Old Friend

What strikes me? If he goes to the right game, Assembly Hall will seem like the biggest, loudest arena in the country. Any questions on why Indiana Basketball is special? Take a look at these high school gyms he's used to. (His game reminds me of someone.......) https://www.maxpreps.com/athlete/jordan-geronimo/BhSUx8yDEeeT-Oz0u-e-FA/videos.htm

We did pretty well from 1973-2000 and had 12 Mr. Basketball's commit during those years (no other school had more than 3). We also had a few very Indiana-heavy classes and periods. 1987-1991 in particular was pretty fantastic in-state : Edwards, Jones, Nover, Leary, Graham, Graham, Cheaney, Lawson, Bailey, Evans, Henderson. That's a pretty substantial run. It's absolutely been done...just not in a while. Since that time, we haven't had the right guy telling the story. I think we do, now.

Curious why you felt that way? I've said for a long time we have the best story to sell any Indiana kid, and it's really not close. (i also believe the best story always wins if you sell it right) Any player from here can go to a school out of state, but there is one school and one school only since the 1960's (unless you're Larry Bird, and even HE started here) where a kid from Indiana can go and become a legend. Where a kid from here can go and never buy a drink again. Where a kid can go and make a name for himself and the school he goes to above and beyond anywhere else. Where he can become a household name and build a program or maintain a program of legendary status. Where he can play in front of a crowd like Assembly Hall's, have first class facilities and new age technology; AND play in a conference with its own network and every major cable/satellite contract; playing in prime time slots 85% of the time. That place for Indiana kids is Indiana University.

This is a great get. First of all, from my perspective, the most important thing to me is getting smart, tough basketball players. A very close second is getting those players to hang around and get old at Indiana. We can sprinkle in the occasional high-level, one and done talent, but overall? Give me a team full of players who can shoot, who understand defensive positioning, angles, and how to be physical; and kids who can see the floor one step ahead. In Leal and Galloway, we have two such players. I've seen it mentioned here and other places that they won't come in and start as freshmen. I hope they don't because I hope they don't have to. There is a whole lot to be said for development and being great as a junior/senior. I cannot stand the mentality that says a kid has to come in and contribute right away. There are 13 available basketball scholarships. Not every kid will contribute. Some will be in developmental stage, and some may stay 5 years to get where they need to be. I LOVE the way Archie recruits. No player will be allowed to coast, now. Brunk is tough as hell and won't allow Jackson-Davis to coast. These kids won't allow anyone to coast. We're developing a culture, and I LOVE it.

I have been called a hell of a lot worse, and proud of it. I trust my eyes, and I saw it. I have been really hard on DeVonte Green, and if I'm honest with myself, I saw lots of what I believe to be team growth manifested in him. I was encouraged despite the results.

This makes me happy. I didn't see it early last season, but I did see it late. If he's happy, we're going in a good direction. He's a competitive SOB, if nothing else.

Disagree here. Every year, within a 5 hour drive of Bloomington, there are enough good basketball players to win at any level at which we want to win. However, that's not really my point, either. I, too want top recruits from anywhere if we can get them and get them to STAY. What I don't want is some coach with "connections" to some region of the country to be hired instead of someone who understands and can sell the culture here. If that's an IU guy, I'm obviously in favor of that guy, whoever he is, over someone else. If it's Jack Sprat from Iowa, great....but the real point is we've tried to hire "coaches with connections," and it's gotten us a few players, but none that helped build the program. None that helped us win. None that helped Indiana get old and stay old. None that are now ambassadors for Indiana Basketball. The regions from which we recruit aren't really the point. I think players from the midwest are generally well coached and enough of them on IU's roster (or any roster....see Michigan State) will win year in and year out. But....enough good players from Texas would too. The point is simply that I think Indiana University is a unique place and a unique sell. Tom Crean has to play the AAU and shoe company game at Georgia. That's the only way he will ever get players. I don't think that game has to be played as much here; but I DO think any coach who recruits for Indiana needs to sell this program and its history. Not all kids will buy that or want that; but we've all walked around that campus. We've all been inside that building. Guys, there ain't nothin' like it anywhere around. I don't even think we need very many NBA lottery players to win big. How many'd Wisconsin have under Bo Ryan in his 14 year tenure? Wisconsin never finished below 4th in the Big Ten under him. There are a whole lot of great basketball players who aren't influenced by shoe companies or AAU money grabs. I want those kids. And I want them for 4 years.

