, HinnyHoosier said:

[quote post="508469" timestamp="1553084444"
   
"depending on who you believe, he (Beilein) was on an airplane with a contract in his hand when Herbert vetoed it and insisted Indiana hire a minority to replace Davis."






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It's easy for me to say this, but if that is true (regardless if it was Beilein or someone else), if I were Rick Greenspan, I would've said to Herbert:  "You either let me hire the coaches, or you find a new AD." 

[Old Friend 8,389]

47 minutes ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Just to play devil’s advocate, but if that policy resulted in turning down Pitino and Calipari, then maybe it’s not such a bad thing after all...

Need to find a happy medium, as this also resulted in poor hires.


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I don't think that's  devil's advocate at all.  Nor do I think it's a bad thing we didn't hire one of those two.   What I DO dislike is the mindset.  Men's basketball is the world's window into Indiana University.  It just is.  Having a coach who has a huge persona can be a great thing if he represents the university in a positive way...as Knight did until he didn't.  Calipari would have changed the culture here into whatever UK is now, and Pitino's baggage is well noted.   I'm not giving up on Archie.  I think he needs a new assistant or two (and I think Brusier Flint is completely worthless); but I have seen him adjust and learn this season, and he's far better out of timeouts than Crean was.

[Old Friend 8,389]

13 minutes ago, LamarCheeks said:

It's easy for me to say this, but if that is true (regardless if it was Beilein or someone else), if I were Rick Greenspan, I would've said to Herbert:  "You either let me hire the coaches, or you find a new AD." 

According to the story I've heard it was very last second and Greenspan really didn't have time to react to it.   I do know with 100% certaint Sampson was hired because Herbert demanded a minority to replace Davis.   Between he and McRobbie the BOT has hired two incredibly bad presidents from a macro perspective.  Neither understand/understood much beyond the realm of academia; and a university's best fundraising vehicle is generally athletics.

[Old Friend 8,389]

7 hours ago, Baltimore Hoosier said:

If you can't understand my context, I don't really have time to explain it.

Okay.  Whatever.  Get over yourself.

[Bailey7878 2,506]

According to the story I've heard it was very last second and Greenspan really didn't have time to react to it.   I do know with 100% certaint Sampson was hired because Herbert demanded a minority to replace Davis.   Between he and McRobbie the BOT has hired two incredibly bad presidents from a macro perspective.  Neither understand/understood much beyond the realm of academia; and a university's best fundraising vehicle is generally athletics.

So we were going to get beilein? Uugghhh.

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[southernindianahoosier2 902]

 https://247sports.com/college/indiana/Article/Indiana-basketball-Hoosier-Hysterics-Podcast-Brian-Snow-130178176/

 

Has anyone else listened to this? Pretty eye opening about the Crean era. Especially considering the Kyrie Irving recruiting story. So that was in 2009, if you're Fred Glass and know these inside stories in 2009, how do you justify the extension? I just can't believe it.

 

At about the hour mark they speak about how the program was in the stone age when Archie was hired. It made it seem that the Administration is just clueless. Really good insight for someone like me, who doesn't know the intricacies of travel before games and things like that. 

Edited March 21, 2019 by southernindianahoosier2
Edited to add a bit about the administration

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,225]

 https://247sports.com/college/indiana/Article/Indiana-basketball-Hoosier-Hysterics-Podcast-Brian-Snow-130178176/
 
Has anyone else listened to this? Pretty eye opening about the Crean era. Especially considering the Kyrie Irving recruiting story. So that was in 2009, if you're Fred Glass and know these inside stories in 2009, how do you justify the extension? I just can't believe it.
 
At about the hour mark they speak about how the program was in the stone age when Archie was hired. It made it seem that the Administration is just clueless. Really good insight for someone like me, who doesn't know the intricacies of travel before games and things like that. 

Which is why I'm not concerned about Archie(yet). There are a lot of Crean players left in the system.

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[southernindianahoosier2 902]

Which is why I'm not concerned about Archie(yet). There are a lot of Crean players left in the system.

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If you listen to the whole podcast you may be worried about the program in general. It was eye opening on how bad the administration is


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[Gahoosierfan 272]

I think IU suffers from a structural problem with governance. The BOT is mostly appointed by the governor. That means you get a lot of political suck-ups running a multi-billion dollar enterprise. And I think the results show it.