Indiana vs OSU Game Thread - 8/31 @ 8:00ET on ESPN

[8bucks 6,461]

I really dont want to question the staff already but that was a dumb dumb.

Heard Don Fischer on the radio this afternoon and he mentioned that the coaches wanted him to get tougher. To learn to compete for balls in the air rather than wait for them to come to him. Fisch mentioned that putting him on ST may have been the coaches attempt at getting this out of him.

[cthomas 6,488]

We can discuss different aspects of the game forever, but the talent difference was glaring. Until we can close the talent gap I don't see much hope of competing consistently in the top half of the conference. Pride, effort, caring, and whatever else you want to throw in there will only take us so far.

[TXHoosierDaddy 1,375]

2 hours ago, Miller'sTheMan said:

Yeah it sucks to lose Westbrook, but I am completely fine with the duo of Hale/Cobbs on the outside. Both of them were winning their battles vs one of the top secondaries we will face. This game was lost in the trenches. 

 

That's not really the point. We lost a big time playmaker to a play that he should never have been in on. Can never have enough playmakers and no telling if he would have eventually won the starting gig over Hale as the season progressed. He certainly showed lots of promise last year. 

Edited September 1, 2017 by TXHoosierDaddy

[TXHoosierDaddy 1,375]

4 hours ago, Crimson and Cream said:

This may not be a popular opinion, but I thought Lagow looked just like last year. He'll make some beautiful throws which is where those annoying NFL comparisons keep coming from (come on people really??), and don't get me wrong I love seeing that. But even after that hot start I kept telling my friend let's just see how he finishes this game. Sure enough, the Lagow we all saw last year showed back up. He stares down one receiver, never goes through his progressions, is absolutely a loose cannon in the pocket with no ball security, forces the most absurd throws that even high schooler's know better than to make, and even though this isn't on him can we please stop calling running plays for him??

I will be the first to admit he had a lot of pressure on many plays due to the o-line, but this guy's gotta know how to just get rid of the ball and live to another play and he just hasn't ever figured that out and at this point I'm giving up hope he does. As Tim said I wouldn't blame this game on him, but he is going to continue to kill us in big games with his lack of ball security. He had 3 TO's but it should have been 4 and maybe even 5 depending on if you think that shove to Simmie was a fumble or not.

I agree the running plays for Lagow are basically like giving up a down. He's lucky to get a yard or two and most times gets stopped around the line of scrimmage. Lagow has nice precision and great arm strength but still lacks a lot of fundamentals that make a really good QB. I would be all for putting Ramsey in more and more as the season progresses b/c what we saw last night is who Lagow is and there is not much improvement that can be made at this point. 

[Crimson and Cream 5,830]

3 hours ago, TXHoosierDaddy said:

I agree the running plays for Lagow are basically like giving up a down. He's lucky to get a yard or two and most times gets stopped around the line of scrimmage. Lagow has nice precision and great arm strength but still lacks a lot of fundamentals that make a really good QB. I would be all for putting Ramsey in more and more as the season progresses b/c what we saw last night is who Lagow is and there is not much improvement that can be made at this point. 

Completely agree. It's what I was worried about all offseason. The tools to be a good QB are irrelevant if you don't have it between the ears.

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,192]

Lagow had 3 TOs?.. you're seriously counting the fumble against him?.. that's asinine. Truthfully it shows your complete bias against him. Lagow was was like an 8.5/10 Thursday night. Especially when you look at how he struggled last year. Lastly.. we don't have a single run play in our offense designed solely for Lagow.. simply zone read and he read told him to keep it. To watch that game and come away complaining about Lagow is laughable at best. Lastly, if we're going to run the ball that poorly we need a 10-12 Play package for Ramsey in a wildcat. I don't want to judge a kid on one throw... but PR one throw looked really bad. Also.. Tronti needs to put on some serious weight.

