Old Friend

I think Hunter, Geronimo, and Franklin can all play the 3 if needed.

The Big Ten is 7-41 on the road and Nebraska beat Iowa and Purdue at home. Not a meaningless win at all.

Agreed. I don't like criticizing kids on a personal level, so I'll leave my comments to "on the floor." Indiana won't miss either player on the floor, and neither provide much in the way of leadership. I really hope there's some trumpet player in the band on his way to Broadway so the crowd can be distracted by something cool because the reception for at least one of them will either be a Bronx cheer or "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead."

Funny how much better everything looks when shots go down. 16 TO's is way too many, and all of our ball handlers were too sloppy. Cleaning up the easy stuff and letting the game come will make a big difference. This team a year from now will be tough to deal with.

Dude came off the bench twice and shot it the first possession each time. "Let the game come to you" is a foreign concept for that guy How's 1-6 from the floor with 2 turnovers and a fouled 3 point shooter for a senior captain?

iU wins one. 71-66

Really? It does? Why even post this? You're not talking to a three year old. Read my post in full and apply context to it. Good grief....do you seriously think this is some enlightening realization? I even said offensively we're not there. And we aren't, I agree. But a coach is also responsible for improvement, and defense has improved. Is it written somewhere that both ends have to improve at the same speed? Indiana is a work in progress, but it's not like there's no improvement at all, nor is it time to move on. Way too much to the story. Next season? If we're in the same spot we are now? I think it's more than reasonable.

Phinisee hasn't been healthy all year and missed a few games, Hunter is still recovering and nowhere near himself yet, Green missed some time, Davis is still in recovery mode and slower than he was prior to his injury Wildly healthy seems a stretch, no?

Right now, our defense is good enough to win. Statistically way better than it was under Crean. Offensively, we're not there. Fans watch offense. Players WANT offense, and when it looks bad, people generally feel the team looks bad. I completely understand that. I'm also not blaming one class, but the reality is Archie's system and Crean's couldn't be more different. Green in Archie's system is a horrible fit. Green in most systems seems to be a horrible fit, but especially in Archie's and we still depend on him for myriad reasons beyond Archie's control - Hunter's injury a huge one in my opinion, along with Phinisee's injuries. The kids Archie recruited are playing in year 2. Durham and Smith are wild cards and I understand that. The truth is, both players' numbers are up. They're improving offensively. Are either of them truly talented offensive players? No. They're not. They are indeed "adequate." I don't think we know what Phinisee really is, but he was far from "adequate" in high school, as was Franklin. As far as getting highly ranked players? TJD was a McDonald's All American. So was Langford. He left. Hunter was Ohio's Mr. Basketball....a great recruit. He had a horrible surgery to correct a blood flow condition in his leg and obviously isn't himself. Langford was ranked #6 in the country. Hunter #37. TJD # 18 or something..don't remember, but not below 24. Saying he's not getting those players isn't accurate. He is. One left and one had a unicorn of a health problem. The other might be Big Ten freshman of the year. I'm not trying to sell you on Archie, but I AM telling you it's early to make the claim that he's no good. The perfect storm that has Indiana where it is right nor rivals one of those "you can't make this stuff up" stories. This whole program is a phenomenon, and I can tell you absolutely the fans don't help. Expectations of immediate success and that players play over their heads because "INDIANA" is on their chest (look back at old threads discussing some of the awful players some said would come here and thrive immediately), etc. I don't disagree with you that at some point it falls back on the coach, but this is really just his second season, he STILL hasn't had a year that wasn't plagued by significant injury, and last season (I'm not convinced THIS season) some poisonous locker room problems as well. Am I happy about the results? Hell no. I'm just not as ready to jump back on the carousel as some are, and I also see the defensive improvement (more evident lately) as a positive sign most won't consider. Just a different perspective.

