New Hires - Poll and Articles (Read before voting please)

[Southside]

Please read at least the first article before voting.

Pretty decent article on Woodson, and one further below on Matta (when Bama was looking for a coach).

https://assemblycall.com/mike-woodson/

Recommend reading the entire article above, but here are the cliff notes of cons/pros. There's a section on each of the pros. 

Quote

 

First, the argument against Mike Woodson.
It goes something like this:

1. He’s never been a head coach or assistant coach in college before.
2. He’ll be 63 years old when next season starts.
3. He’s been a head coach for nine seasons in the NBA and won only 46.3% of his games.
4. Do high school recruits really care that he scored 2,000 points, was a Big Ten MVP, and played in the NBA over a million years ago?
5. Is he really going to grind on the recruiting trail?
6. We need to modernize the dusty traditions of IU basketball, not double-down on them.

The 5-point argument in favor of Mike Woodson as Indiana’s next head coach

 

1. His NBA coaching won/loss record is misleading.
2. He’ll have more credibility with recruits (and their coaches) than you might think.
3. His strengths are coaching offense and building relationships.
4. Indiana basketball will immediately become a family again.
5. He’ll be motivated.

 

 

 

Here's a bonus article on Matta that I liked

https://www.rollbamaroll.com/2019/3/25/18281091/get-to-know-a-coaching-candidate-thad-matta

 

 

[Southside]

Woodson

Team	Year	G	W	L	W–L%	Finish	PG	PW	PL	PW–L%	Result
Atlanta	2004–05	82	13	69	.159	5th in Southeast	—	—	—	—	Missed Playoffs
Atlanta	2005–06	82	26	56	.317	5th in Southeast	—	—	—	—	Missed Playoffs
Atlanta	2006–07	82	30	52	.366	5th in Southeast	—	—	—	—	Missed Playoffs
Atlanta	2007–08	82	37	45	.451	3rd in Southeast	7	3	4	.429	Lost in First Round
Atlanta	2008–09	82	47	35	.580	2nd in Southeast	11	4	7	.364	Lost in Conf. Semifinals
Atlanta	2009–10	82	53	29	.646	2nd in Southeast	11	4	7	.364	Lost in Conf. Semifinals
New York	2011–12	24	18	6	.750	2nd in Atlantic	5	1	4	.200	Lost in First Round
New York	2012–13	82	54	28	.659	1st in Atlantic	12	6	6	.500	Lost in Conf. Semifinals
New York	2013–14	82	37	45	.451	3rd in Atlantic	—	—	—	—	Missed Playoffs
Career		680	315	365	.463		46	18	28	.391

[Southside]

Matta

 

Statistics overview

Season	Team	Overall	Conference	Standing	Postseason
Butler Bulldogs (Midwestern Collegiate Conference) (2000–2001)
2000–01	Butler	24–8	11–3	1st	NCAA Division I Round of 32
Butler:		24–8 (.750)	11–3 (.786)
Xavier Musketeers (Atlantic 10 Conference) (2001–2004)
2001–02	Xavier	26–6	14–2	1st	NCAA Division I Round of 32
2002–03	Xavier	26–6	15–1	1st	NCAA Division I Round of 32
2003–04	Xavier	26–11	10–6	T–4th	NCAA Division I Elite Eight
Xavier:		78–23 (.772)	39–9 (.813)
Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2004–2017)
2004–05	Ohio State	20–12	8–8	6th	Ineligible
2005–06	Ohio State	26–6	12–4	1st	NCAA Division I Round of 32
2006–07	Ohio State	35–4	15–1	1st	NCAA Division I Runner-up
2007–08	Ohio State	24–13	10–8	5th	NIT Champion
2008–09	Ohio State	22–11	10–8	T–4th	NCAA Division I Round of 64
2009–10	Ohio State	29–8	14–4	T–1st	NCAA Division I Sweet 16
2010–11	Ohio State	34–3	16–2	1st	NCAA Division I Sweet 16
2011–12	Ohio State	31–8	13–5	T–1st	NCAA Division I Final Four
2012–13	Ohio State	29–8	13–5	T–2nd	NCAA Division I Elite Eight
2013–14	Ohio State	25–10	10–8	5th	NCAA Division I Round of 64
2014–15	Ohio State	24–11	11–7	6th	NCAA Division I Round of 32
2015–16	Ohio State	21–14	11–7	7th	NIT Second Round
2016–17	Ohio State	17–15	7–11	T–10th
Ohio State:		337–123 (.733)	150–78 (.658)
Total:		439–154 (.740)

[HoosierAloha]

1. I don't know

He was on very few people's top coaching lists after Archie was canned.  That says something.  It's the Indiana thing to do and kind of falls in line with what Indiana has done over the last 20 years.  I wouldn't expect anything less.  With that, it can work out IF the ******* university decides they'll let the basketball compete on an even, or at least close to even, level as other top programs around the nation.  Unfortunately, I have my doubts they suddenly start allowing that to happen.

