Jeff_Boy_Ardee

Personal opinion, but I don't agree at all when people say he developed Vic. Look at how many talented players he's had come in and they've never gotten really any better. I think Vic's development was 90% Vic working his ass off in and out of practice and setting a goal for himself and not settling for less. Yes, Being at IU let him shine more so than he would have at a lesser school that he probably would have winded up at, but Vic got better every year, not many others Crean players get better at all it just is what it is.

Also worth noting, though Fife was an IU guy, he is from Michigan. I believe he was considering transferring to Michigan State when Knight was let go and was part of the team that asked they make Davis HC.

I understand what you're trying to say, and not trying to sound argumentative or anything like that, I do respect your thinking. I would just like to add that it's not easy to win a championship anywhere, outside the regulars, I would say Bennett has a better chance than most. Out of the last 20 years there have only been 10 different programs to win it all, 14 in the last 30 years. Those numbers may be have by 1-2 but for the most part, out of 64 teams the same few programs win it almost 50% of the time. But we can all go back and forth in different views and opinions all day and no one is really wrong. Hopefully the end of the season will have the answer to all of our prayers and we can all begin to argue when and where the party will take place.

I think you have it backwards. Offense will keep you in a game (as evidence by our Hoosiers) defense will lose you a game (also evidenced by our Hoosiers). It's nice to be sable to drop 90 points every night but if you give up 91 who cares. You have to be able to make the big stops in a right game to win. Bennett may not have a flashy offense but as others have noted, they are efficient. I think he would do fine the the B1G where his style is better suited. The following picture may be irrelevant, but over the last 10 years, 5 winners have scored under your 70 number and 5 above it and all have been fairly close games with the exception of a few, suggesting The team that was able to make defensive stops when it mattered pulled it out.

Courtesy of the Purdue Student section (got this from a mutual friend, I don't associate with them) but I found this humorous

Haha, *cried my bad

Yea lol, we all know the story about the boy who reid wolf

I get what you're saying, and I am a fan of Archie and would fully support that choice. I would just comment though, that if Donovan came here, even for 10 years, it's going to be even easier to find lots of interest from the next coach. Yea Archie may be gone by then, but there should be another Archie type guy, or even better. If Donovan came here I would fully anticipate IU being a prime destination for coaches to want to come to when he was getting close to retirement. Similar to what we are starting to see from Duke and UNC.

At this point, Im okay with the theory of rooting for IU to lose, not rooting for the other team to win. If that makes sense. Edit: root for Tom Crean to lose.

As of now he is still the HC so he still has duties to fulfill. If I'm going to leave my job I don't just show up to work and not do my job while I'm still there. That's all I get from it, not reading too much in to it. Besides even if he is coaching somewhere else next year he is still going to want Romeo whether he has a chance or not.

I've always thought Fife would make a good HC somewhere, I really wish he would have more experience as a HC so we could have more of a sample. I think he will be a HC someday, but I don't know if the risk is worth it. The ONLY way I see it happening is if we fire Crean and can't get any of our top 5 or so coaches and then give him a chance with he understanding he has 3-4 years to show something. I think that's highly unlikely though. I do wish him the best though, I really enjoyed watching him play. My favorite all time team (in my lifetime) was that 2002 team.

I agree with you. I think my point is looking at the record is one thing but looking at the season and coach as a whole changes things. Archie looks piss pour on the above but a lot of people like him and I can see why, I think he's good also. You could argue Marshall underachieved but his teams, for the most part, were never out of it before it began. I always felt like they had a chance to knock off a better team. I think I'm just so ready for Crean to be gone I'm looking for positives in every possible candidate and defending them for no reason. Lord please help us.

I think people underestimate how difficult the tournament can be to win a title. You need to have great players, great coaching, great chemistry, all clicking at the right time. There's no recipe to throw together and out pops a title. What I want is consistency. If you are consistently making the tournament and winning some games you out yourself in a position to make that title run. I tank that's what we all want. Obviously the number one goal is a title, but it's much more difficult to win one when you're not consistent. I don't know if it's fair, for lack of a better term, to pass on a coach just because they didn't win it all. I love the back and forth this board brings, everyone brings valid points to both sides of the topic. I found it interesting to blindly look at some tourney finishes of some coaches for the last 5 seasons and then look who they belonged to. There's always more to the story than just the finish. Apologize ahead of time for the long post. But here's an example: Coach A: 15/16 - Rd 32 14/15 - S16 13/14 - Rd 32 12/13 - FF 11/12 - Rd 64 Coach B: 15/16 - Rd 64 14/15 - S16 13/14 - NIT 12/13 - None 11/12 - Rd 32 Coach C: 15/16 - S16 14/15 - E8 13/14 - Rd 32 12/13 - Rd 32 11/12 - Rd 32 Coach D: 15/16 - Rd 64 14/15 - E8 13/14 - E8 12/13 - S16 11/12 NIT Coach E: 15/16 - Rd 64 14/15 - FF 13/14 - E8 12/13 - S16 11/12 - S16 Coach F: 15/16 - S16 14/15 - Champ 13/14 - Rd 64 12/13 - E8 11/12 - Rd 64 Coach G: 15/16 - S16 14/15 - Rd 64 13/14 - None 12/13 - S16 11/12 - S16 Coach H: 15/16 - Runner Up 14/15 - S16 13/14 - Rd 32 12/13 - Rd 32 11/12 - E8 Coach I: 15/16 - Rd 64 14/15 - Rd 32 13/14 - E8 12/13 - none 11/12 NIT Coach A - Marshall Coach B - Bob Huggins Coach C - Mark Few Coach D - Sean Miller Coach E - Izzo Coach F - Coach K Coach G - Crean Coach H - Roy Williams Coach I - Archie Miller Now that I've typed all that out I don't really know what my point was but I didn't want to delete it. Obviously we all have our opinions as to why these coaches did or didn't do better this year or the next. Sorry for the long post, I'll retire for a couple days.

