Roster Management

[hoosierpap 14,300]

Obviously, the topic of roster management is a large one - and will probably be one of the most remembered aspects of the Crean era. I'm referring to oversigning, transfers, one and dones, "creaning"; standing vs. holding offers, and whatever else.  I (and others) have noticed how the topic seems to take over several threads. 

 

I'm throwing no stones - it's natural when talking IU basketball to talk about how the roster is being assembled and maintained. Having said that, I thought making a separate thread to discuss and debate these issues may be beneficial. 

 

 

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts because I skim by most of it when it's spread amongst several threads...

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,544]

In general, I am all about Roster Improvement. I wish SHIPS were given out more judiciously though. (Wish we minimized our misses)

I don't mind oversigning or transfers in general. It's a case by case basis to me.

Wish we could have found a way to utilize Creek, Abell, Fischer.

Not upset by the transfers of Jurkin, Hollowell, Etherington, Marlin.

Early NBA entry....

No one can argue VO or Zeller leaving....
Vonleh probably could have benefitted from another year but hard to argue going lottery.

Crean needs to be able to replace 5 star talent with more 5 star talent or experienced 4 star types already on roster.

I don't think we should ever be in the position to have to take an April or Priller rated recruit at IU. (Sidenote-I think even if Priller and April aren't 4 year players they can still benefit greatly from being at a basketball institution like IU)

[Kepner 1,261]

In general, I am all about Roster Improvement. I wish SHIPS were given out more judiciously though. (Wish we minimized our misses)

I don't mind oversigning or transfers in general. It's a case by case basis to me.

Wish we could have found a way to utilize Creek, Abell, Fischer.

Not upset by the transfers of Jurkin, Hollowell, Etherington, Marlin.

Early NBA entry....

No one can argue VO or Zeller leaving....
Vonleh probably could have benefitted from another year but hard to argue going lottery.

Crean needs to be able to replace 5 star talent with more 5 star talent or experienced 4 star types already on roster.

I don't think we should ever be in the position to have to take an April or Priller rated recruit at IU. (Sidenote-I think even if Priller and April aren't 4 year players they can still benefit greatly from being at a basketball institution like IU)

I understand and agree except with the last part, I think as a team we have to be able to take a risk every now and then. There is a long list of players that came into IU as 3 star recruits(Hulls, Verdell Jones, Sheehey as examples) and ended up being great players for IU. Even some 2 star recruits who received very little to no offers (Abell and Roth). I agree it probably shouldn't be two or three every year but there has to be an option. 
Maybe he hasn't replaced 5 star big men with 5 star big men, but Crean has consistenly brought in high 4 star recruits and a 5 star last few years.

[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

Good thread---Overall, I like Crean's recruiting.  Maybe there were gambles last year (we shall see how they play and develop once the games start) but that was largely due to the unexpected and/or untimely transfers of Fischer, Jeremy, Peter, and AE. There is a good chance our new recruits will be upgrades over those who chose to leave.

 

My beefs are sub patterns that seem to be based on certain numbers of minutes allotted to each player per game instead of focusing on whose hot or matchup considerations.

 

My biggest concern is not having veteran upperclassmen players as experience often trumps talent.  I want to see us develop our bigs or players over time so they are ready to play when they are juniors and seniors.  I hope HMP will be an example of this in the upcoming season.  I would like to see Holt, Priller, and April get a similar opportunity.

[MikeRoberts 7,075]

Kepner, you can't fairly discuss hulls, Sheehey etc in the same sentence as Priller and April. They are no where near those players ability. He is talking about 0-1 star, nobody on earth is recruiting them type players, not players like hulls who had serious interest from the likes of Duke. Incarnate word vs duke...