2.  I like it

He has proven he can get it done at the collegiate level and used some of what was stated above to get it done.  Interesting to see what he can do and is allowed to do here.

[IU Scott]

3 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

1. I don't know

He was on very few people's top coaching lists after Archie was canned.  That says something.  It's the Indiana thing to do and kind of falls in line with what Indiana has done over the last 20 years.  I wouldn't expect anything less.  With that, it can work out IF the ******* university decides they'll let the basketball compete on an even, or at least close to even, level as other top programs around the nation.  Unfortunately, I have my doubts they suddenly start allowing that to happen.

2.  I like it

He has proven he can get it done at the collegiate level and used some of what was stated above to get it done.  Interesting to see what he can do and is allowed to do here.

Actually it is not even close to what we have done the last 20 years

[Southside]

14 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

1. I don't know

He was on very few people's top coaching lists after Archie was canned.  That says something.  It's the Indiana thing to do and kind of falls in line with what Indiana has done over the last 20 years.  I wouldn't expect anything less.  With that, it can work out IF the ******* university decides they'll let the basketball compete on an even, or at least close to even, level as other top programs around the nation.  Unfortunately, I have my doubts they suddenly start allowing that to happen.

2.  I like it

He has proven he can get it done at the collegiate level and used some of what was stated above to get it done.  Interesting to see what he can do and is allowed to do here.

I don't see this as similar to the past two decades at all.

One thing I love about Matta, is his teams shot very very well (see link/article). If he is a shadow assistant, or just working with Woodson on how to structure practices/drills, etc., then I like our chances to improve significantly in that area. I have to imagine that SD and both these hires had pretty clear conversations about vision, and expectation, and I'm sure the shooting struggles were a big part of the conversation. And if so, I'm sure the conversation was a tap to Matta's shoulder.

[HoosierHoopster]

I fall right into the majority in both questions, 1. don't know and 2. I like it. 

But that's the thing with polls the questions leave a lot of room without explanation. It's not "talking myself into it," it's more sitting back and thinking about it, I see a lot of reason for cautious optimism, and that's where I am with  hiring Woodson.

He built the Hawks into a 53 win team and the atrocious Knicks into a 54 win team. He BUILT those teams, into WINNING teams. He was brought back in as an asst because of how good he is, in his team development and developing player relationships and respect, and his coaching acumen, he's a strong coach, hands down. If we see people questioning his player sub patters I'm just going to laugh. 

His players really like and respect him. IU players are going to give him immediate respect. IU recruits are going to be intrigued by his NBA history and connection (of course he has excellent connections, the tweet someone posted is laughable). 

But what really stands out to me is the addition of Matta as an assoc AD. That's some serious outside the box work and Woodson isn't some ego nut, he's going to be working with Matta on the recruiting end etc. Talk about a major asset. 

And I expect to see player 'returns' from the transfer list sometime this week after his talks with players tonight, and look forward to seeing how our recruiting develops. I'm optimistic on the recruiting side for sure. kids / their families / their HS coaches will give Woodson's NBA pedigree good consideration. 

Said it elsewhere, I'm cautiously optimistic. So 'don't know' in the poll but it's a little more positive than that for me.

Edited March 29, 2021 by HoosierHoopster

[HoosierAloha]

12 minutes ago, Southside said:

I don't see this as similar to the past two decades at all.

One thing I love about Matta, is his teams shot very very well (see link/article). If he is a shadow assistant, or just working with Woodson on how to structure practices/drills, etc., then I like our chances to improve significantly in that area. I have to imagine that SD and both these hires had pretty clear conversations about vision, and expectation, and I'm sure the shooting struggles were a big part of the conversation. And if so, I'm sure the conversation was a tap to Matta's shoulder.