Franklin's a freshman and I never said he would be special as a freshman. Phinisee was absolutely special before his concussion a year ago, and really hasn't been the same since..hurt all of this season, also. Saying they aren't up to the challenge is a little unfair on your part, and I don't like them solely because they're Indiana guys. Give me a little more credit than that. I like them in part because I saw Franklin score an easy 30 against Lawrence North with 3 D1 / D2 players, and I saw Phinisee outplay Langford when he was a sophomore, and also because he was the best player on the floor in a really good Logansport sectional that same year and go on to set records in that conference, which is damned good....and score 50 a couple of time along the way playing a 4A schedule and both high level Indiana all stars.. Indiana does not need "better players." Most teams in the country don't have "better players." Indiana needs its parts to fit. Indiana still has some house cleaning to do. I've also said I don't think Archie's system will ever win with young players, so whether or not there are players who are "better" at those ages is irrelevant to me. Putting what he has in position to succeed is far more important. Healthy, experienced players will do just fine. I don't think anybody really knows until we're not reliant on DeVonte Green to play well for us to beat good teams. And right now? We are. I hate that we are, but we are.

I will never understand why this board panders to certain people....... Truth? Indiana was 4-36 last night on shots that weren't layups. Archie can do nothing about that. Defensive effort and execution was more than good enough to win. 59 points on the road's a good showing by any measure. 4-36. And many were open looks. That's not all on Archie. At all.

I'm trying to wrap my hands around the logic of "when they scored, they did so with ease" as used to qualify something. Almost every team gets a few easy buckets in every game. Defense is not measured possession by possession, and even if it is, all 3 teams made some tough, contested shots also. And points allowed over a 3 game is not a technicality. It's a simple fact. Our offense is bad. No argument. We can't shoot, and we don't really have a back to the basket player except Brunk. The roster is imperfect. Absolutely no argument, but the overall point "we played well enough defensively to win" stands as called.

I'm not into nitpicking. Indiana allowed 54 points on Saturday, 59 tonight, and 62 to Northwestern. That's good enough to win anywhere, any time. Rutgers only made four 3's, so I don't think that killed us. I think our inability to shoot/score did. Our defense plays well enough to win, now, and you can always find details to be upset with.

Schilling was not reallyl a player development guy. His role was supposed to be primary recruiter in state, but the further he got away from his own AAU connections, the less role he had. I am amazed at 2 things : 1) DeVonte Green. 15 minutes, no points, no rebounds, no assists, no steals, 0-4 from the field, 2 turnovers, and a foul. There's your senior, ladies and gentlemen. I'm very done with him. Addition by subtraction. In total? Our seniors played 20 minutes and, on the positive side of the ledger, had a rebound. That's...it. By itself that gives me hope that this is the last of the clean out seasons and we can move forward from here. Good Lord, that's awful. I don't know that I can name a worse senior Indiana's ever had than Green. This team needs him. Counts on him. And he plays 3 horrid games for every decent one. And if some say I was waiting to pounce? Whatever. I would have been just as happy to give the kid credit. But he's terrible. 2) To your point, I really don't blame Archie for the fact we can't shoot. I don't know what or who to blame, but we can't shoot. At all. We got 11 more FGA's than they did. We made more FT's. We out-rebounded them, by one overall and by 6 on the offensive end. We allowed 59 points. That's enough to win. But we made 19 FG's in 40 minutes. 11 by Brunk and Smith. Offensive system problem, yes. But we can't throw it in the ocean. I promise I personally know 10 coaches who could help, but it's an off season thing.

Yep. On the bench in a sweat suit and looked very engaged. No story, here.

IU 71 Rutgers 63

You're right...I was for whatever reason thinking of a 3 guard lineup with Smith at the 4 and Brunk on the bench. Probably combining thoughts.... I think I had in my head Phinisee, Durham, Franklin, Smith, TJD and replacing, say Durham w Hunter. Good catch.

That would be helpful, wouldn't it? Going from 6'4" at that spot to 6'7" would be a gift.

I think a whole lot of that is simply confidence in his body. Between he, Phinisee, Davis, Green, and Thompson, Indiana's had an awful lot of injury problems the last couple of seasons.

