So some concerns I’m having...

[Brass Cannon 24,069]

1 minute ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

Sure it's ok, but when people are saying Archie isn't the answer because we have played the last 4 games shorthanded and question the system, to me that is cliff jumping and panic. Read my previous post

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Who is saying that Archie isn't the answer and the mess this team has been going back to last years final 3 games makes what's Archie's system a legit question. 

[JSHoosier 19,609]

1 minute ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

Sure it's ok, but when people are saying Archie isn't the answer because we have played the last 4 games shorthanded and question the system, to me that is cliff jumping and panic. Read my previous post

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I haven't seen anyone say he isn't, just people being concerned.  And injuries this year have zero impact on his teams always being lousy from the line.

[Maedhros 613]

11 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

And we weren't a full healthy team for the last 4 games. We were against Marquette. The same Marquette team that beat Louisville

Factually incorrect. We had the same players available against Marquette as we had for Arkansas and UC Davis. We actually had Zach and Devonte back against Duke. I'll give you the UT Arlington game, when De'ron sat and Al had to leave after only giving 11 minutes.

[Josh 12,381]

18 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

Sure it's ok, but when people are saying Archie isn't the answer because we have played the last 4 games shorthanded and question the system, to me that is cliff jumping and panic. Read my previous post

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That's not it.  I'm still not sure you're hearing what we're saying.

Our struggles with UCD and UTA are frustrating.  Couple that with blowout losses on our court to Indiana State and Fort Wayne (who?), and losing in the BTT to Rutgers....and there's a pattern.  It's concerning.

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,121]

Who is saying that Archie isn't the answer and the mess this team has been going back to last years final 3 games makes what's Archie's system a legit question. 

Go back and read the posts. I saw some questioning his system. That is the same as questioning the coach.

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[Brass Cannon 24,069]

1 minute ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

Go back and read the posts. I saw some questioning his system. That is the same as questioning the coach.

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A) No it’s not. And B) Pretty sure people are asking what is because there doesn’t appear to be one 

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,121]

Factually incorrect. We had the same players available against Marquette as we had for Arkansas and UC Davis. We actually had Zach and Devonte back against Duke. I'll give you the UT Arlington game, when De'ron sat and Al had to leave after only giving 11 minutes.

How many minutes did they play against Duke? I don't recall Green playing in the first half and McRoberts late in the first half. Were they 100 percent?

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[Maedhros 613]

Flip the burden of proof. What evidence have you seen that Archie's system is working, or is the long term answer? I would say our turnovers were much improved over the course of last season, but they're back with a vengeance this year. Our team defense was also impressive in conference play, but if the team doesn't know how to play together on offense, what have you gained?

I'm still waiting for Archie to show me something before I believe all the people telling me the future is bright or that we're on the right track. I thought I saw it with the Marquette game, but so far I've yet to see those results replicated. 

[mdn82 25,464]

Who is saying we aren’t going to make the tourney. The fact that the bar is making the tourney is concerning though. 

I think after missing the tourney last year and the year before, making the tourney should be our goal this year. That would be progress. We absolutely have to play better than we have the last four games to get there. But I think that is a solid goal coming into this year. Am I wrong?


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[mdn82 25,464]

We also would probably have had quicker success had Archie installed a man-to-man defense instead of going from CTC's-no defense philosophy  to the Pack-Line. 
 
Why is IU always going through a complete rebuild when other programs plug in a new coach and have success in shorter time periods. (ex. Louisville, Ohio State, etc.) 
 
 
 
 

Louisville is 4-2. Just beat MSU at home. OSU had a four year 5 star. Do I think Archie does the same at OSU last year? I don’t know but doubt it. I liked Holtman and those two were who I wanted. Main difference between the two was Holtman’s lack of success coming into Butler.


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[mdn82 25,464]

Flip the burden of proof. What evidence have you seen that Archie's system is working, or is the long term answer? I would say our turnovers were much improved over the course of last season, but they're back with a vengeance this year. Our team defense was also impressive in conference play, but if the team doesn't know how to play together on offense, what have you gained?
I'm still waiting for Archie to show me something before I believe all the people telling me the future is bright or that we're on the right track. I thought I saw it with the Marquette game, but so far I've yet to see those results replicated. 

I loved the Archie hire and still do, but there isn’t much we can point to at this time. The free throws don’t really surprise me because his teams have historically never shot them well. But my main concerns are on the defensive end. The lazy rotations and lack of communication are troubling. The basic principles of the pack line we are failing at. IMO our players are playing soft. Their body language is awful. He needed to light a fire under their @$$ three games ago.