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[Josh 12,649]

Lagow had 3 TOs?.. you're seriously counting the fumble against him?.. that's asinine. Truthfully it shows your complete bias against him. Lagow was was like an 8.5/10 Thursday night. Especially when you look at how he struggled last year. Lastly.. we don't have a single run play in our offense designed solely for Lagow.. simply zone read and he read told him to keep it. To watch that game and come away complaining about Lagow is laughable at best. Lastly, if we're going to run the ball that poorly we need a 10-12 Play package for Ramsey in a wildcat. I don't want to judge a kid on one throw... but PR one throw looked really bad. Also.. Tronti needs to put on some serious weight.

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I'm sorry, but you're the one who appears to have the bias. No, not all turnovers are the quarterback's fault. However when you have a history of multiple turnover games, you have to see the forest for the trees. There's a trend here that you can't ignore.

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[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,192]

I'm certainly not bias. To say that fumble was his fault is idiotic at best. The INTS were one a bad decision, one a bad throw.

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[Josh 12,649]

I'm certainly not bias. To say that fumble was his fault is idiotic at best. The INTS were one a bad decision, one a bad throw.

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How many bad throws and bad decisions do you have to see in how many games before you notice a trend? There's a reason people give Lagow hell. I know you always defend him, but it's impossible to miss the trend here.

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,192]

How many bad throws and bad decisions do you have to see in how many games before you notice a trend? There's a reason people give Lagow hell. I know you always defend him, but it's impossible to miss the trend here.

He threw 65 times lol you act like everyone is perfect.

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[Josh 12,649]

He threw 65 times lol you act like everyone is perfect.

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I'm not at all trying to say everyone is perfect. I'm not at all saying he should be perfect. All I'm saying is Lagow's history suggests that he has multiple turnovers far too often. I don't think there's any way to dispute that.

I see you reference Lagow haters a lot. We're not haters. We see truths and trends that you don't. Yes, you're very biased.

[Old Friend 8,389]

I didn't think Lagow was bad at all the other night; and I thought both turnovers were.....excusable.  The first was tipped, the second a late-game "trying to make a play" pick with the game already decided.    I actually thought he made mostly good throws, made good decisions, and played relatively well.

Ohio State might be the best team in the country.  They're certainly one of the biggest, deepest, and most athletic teams in the country, and that will be by far Indiana's toughest game.  Judging Lagow negatively by that game and using to to say "same old Lagow" is a bit premature.  I thought his throws were generally more accurate and decision making much better.  Ohio State will turn lots of good quarterbacks over multiple times.   If Lagow regresses against Virginia or has a tough first half of the season, I'd say it's fair to be critical and point to history.  After that game?  No. Indiana was not going to run the ball Thursday night.   They are not and will not be in that league.   And don't have to be.  The rest of this season will be easy by comparison..Ohio State is that good.  They're on par with Alabama.  Indiana simply cannot compete with that for 4 quarters right now.  They don't have enough depth...Ohio State does.  And it showed.

I'd give Lagow another week or two before heaping any negatives on him.

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

Are people ignoring the passes that O$U defenders dropped, bounced off O$U defenders back/helmet, or thrown while being tackled.

Lagow has arm strength and accuracy (sometimes) but he lacks pocket awareness and good decision making.

[JSHoosier 20,280]

13 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

Are people ignoring the passes that O$U defenders dropped, bounced off O$U defenders back/helmet, or thrown while being tackled.

Lagow has arm strength and accuracy (sometimes) but he lacks pocket awareness and good decision making.

His pocket awareness left a lot to be desired.  Granted, against O$U there wasn't really a pocket just linemen trying to set speed records.

I thought he looked improved in some ways, but we'll see going forward how much.  There were games last year where you could say his horrendous decisions/turnovers cost the team Ws.

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,192]

His pocket awareness left a lot to be desired.  Granted, against O$U there wasn't really a pocket just linemen trying to set speed records.
I thought he looked improved in some ways, but we'll see going forward how much.  There were games last year where you could say his horrendous decisions/turnovers cost the team Ws.

We won't have a better option regardless

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[Old Friend 8,389]

26 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

Are people ignoring the passes that O$U defenders dropped, bounced off O$U defenders back/helmet, or thrown while being tackled.