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[WayneFleekHoosier 48,544]

I understand and agree except with the last part, I think as a team we have to be able to take a risk every now and then. There is a long list of players that came into IU as 3 star recruits(Hulls, Verdell Jones, Sheehey as examples) and ended up being great players for IU. Even some 2 star recruits who received very little to no offers (Abell and Roth). I agree it probably shouldn't be two or three every year but there has to be an option.
Maybe he hasn't replaced 5 star big men with 5 star big men, but Crean has consistenly brought in high 4 star recruits and a 5 star last few years.

Rivals had Abell and Roth as 3 stars:

Roth had offers from Notre Dame, Saint Louis, Bradley.
Abell had offers from all over, Butler, Xavier, Penn St., Seton Hall, etc....

Not apples to apples.

Hulls was a borderline 4star, Sheehey was a top 150 guy.

Who is the last player we recruited with an Unrated status. Shouldn't happen.


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[WayneFleekHoosier 48,544]

Just did some research on V. Jones.

Rated #126 on rivals.

Offers from Kentucky, Minnesota, Tennessee, Southern Illinois.

He turned out about exactly like a #126 player should. Sheeheyesque!!!!!!!


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[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

MikeRoberts----I am curious about your argument about Hulls having an actual offer from Duke. Is that true?

 

The reason I ask is that an IU Insider once told me he only actually had "interest" from Duke or an offer to allow him to walk on---anyone know for sure?

 

In any event---I loved Jordy and am sure glad he ended up at IU!

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,544]

Kepner, you can't fairly discuss hulls, Sheehey etc in the same sentence as Priller and April. They are no where near those players ability. He is talking about 0-1 star, nobody on earth is recruiting them type players, not players like hulls who had SERIOUS INTEREST from the likes of Duke. Incarnate word vs duke...


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no offer, but legit interest as he and many others have purported.


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[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

Didn't Duke have interest in April too?

 

Wasn't it serious enough for them to send staff to evaluate him?

 

I am not trying to say the interest was even at the same level---but it's easy to twist arguments to suit each other's own purposes.

[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

On Priller---some kids are recruited to be role players or for specialties--- like his shooting.  Maybe he wasn't recruited to be an immediate starter like Hulls. It's not fair to compare them. 

 

IU has had many recruits through the years who knew and were told they were being recruited for a specific purpose with the opportunity to continue to develop their game. They knew they were not coming in as starters.  I was around several IU players in the 80s and 90s like that and even they admitted it and it was no secret.  I am sure it's still somewhat similar today.

 

Has anyone noticed that the 6'9" Priller can stroke it from 3?  Situationally he has the potential to be an excellent player to bring off the bench for short stretches while he continues to develop his game.  There are a lot more scholarships than starters.  Why is this so hard to understand?

 

I like the kid and his love for Indiana basketball and will certainly be rooting for him to be successful!

[GloryDays 5,922]

no offer, but legit interest as he and many others have purported.


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Didn't Purdue offer him also?

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,544]

Not sure, not a listed offer on Rivals but could have happened. But IF they didn't, that says it all about PURDONT basketball.

 

Sidenote-Rivals is easily accessible but very slow to update recruiting information.  They don't always account accurately for offers.  However, I still feel they are reputable.  Odd...

[MikeRoberts 7,075]

I had not heard that duke sent someone to scout April, not sure if that was a joke or if that really happened but I do know that the Duke staff did recruit Hulls pretty consistently, visits, calls, mail etc. From what I gathered from talking to people in his family, he was not their 1, 2 option and did not know what number he was but felt pretty confident that his number could have been called if they missed out on a guy or two and he was ready to take it if and when it happened. Crean made him a priority and offered him a scholarship at mid court in front if his family and made it pretty special and he took it. Glad it turned out that.


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[MikeRoberts 7,075]

On Priller---some kids are recruited to be role players or for specialties--- like his shooting. Maybe he wasn't recruited to be an immediate starter like Hulls. It's not fair to compare them.

IU has had many recruits through the years who knew and were told they were being recruited for a specific purpose with the opportunity to continue to develop their game. They knew they were not coming in as starters. I was around several IU players in the 80s and 90s like that and even they admitted it and it was no secret. I am sure it's still somewhat similar today.