No...he's not at all the reason we're struggling and that wasn't the point of those pictures, but he's a senior. Supposed to be a leader, and those pictures showed poison. His numbers and production are irrelevant if those pictures paint an accurate portrayal of his demeanor around the team and his attitude towards it. Turnovers (IU turns the ball over on 20% of its possessions. That's almost unbelievable to me) are killing this team and so many are careless and lazy. The whole team is guilty. I believe firmly that Green will be addition by subtraction. He is still careless and his decision making is awful. I know he has his moments, but he's not a leader either. His FT%, A, and REB numbers are down this season; his FG% is about even for his career, as are his TO's. And his defense is generally laughable. I'm done with him. He hasn't improved one bit and I blame him as much as any coach simply because of the way he plays. Crean never really cared if turnovers happened, and bad shots seemed to be okay sometimes. Davis moves like Fred Sanford and can't play anymore; so I don't think Indiana will miss him. Archie Miller took a Dayon team to the Elite 8. He's not a bad coach. I hear a lot how connecting with kids is so critical; and on some level it is. But, kids aren't supposed to like their coaches all the time. I didn't. But as long as I knew they were there to make me better and push me to succeed, and believed they knew what they were talking about, I didn't have to like them. Effort is something no coach should have to ask for. It's a controllable. So the hell what if Justin Smith doesn't like Archie Miller? That means he doesn't have to listen to him and can look away in huddles? That's what he's about? I know he played well in the second half the other night, and perhaps he's fine. But he wasn't for a while. Green shoots when he feels like it whether the shot comes from the offense or not? Stuff like that makes me nuts. I don't pretend to know who Archie's pissed at, but some of Indiana's problems are player related, and that's not debatable.

OSU 72 IU 65

This He could have had McKinley Wright and Nahziah Carter is a "fact?" Even if that was possible (not a definite which would be the only way it was "fact"), you're using hindsight and also trying to sell your "fact" as a negative toward Archie. Good luck making a convincing argument using that as whatever your loose definition is. If that makes you feel better, go for it. But...then look up their numbers and use REAL "facts." I assume you meant getting those two instead of Smith and Durham would have been a good thing, right? That's what you were implying? Or just that he didn't recruit those two and instead asked the two (well, 3 if you count Moore) kids to stick with their commitments? Not exactly truth to say Archie "recruited" them. He did not. Here's a REAL fact for you : Over their careers, Smith's are better than Carter's. Across the board. And Smith's SOS is way better...he plays against better teams. Durham's SOS is also much higher than Wright's is, so even if Wright's numbers are better, what does that really prove against a worse schedule (by far) 3 years in a row? So.....what's really your point other than to argue (this is a sport for me...go for it)? That Archie made a mistake by taking one player who's about not quite as good from a numbers perspective and another who's better? (That would make it a wash, wouldn't it? Why not convince the kids who already committed to stay rather than tell them to pound sand just so you can bring in different but not necessarily better kids?) Or perhaps you think it's another "fact" that those kids would have done better at IU than Durham and Smith? Your smugness is noted as usual, but do yourself a favor and do your homework before you try a sell job like this one. I'm not buying; and anyone who looks up the numbers won't either. I'll do this one for you: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/mckinley-wrightiv-1.html https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/aljami-durham-1.html https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/nahziah-carter-1.html https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/justin-smith-3.html

Do you mean "than that of an onion" or an actual onion? Look, man. When people start referencing you when you're not involved in a discussion; you can speak to this. Until then, you can't, and it won't happen at all unless you write things from time to time that don't follow every paradigm or politically correct social formula. Over the course of time, it's happened to me plenty; and there was an entire thread about me on another board a few years ago because I called out some jackass who decided he'd give out my personal information, take his ball, go somewhere else, and badmouth me to anyone who'd listen. All because I asked him once if it was his time of the month. You haven't seen ANYthing "thin skinned" unless you know that guy. It's not the first time and likely won't be the last it's happened to me. And guess what? Most of the time, it's been someone taking a shot..so I asked the guy a question and we cleared it up. Why did you choose now to stick your nose in it?

Nah. I thought you were taking a shot. Just wondered why because I hadn't even been involved. I'd get way too...verbose and exacerbate an already existing problem. "Long" is not what a writer should be known for. I do like "methodical" however. Thank you for the kind words. Have a terrific evening and weekend!

I actually use paragraphs. Why take personal shots when I'm not even involved in the discussion?