What if Coach Knight had not been fired

[OliviaPope40 6,514]

In the pilot episode of "The Sopranos," Tony Soprano narrates the state of his world -- and lays out the defining theme of that landmark series -- in one crisp four-sentence cluster: 

"It's good to be in something from the ground floor. I came too late for that and I know. But lately, I'm getting the feeling that I came in at the end. The best is over." 

Tony was talking about the Mafia, but he was really talking about America. Later in the episode, even as he reveals his own depression in the office of a psychiatrist, he pines for a bygone era: 
 

"Nowadays, everybody's gotta go to shrinks, and counselors, and go on 'Sally Jessy Raphael' and talk about their problems. What happened to Gary Cooper? The strong, silent type. That was an American." 

Fourteen months after the Sopranos premiered on HBO, Indiana University President Myles Brand placed legendary men's basketball coach Bob Knight on "zero tolerance" probation. The university had been embarrassed by a CNN/Sports Illustrated video of Knight allegedly choking player Neil Reed, and Brand had seen enough. Seven months after that, Knight passed a student named Kent Harvey on IU's campus. Harvey asked "What's up, Knight?" According to Harvey, Knight grabbed him by the arm and lectured him on showing the proper respect. He was "Mr. Knight" or "Coach Knight." Brand asked the coach to resign. When Knight said no, Brand fired him. 

It's been 14 years -- has it really been 14 years? -- and the whole thing still feels fresh. That goes for Indiana fans, obviously, but it also applies to the sports world at large. It's impossible to overstate this: Knight's firing was a massive deal. A media circus flooded Bloomington, Indiana. Students rioted, destroyed campus statues and hanged Brand in effigy. When Knight held a farewell news conference at Dunn Meadow on Sept. 13, 6,000 fans showed up to say goodbye. Just like that, Indiana's own charismatic, bruising, beloved icon, who had for 30 years dominated Bloomington like a don, was gone. 

Depending on your perspective, the reasons for Knight's firing were either warranted or silly. Was he a bully? A man out of time? Zero tolerance sounded New Agey anyway. Soprano might have thought him an American. 

Whatever your view, the impetus of Knight's departure made it easy for IU fans to ask that age-old question: What if? 

What if Bob Knight hadn't been fired? What if he had just ignored the smart-aleck college student? What if Harvey hadn't greeted him in the first place? How would the next 10 years have gone? 

The first problem with this counterfactual is that, based on his track record, Knight seemed bound to offend Brand again. The reason he was fired for such a minor offense was that it didn't happen in a vacuum. The choke scandal had happened just a few months earlier. That February, IU athletic director Clarence Doninger alleged the coach had physically confronted him after a game. There was an issue with a potted plant and broken glass and an apology to a secretary. There were various versions of various stories, but whatever the details, clearly Brand was very much on edge. 

But let's say the Harvey incident never happened. Obviously, Mike Davis doesn't win the public support of his players and thus the head-coaching position. Does Indiana still make its run to the 2002 national title game? Davis' offensive style was vastly different from Knight's, and, for one season, it really worked: Instead of classic motion offense, the Hoosiers spaced the floor, iso-style, and let Jared Jeffries go to work. Would Knight's more rigid system have maximized those players? What if, what if. 

Either way, assuming Knight didn't run afoul of Brand again in the near future, there's no way he would have left Indiana at any point before he decided to go. He surely would have stayed at the school at least as long as he spent at Texas Tech -- until 2008. 

No matter what Knight's teams would have done in that time -- and when he was fired, they hadn't been to the Sweet 16 since 1993-94 -- it would have been better than the Davis era. Knight's retirement would have taken on a ceremonial flavor. A successor would have been blessed. A Jim Calhoun-esque position would have been created. The schism within Indiana's fandom -- from former players to Knight loyalists to people just plain fed-up -- would never have happened. And the dramatic drop-off under Davis that led a panicked Indiana brass to hire a fresh-off-NCAA-probation Kelvin Sampson in 2006 would have been unimaginable. 

Knight is now 73. At some point, the tenure would have ended. Maybe his son, Pat Knight, would have succeeded him. Who knows how that would have gone? It's not inconceivable, in this alternative scenario, that an intact Hoosiers program could have hired Tom Crean by now. 

 

We'll never know, of course, because "What's up, Knight?" happened, the CNN tape started looping and, well, you know the rest.

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/99949/what-if-bob-knight-hadnt-been-fired
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Edited August 15, 2014 by OliviaPope40

[ccgeneral 38,084]

Thanks Olivia. This should create a spark. We haven't had a RMK debate for a while now. 

[ccgeneral 38,084]

I'm a loyal follower, but he can kiss my ass now! I truely dig his style, but society is soft and he went overboard a bit.

[OliviaPope40 6,514]

Thanks Olivia. This should create a spark. We haven't had a RMK debate for a while now. 

I can delete it if need be.

[ccgeneral 38,084]

I can delete it if need be.

Why? It's all good hun. I seen this earlier and was going to start it myself. Sometimes I feel like I'm at a nursing home in here. I'm about to light up a few members/mods....