Has anyone noticed that the 6'9" Priller can stroke it from 3? Situationally he has the potential to be an excellent player to bring off the bench for short stretches while he continues to develop his game. There are a lot more scholarships than starters. Why is this so hard to understand?

I like the kid and his love for Indiana basketball and will certainly be rooting for him to be successful!

I understand the notion that not everyone can be a starter and believe others understand that too. In regards to priller, what I don't understand is what value they think he brings now or down the line. We have a kid in the same class in Max Hoetzel that is a better clone of Priller. Same size, Max is faster, more athletic and can shoot the longball as well or better than priller. Without any inside knowledge on this, I can't help but believe that the staff brought him in because we had no other options and could easily oust him a year later without anyone missing him from a purely basketball standpoint.


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[Kepner 1,261]

Rivals had Abell and Roth as 3 stars:

Roth had offers from Notre Dame, Saint Louis, Bradley.
Abell had offers from all over, Butler, Xavier, Penn St., Seton Hall, etc....

Not apples to apples.

Hulls was a borderline 4star, Sheehey was a top 150 guy.

Who is the last player we recruited with an Unrated status. Shouldn't happen.


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WEll it differs from site to site. One of the recruiting websites I looked at had Roth and Abell as two star recruits coming out of high school, Hulls and Verdell Jones as low 3 stars and Sheehey as a low 3 as well.

[Kepner 1,261]

I wasn't trying to say that April and Priller are the same type of player as all the players that I listed. I'm just saying that we have had players before that weren't super highly recruited and I think there should be an option to bring in a few unknowns every now and then. Not a big deal.
By the way, as I've learned from people around here..just because a school has interest in a player, doesn't mean jack. (i.e. Duke's "high interest" in Hulls). If we want to count interest as something then April had serious interest from Marquette and Arizona State. Priller had serious interest from Miami, Texas Tech, and Arkansas. Not big ten schools, but competitive D1 schools

 

 

[Kepner 1,261]

I understand the notion that not everyone can be a starter and believe others understand that too. In regards to priller, what I don't understand is what value they think he brings now or down the line. We have a kid in the same class in Max Hoetzel that is a better clone of Priller. Same size, Max is faster, more athletic and can shoot the longball as well or better than priller. Without any inside knowledge on this, I can't help but believe that the staff brought him in because we had no other options and could easily oust him a year later without anyone missing him from a purely basketball standpoint.


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Hoetzel and Priller are not the same player. Hoetzel is an inch or two smaller than Priller. Hoetzel can drive the ball at shoot the long ball, whereas Priller excels in the pick and pop and pick and roll game. They both are outstanding shooters. I think we are in for a treat at Hoosier Hysteria this year and during the season to have some great shooters who can really drain it from deep. We have Yogi, JBJ, Rob Johnson, Zeisloft, Priller, and Hoetzel who can all drain it from deep. Comparing that to last years roster is scary!

[8bucks 6,477]

Hoetzel and Priller are not the same player. Hoetzel is an inch or two smaller than Priller. Hoetzel can drive the ball at shoot the long ball, whereas Priller excels in the pick and pop and pick and roll game. They both are outstanding shooters. I think we are in for a treat at Hoosier Hysteria this year and during the season to have some great shooters who can really drain it from deep. We have Yogi, JBJ, Rob Johnson, Zeisloft, Priller, and Hoetzel who can all drain it from deep. Comparing that to last years roster is scary!

Priller can handle jump ball opportunities better too.




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[Basketball4iU 2,006]

MikeRoberts----I am curious about your argument about Hulls having an actual offer from Duke. Is that true?

The reason I ask is that an IU Insider once told me he only actually had "interest" from Duke or an offer to allow him to walk on---anyone know for sure?

In any event---I loved Jordy and am sure glad he ended up at IU!

For the record...Jordan had offers from Duke, Purdue, Stanford, Belmont, IU, and too many mid majors to count.


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