I get it, but we've tried "coaches with connections." We've tried east coast, west coast, south... Calbert Cheaney is on the list of "all time college basketball players." If he wants the job (caveat) and was given a prominent role; it would take him 3 days to make any connection he needed to make, and AAU is the devil in my opinion. They have zero interest in the best interests of kids; and I'd rather not hire coaches because of their AAU connections. I don't care if everyone else is doing it. I think Indiana is a school who can get kids to commit regardless of some of that peripheral stuff; and the high profile players we've signed who HAVE those connections have done absolutely nothing to build the brand of Indiana Basketball and I can't think of one who's an ambassador for the program. Oladipo was never in that category in my mind.

I don't need to through the nomenclature or definition of a difference maker because we won't agree, anyway. What you're saying doesn't really argue against the point I'm trying to make, either. When did I say we needed to limit ourselves to just recruiting Indiana? If you have to put words in my mouth to make your argument, it's not a very good argument. We have hired several coaches who had "recruiting ties" to various parts of the country, but none brought in the right players to succeed at this school or in this conference. Who was that mousey guy Crean had who had west coast ties and brought Bawa Muniru? Indiana has avoided Knight's guys - except Dakich, and giving IU guys primary roles on this staff since they fired Knight. You can judge the results for yourself, but when you and others tell me it doesn't matter, I laugh. Where's the evidence that it doesn't matter? You have 20 years of trying it the other way, right? Happy with what that's produced? I'm not. My point is culture matters. Brand matters. Bruiser Flint et al have not done one damned thing to build the culture or the brand, and in my opinion, it's time we hired someone who can.

I know.....don't be nitpicky. That's not the point. He is or was the all time Big Ten scoring leader.

I am most definitely in the minority and I know it, but I think Dakich did more for this program in the short time he was here than any other coach since 1999. He had to clean house, and he did. Many here don't like the guy, and I know that. Regarding your first....kids don't know who most assistant coaches are. Calbert is as credentialed to recruit to Indiana as anyone who would get the job. Catering to the immediate satisfaction, right now side of kids, and hiring that guy for that reason would be a mistake, I think.

I think that's fair. I differ a little because I think so much has already been tried away from someone who truly understands Indiana. If we are truly a unique and special program, in my kind, we can't limit all of our assistant coaches to basketball stuff. They all know basketball stuff. I differ w you on Flint. I think he's worthless. We have had a few worthless coaches over the years. I'm of the mindset that culture is important and Indiana needs to hire someone who has a detailed and experienced understanding of and ability to sell it. I really couldn't care less about "national recruiting ties." In all honesty....other than Oladipo, in the last 15 years, who are the truly difference.making recruits from outside a 4-5 hour drive of Bloomington's campus? A one and done like Vonleh or Bryant don't really count in my opinion.

We have been down that road. How many coaches have we hired who have had "strong ________" on paper? Hasn't worked. To me, there is no paper profile. What we really haven't done is hire an IU guy and give him large responsibility. All moot if Calbert doesn't want it, but seriously... how much national experience do you need if you understand what you're selling? "Hi, I'm Calbert Cheaney. All time NCAA scoring leader and I played at Indiana before I played in the NBA for 15 years." If I'm a kid not bound by a shoe company, I am now listening.

This has been said and accepted over and over for 20 years. "The best person for the job" has not been successfully hired yet. It's been a turnstyle of failures since Mike Davis got the job. This is a very broad brush way of looking at it. What does "the best person" look like?

That's so awesome. It sure has. My son is with me. High school CF and a huge Trout fan. Saw him drop a fly ball and hit a HR. Perfect night, too.

I think so also, but he has to want to. I just want someone who can sell and who understands the culture at Indiana. It's been missing too long and I think the administration made a huge mistake distancing the university from Bob Knight. Don't have to like the man, but like any leader, he should be and should have been evaluated and judged by the job he did, and that was undeniable.

Fair enough. If accurate....I get it.

Curious to know which part of that description you believe Calbert does not fill? He is a leader.....and I know that because I knew him in school a little, he is connected having played in the NbA for 15 years and done lots of coaching since, and he's an IU guy. Personally? I can't stand Bruiser Flint. I think he adds next to nothing. Why is Calbert a bad fit given your description? I'm at the Reds v Angel's game, so good 'tween innings conversation.