[OliviaPope40 6,514]

Why? It's all good hun. I seen this earlier and was going to start it myself. Sometimes I feel like I'm at a nursing home in here. I'm about to light up a few members/mods....

Did tiny hack your account?

[ccgeneral 38,084]

Did tiny hack your account?

No, he stole my damn stash again.

[Schreckbagger 620]

From 46 of us......F Brand.

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[Recycled Hoosier 4]

The late Myles Brand, perhaps with encouragement/approval of key IU-Bloomington faculty, was DETERMINED to get rid of Coach Knight.

 

No. Matter. What.

 

Once Brand's mission/vendetta at IU was accomplished, he left IU in 2002 to become President of the NCAA in Indianapolis until his death on September 16, 2009.

 

Brand's repugnance of Knight continued at the NCAA, sometimes in laughable ways:

 

Coach Knight's photo (in Texas Tech garb) in the NCAA Hall of Champions in Indianapolis, was hung "In Exile" in a deserted corner, next to an access panel, at the end of a hallway, away from everything else!

 

Here's the image I snapped at the NCAA Hall on April 8, 2004:

[attachment=1084:Knight in Exile 2004-04-08_0046.jpg]

 

And here's another angle:

[attachment=1085:Coach Knight in Exile #2 2004-04-08_0048.jpg]

[mdn82 25,510]

The only thing I go back to is Pat Knight would have been our next head coach.  He would have done terrible, and we would have had him here too long considering who his dad was.  He would have been fired and RMK would have been pissed at us for it either way.  Watching him coach was incredible, but watching how he has acted over the last 15 years has been equally eye opening. 

[mdn82 25,510]

No, he stole my damn stash again.

 

That little bastard needs to quit doing that.  

[schoosier 3,475]

The late Myles Brand, perhaps with encouragement/approval of key IU-Bloomington faculty, was DETERMINED to get rid of Coach Knight.
 
No. Matter. What.
 
Once Brand's mission/vendetta at IU was accomplished, he left IU in 2002 to become President of the NCAA in Indianapolis until his death on September 16, 2009.
 
Brand's repugnance of Knight continued at the NCAA, sometimes in laughable ways:
 
Coach Knight's photo (in Texas Tech garb) in the NCAA Hall of Champions in Indianapolis, was hung "In Exile" in a deserted corner, next to an access panel, at the end of a hallway, away from everything else!
 
Here's the image I snapped at the NCAA Hall on April 8, 2004:
Knight in Exile 2004-04-08_0046.jpg
 
And here's another angle:
Coach Knight in Exile #2 2004-04-08_0048.jpg

A chipped access panel to boot.

[BubbleKnuts 569]

I'm sorry but.. Wow. . <br /><br /><br />Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

[Josh 12,625]

&nbsp;

The only thing I go back to is Pat Knight would have been our next head coach. &nbsp;He would have done terrible, and we would have had him here too long considering who his dad was. &nbsp;He would have been fired and RMK would have been pissed at us for it either way. &nbsp;Watching him coach was incredible, but watching how he has acted over the last 15 years has been equally eye opening.&nbsp;

&nbsp;

Probably true, but we would have avoided the whole Kelvin Sampson bomb that landed on the program, so we'd at least be in better shape than we are now

[Chips&Dipo 1,464]

When Knight was fired he hadn't won a National Championship in 13 years. I wonder how the fan base would have acted if it had been 15+ years. I am doubtful that many would be so loyal then. 

My uncle and I have this conversation all the time about what would have happened to Knight if he had won a championship sometime in the 90s. I am of the impression that he would have not been fired, but because there had been such a time lapse the upper management was shorter with his range.

 

This is all speculation and opinion however. 

[CampHoosier 3,697]

He was wrongly fired by people no longer affiliated with the University. The fact that he won't come back just one time for a curtain call baffles me. I can understand being bitter. But when an entire state is calling your name, when an AD and a coach write to you to come back, and when a team you built is on its heels trying to scrape back in to prominence, just sack up Bob. Maybe he doesn't know what it would mean for us to give him his farewell. Maybe he doesn't care. He sure didn't mind coming back for his book tour. 

[ALASKA HOOSIER 11,264]

To have Mr. Knight come back to AH would be friggin' incredible! Talk about motivation for a team/fanbase!

[Hovadipo 56,066]

[quote name="Alaska Hoosier" post="78731" timestamp="1408118938"]To have Mr. Knight come back to AH would be friggin' incredible! Talk about motivation for a team/fanbase![/quote]

Good luck getting a ticket to that one. Sheesh I can't even imagine.


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[FortWayneHoosier 6,120]

Good luck getting a ticket to that one. Sheesh I can't even imagine.


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lol totally agree, ticket prices would sky rocket.

[BlueDevil 8,687]

[quote name="Hovadipo" post="78733" timestamp="1408119163"]Good luck getting a ticket to that one. Sheesh I can't even imagine.


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Like hoosier hysteria 2 years ago 10x