Those players were not NBA players coming in to college, which is why they ended up at WSU and not a major program. And they would never made it to the NBA had they not played for a coach who was able to take his talent, develop it, and figure out ways to compete and win against bigger programs and making those runs in the tournament. I'm not saying they were not good, but to expect him to win an NCAA title with mid major talent is a little far fetched in my opinion. Both were undrafted and are back in the D league, there are lots of players that go back to the D league (and/or never make it out) that came from college, so is it fair to say that any coach that had D league players and didn't win a title in college is an underperforming coach? I don't think so. It's not like he had Future NBA stars or even quality bench players on his team. Marshall has done more with less than many have done with more. Marshall is not my first choice, but I would not be upset at all if he were to become the head coach.

Let Crean coach those Shocker teams and they don't go that far in the tourney and those guys don't develop they way they did and don't make the NBA, just my opinion. Marshall I think deserves the credit he gets. You can't discredit someone because he had "NBA players" that he coached and developed and they got exposure because they made those runs. MVC is not spewing out NBA players too often, I think Marshall and that team chemistry and system deserve a lot of credit there. If he can get that much done with those recruits and they can develop over 4 years at an MVC school think what he could do with B1G caliber recruits.

I don't understand you're thinking at all. IU isn't a stepping stone school. A coach isn't going to come to IU to try to make some deep runs and then leave. If we were lucky enough to get Donovan, maybe we struggle next season, but after that I see I very quick turnaround. Not saying championships by any means right away, but Billy Donovan at IU is going to be a recruiting draw in itself. He'll be able to get some good enough talent to make the tourney the following year and after that I see it continually being easier to recruit. He will bring consistency that we have long been waiting for, once IU is nationally consistent and contending again there's no reason to jump ship, that just doesn't make Any sense. Still think He is a long shot, but if it were to happen it would not be a short term fix.

I know it was mentioned what the Lakers have recently done with their front office. IMO the odds that Westbrook becomes a Laker next season just went up with Magic taking control of things. Billy D may have become just a tiny bit more realistic, im willing to hold out hope on him until it's proven dead.

After listening to Dakich call the game, IMO, it seemed clear to me that he knows there's serious problems with IU. His pro Crean talk on his show is clearly for ratings.

Great read. Really hits the nail on the head. I can't stand my friends that try to tell me we're lucky to have Crean as a coach and how good he is. This article will definitely be shared with them so they can shut up and finally realize we kind of know what we're talking about. WHEN Crean is finally gone, I think many people, myself included, will appreciate what he did to help dig us out of the hole Sampson left us in. However, he's just not capable of doing anymore than what he's done. He was great at the time but that time has long passed and it's time to make the right decision and get us back to being a constant stay and contender in the tournament.

Well so much for keeping Paps Private Message, Private

This may be irrelevant and I'm pretty late getting the news, but with all the Fire Crean talk again it was brought back up. But from a very reliable source I was told the final three for the job after Davis were Sampson, Belein, and Tubby. Supposedly the administration was in talks with Belein and ready to move forward with him and he and his wife were looking to buy a home in Bloomington, but a booster came in and said no that they wanted Sampson. Curious as to if the boosters with the most influence are Crean supporters or what is going on. Again, late news but just thought I'd share.

To clarify, I'm not saying that's what I want. Just that it would not surprise me if that is Glass' thought process. He has disappointed before, just trying to keep an open mind about every possible outcome so I'm prepared for it and don't waver in to alcoholism

Edit: I realize when I say "back where we were before Crean" is not completely accurate, as I don't see it ever getting that bad again, so dont take that sentence word for word, hopefully you get what I'm trying to say

As bad as I want crean gone, which believe me is bad, I will not be surprised if he is back next year. Unless IU has a good idea they can get one of the guys on everyone's list, you risk letting him go and hiring some one you didn't necessarily want for a, let's say 3-4 year trial and fire him if he fails and now we're back where we were before Crean. Also, the way next year is looking it will more than likely be worse than this year so hay should get the hot seat talk really going on a national level and I would think help open the ears of some coaches. Again I know there's still a lot to play out for this season still and I would hope there are already birds in some ears to get some feelers on who we can realistically get after this season. I want tom crean gone as much as everyone else, just want to make sure we do our homework and get rid of him the right way and not have to go through another trial coach. Just my two cents, I'm sure there will be lots of disagreement, hopefully it brings on a good discussion.