In my opinion, and this is only my opinion, if Calbert interviewed and won't get it, the person we hire will not be who we need unless it's Michael Lewis or someone like that. THIS fan wants an IU guy in that program playing a prominent role. There are a whole lot of qualified coaches. Doesn't mean they all fit here or anywhere else; and I think this is a unique place.

Exactly why I'm surprised he took the job.

I sort of meant with the background and DNA both Graves and Lickliter have, they're not going to learn much from him from a coaching standpoint. I've known the Lickliter family since I was a freshman in high school in the 1980's, Todd, while maybe not a great leader or communicator, has forgotten more basketball than McCarty knows. Walter McCarty is another coach who speaks in platitudes and cliche's. May be the nicest man on the planet...I'm just not sure I think Todd Lickliter in particular gains much from working under him except maybe he gets to stay in a good conference and in his home state.

I honestly can't believe either of those two guys took jobs to be on Walter McCarty's staff. Have heard him interviewed and speak publicly; and have been less than impressed.

His players have played exactly one season at Indiana. And he learned from that experience with a couple of them already gone. Last season, Indiana played with a freshman who really didn't have his game because of injuries and sights set to the next level (his not playing at all in the NIT was embarrassing); another freshman point guard who physically missed 6 games and probably played less than himself another 10, so Indiana was forced to play with guards incapable (until later) of running a team or guarding at the Big Ten level; an under-sized post player and no depth in the front court. I don't know about anyone else, but I saw effort improve late in the season. I saw an almost unbelievable to me metamorphosis of DeVonte Green. I saw a group of players who didn't fit here (and may have at Dayton) leave the program. I see a very successful focus on in state recruiting. I see the addition of Joey Brunk a HUGE positive. i see Jackson-Davis and Franklin as kids who will contribute immediately and likely stay for at least 3 seasons. (Get old and stay old....I'm all over that philosophy) And I see the departure of the 5* kid with the alternate agenda as addition by subtraction. Very good player and apparently a decent kid; bad fit. It happens. Still had to recruit him. I see Indiana as a program on the rise, and I believe this season will show dramatic improvement in many areas, and I do think we make the NCAA Tournament. I sincerely believe - using eyeball test only - I saw growth last season, I could almost see Archie learning. I do wish he'd hire Michael Lewis away and bring him to Bloomington, though. And in 2 years, bring Taylor Wayer back. That kid is going to be fantastic as a college coach if he wants to be.

I do feel he could do what Hulls did in 4A and wonder why you and others don't? In a much better AAU competitive environment, he's putting up 18-20 every game, plus 5 assists. Friend of mine coaches a team that played after him last week and said he scored 27 against a team with 3 D1 commits on it. He's bigger than he was as a freshman; and I see him as a very comparable player to Brody Boyd. Who was smaller. Just me, but the last thing I want to worry about is what other schools do. He wants to come to Indiana. What's the downside in saying "come on down?" Who cares if other big schools have offered or not? Calbert Cheaney didn't have many offers, either. Lots of stories about kids who did great despite having only an offer or two. It only takes one coach to believe in you. It's not a rush. It's an offer to a kid who can play. If he improves....what? He scores 35 a game. He gets 7 assists, 5 rebounds, and 2 steals a game. He'll get bigger and more physical with age and experience, so defense will come. He shoots almost 40%from behind the 3 point line....which has no bias 1A or 4A. What needs to improve except size and strength, which do and did for all of us as we matured? I think the Steve Nash comparisons are ridiculous, but then....not many if any big schools offered HIM, either. Santa Clara did, and every big school wished they had. I'm not making that comparison, but 35 a night is 35 a night.

I think this is too simplistic. First of all, Hulls averaged 16 PPG his senior year. Brown averaged almost 35. There have been a whole lot of 4A kids (Jeremy Hollowell, anyone?) who have succeeded in high school and done nothing in college; and there are plenty of 1A and 2A kids who have gone on to very successful college careers. You can either play or you can't. You either understand the game or you don't. This kid can play. You don't score 35 points a night against defense if you can't, and the 3 point line is no different for small schools than it is 4A schools. He shoots it like Hulls or even better, and I see a similar role being very attainable for Brown. To me, there's no downside to offering him. We have 2 open scholarships this season, so there's always room on a roster for a gym rat who needs polish. Would he come in and dominate as a freshman? Nope. Probably not. But there's no doubt in my mind Luke Brown will succeed as a basketball player regardless of where he goes. The small school/big school argument holds very little water in my opinion.