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[Brass Cannon 24,069]

10 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

I think after missing the tourney last year and the year before, making the tourney should be our goal this year. That would be progress. We absolutely have to play better than we have the last four games to get there. But I think that is a solid goal coming into this year. Am I wrong?


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I think having 2 top 5 players in the conference we should aspire for more than squeaking into the tourney

[IUc2016 7,064]

7 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

I think having 2 top 5 players in the conference we should aspire for more than squeaking into the tourney

your prediction of 8-9 wins in NC and 12-13 wins in the BIG is hardly squeaking into the tournament. The BIG is loaded this year. 

[Brass Cannon 24,069]

7 minutes ago, IUc2016 said:

your prediction of 8-9 wins in NC and 12-13 wins in the BIG is hardly squeaking into the tournament. The BIG is loaded this year. 

That prediction is what I thought the Big Ten was weaker I would expect Fewer now

[tortex28 379]

I think after missing the tourney last year and the year before, making the tourney should be our goal this year. That would be progress. We absolutely have to play better than we have the last four games to get there. But I think that is a solid goal coming into this year. Am I wrong?


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No, you're not wrong

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[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Flip the burden of proof. What evidence have you seen that Archie's system is working, or is the long term answer? I would say our turnovers were much improved over the course of last season, but they're back with a vengeance this year. Our team defense was also impressive in conference play, but if the team doesn't know how to play together on offense, what have you gained?
I'm still waiting for Archie to show me something before I believe all the people telling me the future is bright or that we're on the right track. I thought I saw it with the Marquette game, but so far I've yet to see those results replicated. 

The only “proof” is the improvement of last year’s team from November to April. Remember the lows this team produced early on? We still missed the tournament, but no one believed the roster assembled was going anywhere under any coach in 2018. From the stand point of who is ready to contribute now, this is mostly that same team with a freshman PG being asked to fill the starter role immediately and a 5* guard who is clearly having some growing pains coming to college.

Before the season began I was not convinced we fully solved our immediate PG needs no matter how great RP becomes. We also still do not have any rim protection given Davis is barely back from his Achilles injury. These were major gaps and issues last year, and were, understandably, only partially addressed over one off season.

I feel many let their expectations grow after the Marquette game beyond what they were during the off-season, and that has created room for outsized disappointment. The last four games have been ugly, although they “won” the second half of the Duke game and were a tip-in away from a really strong road win. Finally, I expect to see similar improvements between now and April, just like last year, which is why despite the concerning play I am not worried. If this team has not grown come April, then I’ll join those asking what the hell is going on.


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[jk34 1,105]

2 minutes ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

The only “proof” is the improvement of last year’s team from November to April. Remember the lows this team produced early on? We still missed the tournament, but no one believed the roster assembled was going anywhere under any coach in 2018. From the stand point of who is ready to contribute now, this is mostly that same team with a freshman PG being asked to fill the starter role immediately and a 5* guard who is clearly having some growing pains coming to college.

Before the season began I was not convinced we fully solved our immediate PG needs no matter how great RP becomes. We also still do not have any rim protection given Davis is barely back from his Achilles injury. These were major gaps and issues last year, and were, understandably, only partially addressed over one off season.

I feel many let their expectations grow after the Marquette game beyond what they were during the off-season, and that has created room for outsized disappointment. The last four games have been ugly, although they “won” the second half of the Duke game and were a tip-in away from a really strong road win. Finally, I expect to see similar improvements between now and April, just like last year, which is why despite the concerning play I am not worried. If this team has not grown come April, then I’ll join those asking what the hell is going on.


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Great post! 

[Josh 12,381]

17 minutes ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

The only “proof” is the improvement of last year’s team from November to April.

I keep hearing this, and I keep thinking about losing to Rutgers in the first round of the BTT.  A game we were out of from the start.

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

I keep hearing this, and I keep thinking about losing to Rutgers in the first round of the BTT.  A game we were out of from the start.

Yep - one game. It happened and it sucked. Team still improved over the course of the year. Does that one game disprove my point? I don’t know - depends on how cynical or worried you are I guess. There’s no right answer. Just stating why I’m not worried 7 games into Archie’s second year at the helm.


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[Brass Cannon 24,069]

Just now, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Yep - one game. It happened and it sucked. Team still improved over the course of the year. Does that one game disprove my point? I don’t know - depends on how cynical or worried you are I guess. There’s no right answer. Just stating why I’m not worried 7 games into Archie’s second year at the helm.


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Of course they improved. They stunk so bad nowhere to go but up