The Rotation

[Hoosierfan222 734]

Starters-

Yogi

Robinson

Williams

Sheehey

Vonleh

 

Back-ups-

Gordon

Hollowell

Perea

Etherington

Davis

[cappymo14 2,276]

Well Marlin is reputed to be a good shooter, but he never takes a shot. Perea gets fumble fingers too much, and Howards going to a few points here and there off of putbacks. The only one who looks like  he is getting some scoring instincts is AE and at this point he is a complimentary guy, not someone who can put a team on his back. The lineup I would like to see the most of is Vonleh, Yogi, Sheehey, Robinson and Etherington. Bring Howard, Williams and Gordon as subs. The rest of them filler minutes.

Totally agree, Marlin and Howard don't even think about, thinking about, shooting the ball.  Now, I know people are critical of Williams and Hollowell but I like their length and rebounding ability.  Ethrington is last year's Sheehey, no more.

[cappymo14 2,276]

Starters-

Yogi

Robinson

Williams

Sheehey

Vonleh

 

Back-ups-

Gordon

Hollowell

Perea

Etherington

Davis

Go with it!  That lineup is formidable and can play with anyone in the B1G.  AE, JH, EG each get 10-12.  Thought it might be interesting to play Vonleh and Perea at the same time on offensive possessions, with NV on the perimeter to stretch out the zone.

[Scooter D 928]

I don't think he was being serious.

 

Still though, Knight's motion offense did a lot of things that would greatly help Crean's half court offense:  off ball screens, curls, flashes, back screens, etc.  He also ran plays that were designed to get shooters open, defenders would've been worn out from chasing Hulls around the court because Knight would've ran him off screen after screen after screen.

 

No...I wasn't, but thank you for making my point more explicit.

[All_Hoosiers 873]

[quote name="yogisballin" post="34819" timestamp="1391390512"]I know this has been discussed on here before. There is no reason in this world we need to be playing 12-13 guys a game! We don't have 12-13 guys (right now) that are B1G basketball players. Love our walkons but they are walkons for a reason! I know Howard does somethings "decent" and doesn't make mistakes but other than not making mistakes does the kid give you? NOTHING!!! So let's keep him and JM on the bench where they belong. Here's the guys that need to play.

Yogi
Vonleh
Sheehey
Williams
Robinson
Perea (10 minutes at best, unless foul trouble)
Gordon (same as Perea)
Davis (would like to see get more time)
Etherington (5-8 mins)

and when/if Hollowell gets his head out of his butt, he takes Davis' spot.[/quote]

Hanner should never play. Devin Davis should never play. Give me Jeff Howard all day over them.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

[HoosierReb01 7,511]

On a team that had good proportion of upperclassmen Troy, Davis, Hollowell, and Perea would all get very, very few minutes this year. Troy needed at least another year to develop into significant minutes, and I doubt that would mean starter. The other three would probably not see significant time till they were juniors or seniors. And I'm not sure about that. You can talk athleticism, height, vertical leap, etc., but they just don't have a lot of basketball IQ, and at least in Pereas case, a real lack of talent.  

[JSHoosier 20,466]

On a team that had good proportion of upperclassmen Troy, Davis, Hollowell, and Perea would all get very, very few minutes this year. Troy needed at least another year to develop into significant minutes, and I doubt that would mean starter. The other three would probably not see significant time till they were juniors or seniors. And I'm not sure about that. You can talk athleticism, height, vertical leap, etc., but they just don't have a lot of basketball IQ, and at least in Pereas case, a real lack of talent.  

Oh, I'm really tired of us taking fliers on these project bigs like Perea.  He's gotten better, but still not enough to trust on the court and warrant time.  Crean hasn't had a good track record with them.

 

I'm against them because players like Hanner and Jurkin didn't grow up playing the game, now they have to learn a position that takes longer to learn.  That's not an easy task when you don't have a feel for the game.

