lillurk

The accusation that May has some IU shine blinding people is true in a way of Pearl, too, who has regional connections and a history of speaking highly of the IU opportunity

Dayton has spent ~100 years supporting basketball institutionally like most Catholic schools and has NIT banners (from a time that meant more), tournament appearances, and infrastructure to prove it. FAU is a commuter school with no basketball history. Arch still has never had a top 25 offense or defense in any season on Kenpom, nor a top 25 finish. May has both.

Check his middling Kenpom rankings!

What is the argument that May’s floor is low? Im being sincere — as far as I can tell it’s projecting prior failed MM coaches on him. The # of guys who made a final 4 at a mid major and are bad coaches…I mean, show me that guy

Put another way: it’s not impossible to evaluate mid-major coaches just because they’re less-resourced. Some of us didn’t like the Archie hire from the jump but apply similar critical lenses to May and see a guy who can level up

He got to a final 4! The same # of them as Pearl, actually, as I keep pointing out, and Pearl has spent decades at well-funded P5 schools. I feel like I’m taking crazy pills when I read anti-Dusty screeds. He doesn’t have to be everyone’s #1 but pretending you know it’ll take years to build is not how it works in a free transfer era. Every successful coach was once lesser-known. I realize we’re not going to agree but some folks act like there are only two classes of coach: “proven winners TM” clear description excluded but it matches their preferences, and guys who’ll never be anything. I promise Dusty will be good somewhere.

Don’t care at all that he was an IU manager. Care that he’s built a team better than any Archie (or Woody) team by Kenpom and tourney success AT EFF AYY YOU. Everyone wins at Dayton. Everyone’s risky, I think he’s FAR less so than most other options. Put it this way: if we made a “wins above replacement coach” that factored in program, talent based on recruiting rankings etc. May’s performance at FAU would break the charts.

A guy who’s been to a F4 has a worse resume than Archie? The same number of F4s as your beloved Pearl in 18 fewer years as a HC?????? You can just write anything on the internet.

Here’s a decent summary of what Pearl’s done, though it omits the Aaron Craft saga at UT that got him a show cause. The cumulative facts point to someone who will bend and break rules to gain an advantage and may leave the program worse in his wake. Many of the broken rules are no longer but the process speaks loudly. All that aside: 64 next month. Makes too much at AU. Not the guy, it’s fine to like him as a coach but be realistic and honest with yourselves about whether he’ll get any consideration whatsoever.

Does it change Bruce Pearl’s birth year? Does it change whether he’s been to more final fours than Dusty May, or been to one more recently?

I do wonder if Jaylin Sellers was going to head close to home (GA) and they just already knew that. But the point @RaceToTheTop is making is valid, there were myriad options available.

The part I bolded basically sums up the whole error of the pursuit strategy Woodson has deployed. (You can criticize some tactics, like his lack of involvement, too.) Feels like an obvious fallacy to anyone who’s every played, coached, or watched, IMHO — better to have more good players than [null set empty scholarship]. The difference between Sellers and Gunn/Leal/Cupps is pretty significant, even in a backup role where X was healthy all year.

Setting Quinn’s connection aside there are lots of similarities to the tail end of the Tom Allen era here.

Yep, I’ll never root against the Hoosiers but every embarrassing thing makes it easier to build the coalition to do the necessary thing.

Like a guy who went to the F4 last year and is so much better than any prior coach at his school as to be incomparable? I guess that’s my issue with “proven” “winner,” it’s slippery and in the eye of the beholder. Nobody’s hiring away a guy on this list, and on degree of difficulty, getting FAU that far is hard to top.

Re “proven”: Dan Hurley was 2-4 in the ncaa tournament until he won six straight last year. There are no guarantees but you don’t have to pick someone who’s got a long track record, there are other ways to know if someone’s a good basketball coach.

Stop the Pearl talk — he’s 3 years younger than Woody. One middling year and we’re right back here, worried about succession plans. Plus he makes more than IU currently pays its coach. You hire a coach for his future, not his past.

Not picking on you but at IU in the era of free transfers no one should be the “give him time” candidate for very long. If you start with a totally blank slate in a sanction situation? Sure, but by year two we should see something. Same if you inherit a really barren cupboard, and have to play too many green underclassmen. But nothing like what Arch inherited should be an excuse.

I’ll never root against IU but it seems obvious what has to happen and if it takes losing embarrassingly at home to PSU, Northwestern, Nebraska, getting whooped by PU 2x…I can endure it.

His defensive awareness would be below average on the 8th or 9th grade teams the middle school/HS I played at. I don’t mean to be unkind and of course plenty of players have deficiencies, develop, etc., but still being this bad in transition, switches, etc. At this point makes me worry he may never catch on.

Really think even if he tops out as a good backup Cupps eventually moves off that list. But probably not this year.

Still only 49. Not my cup of tea but I’m curious what he can do after Boo Buie graduates. If they can maintain some level of quality I wonder if he’ll get a look at a bigger job if he wants it eventually.

My guess too but UM and OSU both have seemingly obvious move on situations that may not work that way. UM because Warde Manuel has not been a very proactive AD and might not last long enough to make the decision, plus maybe they give Howard one more year due to health issues and the fact that they probably need to rebuild regardless of who the coach is. OSU because Holtmann isn’t the guy there…BUT they have an AD regime change effective on like 7/1/24 and so I wonder if they’ll want to move or let the new guy have a lame duck/prove it year.

Sure perhaps but that doesn’t invalidate my point

I know this year’s a disappointment and it might be nice to believe this but it simply isn’t true given the length of the contract, where the program was over Arch, etc