2026-27 Roster/Portal/how to fix the roster?

[Stuhoo]

1 minute ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Performance standards were set by the coach with those funds by picking the roster he picked.  
 

anyway, hopefully this offseason he’ll demonstrate the desire to field a strong team that covers the basics that winning teams need.  That I, from my couch projected right along the way. 

Okay... I'll bite:

Give me one single statement from Darian Devries where he set won/loss record expectations for the current season.

Or, are you stating that the one and only factor that sets expectations is a direct correlation between program budget and won/loss record, and that are other factors affecting results are irrelevant to expectations?

[Uspshoosier]

3 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

like the Atwells

He was the Wrong guard but you get what I was saying 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

4 minutes ago, Home Jersey said:

I doubt the market value for potential returners is any better than their current deal at IU, but maybe. Big offseason ahead.

Right, so the math equals and we only free up money from our top 6.  But we are still repaying 7-13 equal deals or we are dumping them and getting other cheap fillers.  We aren’t at an advantage on these kids. Pay is the same and maybe they help, maybe they don’t.  Spending better for top 5 will be key just like it was for this season.

[str8baller]

26 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

Add Louisville to the list.   They spent a ton of money and were meant to compete for a top spot in college basketball.   0-8 against their hardest 8 games.   No wins against top of the bracket teams.   They are definitely going to make the tourney however for fan expectations and what they spent you could argue they have underperformed.   I’ve seen a couple most disappointing teams in college basketball list this year and IU hasn’t been mentioned in any of them.  To me not many besides their fans expected them much out of them  this year 

They’re one of the ones I was thinking of. I didn’t name them because UK spent more and they lost last night so their fans were extra mad online.  
 

Also, I don’t like thinking about Lville because if I had to pick one coach/program comp for Devries it would be what Kelsey is doing at Lville. I see some similarities anyways.  That isn’t going as well as intended so I’m ignoring it. Lol

[WayneFleekHoosier]

5 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Okay... I'll bite:

Give me one single statement from Darian Devries where he set won/loss record expectations for the current season.

Or, are you stating that the one and only factor that sets expectations is a direct correlation between program budget and won/loss record, and that are other factors affecting results are irrelevant to expectations?

Budget is #1 and #1 by a large margin for comparative metrics and expectations. 
 

Coaching acumen is often more or equally important. But great staffs overachieve the metrics of budget.  That’s the parameters. 
 

what other metrics do you want to use to set expectations?

[Home Jersey]

5 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Right, so the math equals and we only free up money from our top 6.  But we are still repaying 7-13 equal deals or we are dumping them and getting other cheap fillers.  We aren’t at an advantage on these kids. Pay is the same and maybe they help, maybe they don’t.  Spending better for top 5 will be key just like it was for this season.

For sure.

To get 5 spots, we need two transfers. The likeliest candidates (Ristic, Andrej, Harris, Drake) probably aren't making much, so sending them packing won't free up much more money.

If the seniors are making ~7M, that should be plenty to add 5 quality players IMO. Very eager to see how we move in the portal. 

[Hoosierfan2017]

4 hours ago, Uspshoosier said:

If you have a 18 year old son or daughter they have only seen IU with a winning conference record in 4 of those years.   Instead of worrying about fielding a roster that is competing for the top of the B1G focus on building a roster that can actually produce a winning conference record in back to back years.  When you can do that then worry about taking over the B1G.  

If you had a 137 year old son going into his freshman year at IU in 2024, he would’ve only seen IU win a bowl game in 3 of those years. Two years later that youngster watched IU win the national championship. 

The past doesn’t really matter anymore in today’s college landscape. Not if you’re a legit coach. Not when you can pay millions of dollars to players. BYU of all places is landing 5 stars, and it’s not because 18 year olds are hyped to abstain from the typical collegiate extracurricular activities. It should be much easier for a coach to get IU basketball back toward the top of the conference than it should be to win a football national championship at IU, but the basketball program seems cursed. 

[Stuhoo]

6 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Budget is #1 and #1 by a large margin for comparative metrics and expectations. 
 

Coaching acumen is often more or equally important. But great staffs overachieve the metrics of budget.  That’s the parameters. 
 

what other metrics do you want to use to set expectations?

Last year's national champs Florida disagree. They dominated with an estimated NIL budget of $8 million. Their natty game opponent Houston was definitely not a relatively big spender.

Not to say that a top ten budget isn't helpful - it is (and if we had one this year we likely would have had enough to overpay for a true big with a pulse). But neither team in last year's national championship game had a top ten budget.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

1 minute ago, Home Jersey said:

For sure.

To get 5 spots, we need two transfers. The likeliest candidates (Ristic, Andrej, Harris, Drake) probably aren't making much, so sending them packing won't free up much more money.

If the seniors are making ~7M, that should be plenty to add 5 quality players IMO. Very eager to see how we move in the portal. 

Agree!  I think we end up with 5.  And not all seniors this time.  I think we try to keep guys that get minutes now.  The non players are anyone’s guess. I wish I could have seen Drake and Harris.  I’m whatever about our end of bench guys.  I want to keep Sisley and have him shoot 500 free throws a day all offseason.

[str8baller]

17 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

And that can be at least partially explained by having to pay 'transfer in' price for everyone except for Sisley and the two Eastern Euro kids.