IU finally hired an IU guy.  That's different.  When IU could have hired someone with a much better resume or more qualified for the position they went a different direction.  Hence, why it is the same.

I guess we'll see how it turns out.  I'm saying the likelihood of failure is much higher than the likelihood of success.  It's where we are as a program.  I'm not looking for people to like what I posted or agree with it.  Indiana has been much different in the last 20 years than it was in the previous 20.  There are reasons for that and it's not JUST the head coach of the basketball program.

[Southside]

1 minute ago, HoosierAloha said:

IU finally hired an IU guy.  That's different.  When IU could have hired someone with a much better resume or more qualified for the position they went a different direction.  Hence, why it is the same.

I guess we'll see how it turns out.  I'm saying the likelihood of failure is much higher than the likelihood of success.  It's where we are as a program.  I'm not looking for people to like what I posted or agree with it.  Indiana has been much different in the last 20 years than it was in the previous 20.  There are reasons for that and it's not JUST the head coach of the basketball program.

I'm not looking for agreement either lol. 

I do agree IU is not the same for the last 20 years. IMO, we're not a top 10 destination, and probably not a top 20 lol. I think the only sex appeal we have is with kids from IN who still have parents that remember the good ole days. And I think the admin and BOT care a lot less about sports than they should. If I had to guess, the boosters are driving the good things, like buy outs, facility upgrades, etc.

I do like Woodson more than most though. If I'm a kid, a guy that's been coaching in the NBA for 20+ years wows me more than mid major guy with a few good years of college experience, or a guy from non-blue blood P5.. And I also think adding the extra layer of Matta fills the college experience holes quite well. And Woodson doesn't look, or come off as, 63 to me either.

So right now I'm happy. And the right assistant hires could make me really happy. 

[BadgerVol]

I was devastated at first and warming up. Like it’s been said if you’re a betting man there’s more reason to bet this won’t work than it will.

I like the addition of Thad but here’s the catch. Thad always had the wrap (right or wrong) that he wasn’t a great X’s and O’s Guy he was a hardcore recruiter than over powered teams with talent. Woodson doesn’t know recruiting. Does this mean somehow these two factors come together in this “perfect match” OR in 3-4 years are we all saying “what a CLUSTER this whole thing was from the start.”

To me this looks like a group of kids building a tree house from dumpster diving at a construction site. Hope the staff assembled blows me away. Otherwise there’s some skill and aspects from multiple people that if we’re in one could be stellar, but idk any examples of successful programs built with a two headed dragon.

[jmsgws]

I've now had the chance to get a good night's sleep after learning of the hire.  I am still very middle of the road.  

I read a take by Osterman in the Star, that I really find myself agreeing with.  I think what I find the most frustrating is that IU couldn't even hire a coach that is able to handle the job by himself.  They had to go out and hire a second coach to coach the coach.  I guess I AM, like my kids say, the grumpy old man living in the past.  DARN, I thought that would hold off at least until 60.  

I hope this works, I hope I can go back to being excited about IU BB.  All I can do now is wait and see the results.

[Banksyrules]

Ugh through the poll it looks no one thinks this is a home run.   I would’ve been OK with this if we did our due diligence with other coaches.  This choice feels myopic. 

[Trish]

1. Unhappy

We'll give him a chance, you simply have to. This is the riskiest hire outside of Dane Fife or another mid-major. He wasn't on my list and frankly I think it says more about the program than it does about Scott being a good AD. He's 63, has never coached a dramatically different game of college basketball nor has he recruited. He also was an NBA head coach when basketball was simply different. He hasn't been a head coach in seven years! I'm curious to see if kids will be lining up to play for an older NBA assistant coach. Maybe!

 

2. I don't know yet

Unless Scott announces in the presser this morning what exactly Thad we'll do, we may simply never know. Using common sense I imagine he's basically an advisor. Advisor to recruiting, back channeling, program direction and overall X's and O's consultant. I just hope he's bought in and earns his pay-check. He hasn't coached or recruited in four years so the combination may seem sexy on paper but.. we'll see. 

[jmsgws]

35 minutes ago, Banksyrules said:

Ugh through the poll it looks no one thinks this is a home run.   I would’ve been OK with this if we did our due diligence with other coaches.  This choice feels myopic. 

I am confident that IU did their due diligence with other coaches.  I think this wound up being the best option available.  There were way to many days of silence for this to be even option B or C on the wishlist.  

