College Bball Thread

[HoosierTrav 8,299]

They don't play the Wiscy/Butler type hard nosed defense and will try to run. I'll be surprised if we don't win, keep it close.

They don't prefer to play a grind it out style of defense but they sure can. They beat wisky very badly at wisky' game.

[Ranger78 1,293]

Good Game between Butler and Utah.


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[Ranger78 1,293]

Is the pressure to win higher @ IU or UCLA?


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[Uspshoosier 53,940]

Is the pressure to win higher @ IU or UCLA?


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I would say the pressure is higher at IU because when iu was down it was a packed house. They can't get people to show up at UCLA even when they are good


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[Ranger78 1,293]

I agree. I watched a preseason UCLA game and I think they had about 150 people in the stands. Not the same animal ...


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[Ranger78 1,293]

If we can get out to a good start, I think we handle UNC. We need to start seeing some leadership being established on this team.


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[WayneFleekHoosier 51,157]

Good lord, UK...


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Yup. Clicking on all cylinders so far. &@%#%£€


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[Ranger78 1,293]

I think if you took this IU team/staff moved them a 100 miles and called them Hickory they would go far. I'm not sure they have the on court leadership to deal with the pressure that comes with playing at IU. This is NOT a knock on this team. Just an observation of what might limit this team. We need to change our recruiting model and start leaning on senior players more. This team with a couple of true seniors would be scary. The Hartman injury was huge.


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[WayneFleekHoosier 51,157]

I think if you took this IU team/staff moved them a 100 miles and called them Hickory they would go far. I'm not sure they have the on court leadership to deal with the pressure that comes with playing at IU. This is NOT a knock on this team. Just an observation of what might limit this team. We need to change our recruiting model and start leaning on senior players more. This team with a couple of true seniors would be scary. The Hartman injury was huge.


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Interesting thought. The star freshman model works, and especially when mixed with key returnees. But if you can't get them, senior leadership is the next best option.


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[HoosierAloha 30,102]

Leadership is an easy excuse. We have a senior Hartman, juniors RoJo and JBJ but we lack leadership? All those players have played significant roles from freshman year on. I don't like Crean's model of "everyone needs to be a leader." I don't see a model out there that "everyone is a leader" that works. Even in the elite of the elite spec ops units you have a ranking structure. I would like to see captains and see them shoulder that burden.

[Ranger78 1,293]

I wasn't trying to make an excuse. Hartman would help on the floor. Yep you need a leadership chain that this team lacks, which I guess was my point.


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[Ranger78 1,293]

I agree the 5 star freshman works, but I'm not sure we're going to win that battle, so I would shift and try a different model. We can't play the 5 star model loosing the recruiting battle and compete. If that doesn't work, I would change my method and go towards the Wiscy and Villanova model.


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[Ranger78 1,293]

I've watched Oregon a few times this year and I'm not impressed.


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[HoosierAloha 30,102]

I wasn't trying to make an excuse. Hartman would help on the floor. Yep you need a leadership chain that this team lacks, which I guess was my point.


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Without a doubt Hartman not being on the floor hurts but having captains and a "chain of command" does wonders. Crean is huge on "peer leadership" but it flows from the top down. We have a system that doesn't really involve one and dones. In your first year or two you need to learn to follow before you can lead. As an sophomores and juniors you can still lead even if you have older players above you. I just don't see this consistently from Crean coached teams at IU.

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

I agree the 5 star freshman works, but I'm not sure we're going to win that battle, so I would shift and try a different model. We can't play the 5 star model loosing the recruiting battle and compete. If that doesn't work, I would change my method and go towards the Wiscy and Villanova model.


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I believe only puke and Duke have won a natty with more than one one and done in the OAD era. We need talented youth but also experienced upperclassman leaders.

[HoosierRob 1,042]

Well that butler game is looking pretty tough now.

[Ranger78 1,293]

I agree. Leadership is an issue. I think a different model that promotes senior leadership might be the answer (even out the classes). But I agree you can get leadership from many areas, which I don't think this team has yet. You're pointing to Crean and his ideology, which might be the underlying issue. I don't know, but that's a valid point.


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[WayneFleekHoosier 51,157]

I believe only puke and Duke have won a natty with more than one one and done in the OAD era. We need talented youth but also experienced upperclassman leaders.

The trend is relatively new and UK and Duke's success continue to prove its worth. The Duke model is better in that 1-3 players leave versus 4-6 from UK. Duke returns numerous 5 stars every year. Dukes model is perfect.

We can't compete with them in recruiting so we are forced into a more challenging model, that can certainly work, but brings about more risks and more competition. Instead of being able to act/recruit like a top 5 program, we are relegated to recruit like a top 25 program and hope we can make up the difference in scouting, development, etc.

If we could recruit like Kansas, Duke, Arizona, UK, Crean would do it in a heartbeat because it works and those programs are consistently at/near top each year. The other model has bigger fluctuations and are affected more heavily by early departures/transfers and such.




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[WayneFleekHoosier 51,157]

Another model that has impressed me is Gonzaga. A little basketball school, with seemingly little to offer fields a nationally competitive team every year. Good recruiting, great transfer additions.

Indiana should be able to aim higher because we are Indiana, but Gonzaga consistently does more than it ever should. Good every year it seems.


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[Uspshoosier 53,940]

Another model that has impressed me is Gonzaga. A little basketball school, with seemingly little to offer fields a nationally competitive team every year. Good recruiting, great transfer additions.

Indiana should be able to aim higher because we are Indiana, but Gonzaga consistently does more than it ever should. Good every year it seems.


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Gonzaga model helps being in a small conference. Before byu joined all they had to compete with was st Mary's. as gonzaga has gotten better they have finally scheduled a tougher non conference. Before this gonzaga was the hardest team to seed each year


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