[OliviaPope40 6,632]

I'm not big on using Marlin but I guess coach feels like everybody has to see the court even if they shouldn't.

[ElectricBoogaloo 4,307]

I agree that Howard has been good at playing defense and taking care of the ball, definitely better than Hollowell, Perea and Davis.

There is no reason Johnny Marlin should ever see the court. He adds nothing on offense, has given up a couple turnovers, and can't play defense.

[cappymo14 2,276]

[quote name="ElectricBoogaloo" post="34949" timestamp="1391407958"]I agree that Howard has been good at playing defense and taking care of the ball, definitely better than Hollowell, Perea and Davis. I think JH can out play Howard anytime, anywhere. Not saying Howard can't play, I think there are minutes out there for him, but without that transfer, Howard doesn't see the court. Jeremy, in my opinion, has a much bigger upside in the box scores. Heck, neither is perfect right now. Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

[JSHoosier 20,466]

[quote name="ElectricBoogaloo" post="34949" timestamp="1391407958"]I agree that Howard has been good at playing defense and taking care of the ball, definitely better than Hollowell, Perea and Davis.

I think JH can out play Howard anytime, anywhere. Not saying Howard can't play, I think there are minutes out there for him, but without that transfer, Howard doesn't see the court. Jeremy, in my opinion, has a much bigger upside in the box scores. Heck, neither is perfect right now.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

Hollowell does have more upside, but we're in the situation we can't afford to just play him (and Davis/Hanner) hoping he'll suddenly figure it out.  Howard plays because he hurts us less than the alternatives, it's not good but it's the position we're in right now.

 

We need wins, if that means playing the guy with a lower ceiling right now because he doesn't hurt us as much then Howard it is.

[cappymo14 2,276]

Hollowell does have more upside, but we're in the situation we can't afford to just play him (and Davis/Hanner) hoping he'll suddenly figure it out.  Howard plays because he hurts us less than the alternatives, it's not good but it's the position we're in right now.

We need wins, if that means playing the guy with a lower ceiling right now because he doesn't hurt us as much then Howard it is.

Ok, I'm just saying that this lineup and the distribution of minutes worked.  We won a big game because we played our best players for once.  Williams had 21, JH and AE had 10 a piece, Gordon 16 and Perea 7.  I can live with that because it worked.  Jeremy took a couple shots and played good D.  I don't believe Howard would have attempted a shot If he had 20 minutes.  Maybe more pt would get Jeff some confidence but after a win like that, I'm afraid to tinker anymore.  Maybe trim 5 from Williams to get Howard a look but I don't know, wish I knew if he could shoot or not.  Anyway, moot point because CTC is probably gonna play em all regardless.

[Will_Padgman 194]

Hanner should never play. Devin Davis should never play. Give me Jeff Howard all day over them.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

 

Never playing = never learning. Not a good combination. I'm not saying they deserve double digit minutes, but being in the gym and practicing only gets you so far. Gotta play the game

[djsalway 4,161]

Never playing = never learning. Not a good combination. I'm not saying they deserve double digit minutes, but being in the gym and practicing only gets you so far. Gotta play the game

 

I agree that playing in games will help them get better, but with the season coming to a close and us being on the bubble for the tourney, they shouldn't be playing very much, if at all.

[JSHoosier 20,466]

Ok, I'm just saying that this lineup and the distribution of minutes worked.  We won a big game because we played our best players for once.  Williams had 21, JH and AE had 10 a piece, Gordon 16 and Perea 7.  I can live with that because it worked.  Jeremy took a couple shots and played good D.  I don't believe Howard would have attempted a shot If he had 20 minutes.  Maybe more pt would get Jeff some confidence but after a win like that, I'm afraid to tinker anymore.  Maybe trim 5 from Williams to get Howard a look but I don't know, wish I knew if he could shoot or not.  Anyway, moot point because CTC is probably gonna play em all regardless.