Not if you’re comparing CDD to what those coaches did in their first year. Like we’ve discussed a bunch before, if CDD can at least get into the dance this year he’s roughly on a Pat Kelsey/Lville path.
 

Obviously guys like May and Pope and Cal were able to do a little more their first year. I think that’s where the “new coach/new team” cap comes into play.  A 4 seed and a S16 would put you into that best performance you can expect with a brand new portal team territory.  
 

It might not mean much, but at least the optics of always being 2nd rate compared to your peers isn’t great. 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

2 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Last year's national champs Florida disagree. They dominated with an estimated NIL budget of $8 million. Their natty game opponent Houston was definitely not a relatively big spender.

Not to say that a top ten budget isn't helpful - it is (and if we had one this year we likely would have had enough to overpay for a true big with a pulse). But neither team in last year's national championship game had a top ten budget.

Coaching and scouting are deeply important but you have to start somewhere that is a neutralizer for competition.  Izzo, Sampson, Painter, etc, etc.  prove that Budget isn’t the end all be all but it’s a starting point.  And critical to compete. 
 

and using scout and coaching as the other important metrics, I’d say DeVries has nothing to. Brag about.  

[Stuhoo]

Just now, str8baller said:

Not if you’re comparing CDD to what those coaches did in their first year. Like we’ve discussed a bunch before, if CDD can at least get into the dance this year he’s roughly on a Pat Kelsey/Lville path.
 

Obviously guys like May and Pope and Cal were able to do a little more their first year. I think that’s where the “new coach/new team” cap comes into play.  A 4 seed and a S16 would put you into that best performance you can expect with a brand new portal team territory.  
 

It might not mean much, but at least the optics of always being 2nd rate compared to your peers isn’t great. 

Agree.

May, Pope, and Cal were pretty much best case examples.

BTW, in year two, May is still a great example; Pope is sliding into the abyss, and Cal is solid but not great.

[Stuhoo]

Just now, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Coaching and scouting are deeply important but you have to start somewhere that is a neutralizer for competition.  Izzo, Sampson, Painter, etc, etc.  prove that Budget isn’t the end all be all but it’s a starting point.  And critical to compete. 
 

and using scout and coaching as the other important metrics, I’d say DeVries has nothing to. Brag about.  

Well ****, now we agree!

 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

Well ****, now we agree!

 

And now thoughts on DeVries in these regards?  Hence, we need as much money as we can get.  lol.

[str8baller]

3 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Agree.

May, Pope, and Cal were pretty much best case examples.

BTW, in year two, May is still a great example; Pope is sliding into the abyss, and Cal is solid but not great.

And Tang is out. McCasland is excelling. Byington too. But Devries has some peers in guys like Odom and Archie's brother and Jai Lucas.  There’s some data points out there for comparison. 
 

Honestly, if he can make the tourney, even the playin game like Woody, he has a chance to flip the narrative. He’ll have some missteps, but he’ll be close enough to other coaches in his situation and have  enough legit excuses, most people will be excited about the future. I think. 

[Uspshoosier]

14 minutes ago, str8baller said:

if CDD can at least get into the dance this year he’s roughly on a Pat Kelsey/Lville path.

That’s where I differ then most I guess.   For me IU was the same team all year whether the make it or not.   A flawed roster not good enough to compete for the upper B1G.  They were projected a bubble team and that’s what they are up until this point.  All those teams that barely get in to those projected out are basically the same team.   Optics for fans I guess make it more tolerable if they make it compared to not however the flaws that need improved were going to need improved regardless of it they squeak in or not.    

[Uspshoosier]

19 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Painter, etc, etc.  prove that Budget isn’t the end all be all but it’s a starting point

Purdue was one of the teams projected to spend 8-9 range this year right below the 10 spenders (this group had Auburn in it as well)

[Stuhoo]

43 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

And now thoughts on DeVries in these regards?  Hence, we need as much money as we can get.  lol.

My thoughts are, unlike developing culture, scheme, and attention to details, how to wisely spend a budget is much easier to learn. Also thinking that a staff that was put together way too late is a serious hindrance to player evaluation.

[str8baller]

1 hour ago, Uspshoosier said:

That’s where I differ then most I guess.   For me IU was the same team all year whether the make it or not.   A flawed roster not good enough to compete for the upper B1G.  They were projected a bubble team and that’s what they are up until this point.  All those teams that barely get in to those projected out are basically the same team.   Optics for fans I guess make it more tolerable if they make it compared to not however the flaws that need improved were going to need improved regardless of it they squeak in or not.    

But that was Kelsey last year too. And you just said they were big spenders this year. How do you think that happened? Their alumni and donors were happy with his turn around from the previous two years and opened up the check book.  
 

Getting into the tourney might be the difference between $12mil and $14mil next year. Maybe not. But the people he needs to win over aren’t us metric nerds on a message board. They’re people who might like to hop on their jet and spend a few nights in San Antonio or Atlanta watching us in the tourney for the first time in 3 years.  If they wanted to throw money away at a guy who could reliably land on the wrong side of the bubble they could’ve kept Woody. 

[Uspshoosier]

46 minutes ago, str8baller said:

Getting into the tourney might be the difference between $12mil and $14mil next year

It’s been reported their NIL will be more then last year regardless of if they make it