Lagow has arm strength and accuracy (sometimes) but he lacks pocket awareness and good decision making.

At the same time, are you ignoring that OSU may be the best team in the country; Indiana is not in that league; we had no running game and it was ALL on Lagow's shoulders, he made some terrific throws against NFL caliber corners, had pressure in his face all night, and honestly didn't cost Indiana anything?  

OSU has NFL caliber players 2 deep at almost every position.  Indiana can't compete with that size or speed over 4 quarters; and anyone who thinks they can right now needs a reality check.  We don't have the depth or experience to play with Ohio State, and had zero running game to take pressure off Lagow.

When it's all on you, you're forced to try to make plays sometimes.  Judging him as harshly as you are after this game is premature in my mind.  I saw a lot of things I thought were better the other night, and I'll bet you whatever you feel like you want to bet his numbers show vast improvement over a year ago.  

[TXHoosierDaddy 1,375]

11 minutes ago, btownqb said:

We won't have a better option regardless

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Kind of hard to make that determination after seeing the other QB option for one series. I get that Lagow didn't get any help from the running game. At the same time, he continues to force throws and just make bad decisions in key situations. Case in point, that INT in the redzone he stared down the receiver and forced the ball in for an INT. Would have been up 14-3 and instead it goes to 7-6. He could have easily had another TO or two on the night. 

[TXHoosierDaddy 1,375]

6 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

When it's all on you, you're forced to try to make plays sometimes.  Judging him as harshly as you are after this game is premature in my mind.  I saw a lot of things I thought were better the other night, and I'll bet you whatever you feel like you want to bet his numbers show vast improvement over a year ago.  

The criticism stems from the fact that it's the same type of mistakes he made a year ago. Ohio State is the best team we will see all year. No doubt. However, Lagow still forced throws without needing to. He still isn't able to look down receivers and go to the second or third option, which really good QB's do. He still doesn't seem to have a good feel for the pocket when pressure is around him.

What we saw was his accuracy was on point big time. Better than it was from a consistency standpoint than any full game last year. If he could combine those great throws with some QB instincts and a better feel for the pocket he would be on another level. The bottom line is without a running game it's going to be very hard to beat any really good teams. Hopefully, that can improve with a few easier games coming up. 

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

At the same time, are you ignoring that OSU may be the best team in the country; Indiana is not in that league; we had no running game and it was ALL on Lagow's shoulders, he made some terrific throws against NFL caliber corners, had pressure in his face all night, and honestly didn't cost Indiana anything?  
OSU has NFL caliber players 2 deep at almost every position.  Indiana can't compete with that size or speed over 4 quarters; and anyone who thinks they can right now needs a reality check.  We don't have the depth or experience to play with Ohio State, and had zero running game to take pressure off Lagow.
When it's all on you, you're forced to try to make plays sometimes.  Judging him as harshly as you are after this game is premature in my mind.  I saw a lot of things I thought were better the other night, and I'll bet you whatever you feel like you want to bet his numbers show vast improvement over a year ago.  

I never ignored O$U's talent? I'm not judging Lagow on a single game against one of the most talented teams. I'm judging based on his overall time at IU. He made bad passes the other night that his receivers went up and got. He bounced several passes off OSU player's backs and helmets.

Wasn't O$U's secondary extremely young? How often was #12 picked on. I bet a ton of Lagow's passing yards were against him and I believe a few TDs as well. They might be NFL caliber corners but not anytime soon. 12 looked like a Doug Mallory recruit for much of the game.

If you read my previous post... I stated Lagow can still have a great season. I believe he was slightly better than last season in the first game against a great team.

I hope he has better numbers... we don't have a run game so if he has the same or worse numbers we're screwed.

[Hoosierfan2017 21,503]

I think Lagow lacks the feel for the game that a good quarterback needs. He's a big kid with a big arm, but he lacks the little things that a quarterback needs to know. 

We desperately need a running game. If we have to rely on Lagow throwing it 60+ times then we're in for a long year. He will inevitably make mistakes when you have him do that.