I don't even want Williams getting that many minutes.  He's been better lately, but has also been Jeremy Hollowell levels of awful for most of the year.  I know people get enthused with athleticism and over look if someone can actually play the game, but right now Troy is strictly an athlete on a basketball court he's not a basketball player.  Athleticism doesn't mean much in terms of being able to play the game, and I think the staff is putting way too much emphasis on that quality.

 

Williams is the kind of player I'm okay with getting a few minutes a game to try and make a player with his athleticism, but I don't want him getting nearly as many minutes as he has been.

[cappymo14 2,276]

I don't even want Williams getting that many minutes.  He's been better lately, but has also been Jeremy Hollowell levels of awful for most of the year.  I know people get enthused with athleticism and over look if someone can actually play the game, but right now Troy is strictly an athlete on a basketball court he's not a basketball player.  Athleticism doesn't mean much in terms of being able to play the game, and I think the staff is putting way too much emphasis on that quality.

 

Williams is the kind of player I'm okay with getting a few minutes a game to try and make a player with his athleticism, but I don't want him getting nearly as many minutes as he has been.

You make a good point.  TW is not yet an asset offensively, I would argue however, that his status as a starter, and the minutes he receives, are based more on his length, above average reach , and athleticism on DEFENSE....Where, he is a far, far better option than anyone on the bench.  That's not to say that he should always get those minutes, it's situational.  Sometimes Gordon will need to take his minutes instead, depending on the height of the guards/forwards he will cover on switches, and especially in a shootout.  But again, I say we just won a game, a big one, using the line up and minute distribution I listed above....First time since (and very similar) to the Sconnie game.  Why mess with it?  

[HoosierReb01 7,511]

You make a good point.  TW is not yet an asset offensively, I would argue however, that his status as a starter, and the minutes he receives, are based more on his length, above average reach , and athleticism on DEFENSE....Where, he is a far, far better option than anyone on the bench.  That's not to say that he should always get those minutes, it's situational.  Sometimes Gordon will need to take his minutes instead, depending on the height of the guards/forwards he will cover on switches, and especially in a shootout.  But again, I say we just won a game, a big one, using the line up and minute distribution I listed above....First time since (and very similar) to the Sconnie game.  Why mess with it?  

Interesting, but you do realize that same lineup has played absolutely atrocious in other games? So they've pulled it together for a couple of games, but what about next time when they are doing the stand around half court offense and turnover game? Just a thought but I'm not really sold on this yet.

[yogisballin 2,376]

Go with it!  That lineup is formidable and can play with anyone in the B1G.  AE, JH, EG each get 10-12.  Thought it might be interesting to play Vonleh and Perea at the same time on offensive possessions, with NV on the perimeter to stretch out the zone.

Love the idea of NV and HMP being on the floor at the same time. it would also give us a decent shooter on the perimeter. 

[JSHoosier 20,466]

Love the idea of NV and HMP being on the floor at the same time. it would also give us a decent shooter on the perimeter. 

It would also give us absolutely no one to back up the 5 spot, aside from Howard.  Hollowell and Davis shouldn't be playing the 5 at all, and really shouldn't be on the court.

 

Right now we can't play them both, simply don't have depth without Luke.

[cappymo14 2,276]

It would also give us absolutely no one to back up the 5 spot, aside from Howard.  Hollowell and Davis shouldn't be playing the 5 at all, and really shouldn't be on the court.

 

Right now we can't play them both, simply don't have depth without Luke.

Very true I guess. Just was probing for people's thoughts on using Vonleh on the perimeter against the 2-3 the way that Wisconsin uses Kaminski.  Works very well for them because of his size and shooting ability, the bigs have to come out to guard him instead of packing in.  He just shoots right over the top of everyone else.  That's why I wanted to try HMP at the same time.  You are very right though the more I think about it.  I can see them both picking up fouls, and then what?  I guess I'm just scared to death of us playing a zone heavy team.  It's a huge problem in my opinion, bigger than any lineup conversation.  We look lost against it.