 

[Elstrick0908]

I'm honestly pretty excited about it, but I selected 1) Happy 2) I like it. 

I think this is out of left field (in a positive way), placing Thad as a GM of sorts, assisting Woodson with coaching evaluations, player evaluations, making connections in the AAU/High School world, etc. etc. 

The supporting staff will be crucial, specifically from the aspect of grooming a coach in waiting. I truly think this is a positive outside of the box approach that can win (and even trendset) in today's cbb landscape.

Edited March 29, 2021 by Elstrick0908

[Banksyrules]

18 minutes ago, jmsgws said:

I am confident that IU did their due diligence with other coaches.  I think this wound up being the best option available.  There were way to many days of silence for this to be even option B or C on the wishlist.  

 

I could only go by the information given by our “insiders”. It seems like they only interviewed Calbert Cheaney , Woodson, and Stevens and that’s it.  Again perfectly happy to be wrong. 

[jmsgws]

"Interviewed" could be very true. I thought I had read somewhere that they talked to Keith Smart as well. 

However, if Dolson, didn't reach out to the people for some of the college coaches that have been mentioned, and possibly even other people in the NBA then he shouldn't be in the job and we will probably be looking for a new AD pretty soon as well.  :) 

[Str8Hoosiers]

I voted Atomic Butt Hurt as I HATED this hire when announced.... I don't know if it was arrogance, or stupidity but I really thought we had a shot at at least a few guys who I considered TOP TIER..... This came out of nowhere for me (even though the Tea Leaves saw it coming)....

But I have slept on it, I have read about Woodson, I have tried to digest it all... And everything many people are putting out there now seems to say it is a decent hire..... the records aren't great but they are better than what he inherited, the history is old but it is a history.... I guess i have moved up from Atomic Butt Hurt to at least Unhappy, and maybe even to I Don't Know Right now...

I do know I am an IU FAN and always will be, I made some bad jokes about becoming a Colorado Buffaloes fan or something but I know that could never happen, I will happily throw on the CandyStripe pants and the jersey for HH or the 1st game..... and hope for the best.

 

As far as Matta, I think this is an excellent move. I think this shows we are at least serious about being Top Notch....

[Southside]

After reading more and sleeping on it, I'm more happy (I was already a little positive).

And I love the fact Matta was added to address potential holes. Tip of the hat to Admin for not being cheap.

Looking at these areas....

Player development - Get's an "A". Matta never got (IIRC) a ton of 5 stars at Butler, Xavier, or OSU. But he killed development. Woodson's teams improved every year but one.

Recruiting - Get's a B. Matta knows every inch of the MW and AAU circuit. Woodson is a passionate guy and his players like him. That's a good combo.

Shooting - Gets an A. Matta's teams were lights out. Good FG, FT, and 3pt.

Defense - B. Both have good track records here.

Xs and Os / scheme - TBD. Depends on how the two guys meld, but knowing what Dolson described, I think there are some assumptions you can make that it will be more modern.

Indiana/MW knowledge - A+

[HoosierAloha]

1 hour ago, Southside said:

After reading more and sleeping on it, I'm more happy (I was already a little positive).

And I love the fact Matta was added to address potential holes. Tip of the hat to Admin for not being cheap.

Looking at these areas....

Player development - Get's an "A". Matta never got (IIRC) a ton of 5 stars at Butler, Xavier, or OSU. But he killed development. Woodson's teams improved every year but one.

Recruiting - Get's a B. Matta knows every inch of the MW and AAU circuit. Woodson is a passionate guy and his players like him. That's a good combo.

Shooting - Gets an A. Matta's teams were lights out. Good FG, FT, and 3pt.

Defense - B. Both have good track records here.

Xs and Os / scheme - TBD. Depends on how the two guys meld, but knowing what Dolson described, I think there are some assumptions you can make that it will be more modern.

Indiana/MW knowledge - A+

Matta won't be developing players although he'll be able to direct Woody and the assistants.  Matta was able to land a ton of talent at O$U.

2007 - Koufos, Turner Diebler all top 50

2008 - Mullens, Buford top 25

2010 - Sulinger, Thomas, Sibert all top 50

2011 - Scott, Ross, Thompson top 50 Williams just outside top 50

2013 - Loving, Williams top 75

2014 - Russel, Bates-Diop top 50 Tate just outside

2015 - Lyle top 50 Giddens just outside top 50