(2017) CB Quran Hafiz

[Hoosierfan2017 19,887]

7 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

That just adds more to it. He's 17, drunk, and in sketchy situations. I get that it's more common than many think but that's just fucked up.

Yeah his judgment was definitely lacking but I think some of that had to do with him being on a visit with potential future teammates and wanting to fit in with them. I'm not excusing his behavior and no one forced him to do anything but 17 year old kids are impressionable and want to look "cool" to the college kids showing them around campus. I just don't think we should give up on him and yank the scholarship, based on what I read in the article. If he raped the girl with the host he was with then obviously that's a completely different story. Deadspin's account of the event doesn't make it seem like that's what happened. 

[Josh 12,360]

Alcohol isn't an excuse. There's been plenty of drunk students on campus that haven't sexually assaulted anyone. If his mentor jumps off a bridge does he follow?

If he didn't understand the meaning of consensual before I hope he understands it moving forward. That goes for anyone that doesn't understand.

Did she tell him no? Nothing I've read indicates that. If she did, he's a rapist no question.

From her own account she doesn't know if it was consentual or not. How was he to be sure then? He wasn't even of legal age to know.

[Stuhoo 75,564]

There is a HUGE difference between what constitutes a successful criminal prosecution, and where a football program feels comfortable drawing the line with who they want in their locker room for four years

[HoosierAloha 29,887]

1 hour ago, Josh said:

Did she tell him no? Nothing I've read indicates that. If she did, he's a rapist no question.

From her own account she doesn't know if it was consentual or not. How was he to be sure then? He wasn't even of legal age to know.

So from 17 years 364 days to 18 years old you magically learn what consensual and what is not...?  It has absolutely nothing to do with her saying yes or no.  How drunk was she?  Did the Stanford swimmer hear "no?"  I have no idea what the law is in Minnesota but I've known people who have lost far more than this kid with the girl never saying no.  It's common decency not to put your penis in someone that's unsure.  I get "wanting to fit in" and "following those who are showing you around" but that excuses nothing in something like this. 

[Yogi's Picnic Basket 5,004]

I think it's important to separate what Hafiz was involved with from what happened after he left. When it's all lumped together it sounds really bad and makes bringing him into our program look like a terrible decision. Sexual assault allegations get a lot of coverage in the media today and you don't want that attached to your program. To me, what our recruit did sounds more like a drunken hookup than a sexual assault. If CTA wants to draw the line there then I don't have a problem with it, but I think he would struggle to field a team if drunken hookups were his line in the sand. 

Thank you!! I stated the same. In the video the girl is even seen taking her gum outta her mouth and saying where she didnt know what to do with it. Sorry if he was raping her or it was consensual she shouldve said something a lot different. Now after he left that part is wrong on all kinds of doings. I personally would understand either route coach takes. Whether keeping him or not. Its his team and this will be his first big decision w recruiting. I would honestly wait to hear if there is anymore to the story first and if not I would keep the kid. We had to know about all this before and until other teams pulled out we were still visiting him and his family.

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[JSHoosier 19,565]

Perhaps the girl wasn't sure if what happened was rape or not because she didn't actually say 'no', and not because she consented to some acts and not others.  Her not saying no doesn't mean she consented and it makes the situation murky.  There is such a thing as coerced consent as well and it does not make the situation better because coerced consent would still be sexual assault.

I read the article and didn't come away thinking there was consent.

[Yogi's Picnic Basket 5,004]

Perhaps the girl wasn't sure if what happened was rape or not because she didn't actually say 'no', and not because she consented to some acts and not others.  Her not saying no doesn't mean she consented and it makes the situation murky.  There is such a thing as coerced consent as well and it does not make the situation better because coerced consent would still be sexual assault.

I read the article and didn't come away thinking there was consent.

I dont think any girl consents to 10 possibly up to 20 guys honestly. That part is clear. She went to the apartment with the recruit and the football player which seems like if either of the first two he was the one pressuring her. All I'm saying is the video of her asking what to do w her gum and then making sure to say the recruit left saying this school is messed up doesn't sound like she had ill will towards him or that he sexually assaulted her. I just hope justice is served to those who came in after the first two and even he should be held accountable for not kicking everyone out. He did reach out to her multiple times so I hope he doesn't get looked at the same as the guys that sounded like pathetic pieces of well ya. It is sad that none of them understood how this would affect their futures. Sadly though there doesn't sound like enough to charge most of them with no bruises or anything showing it was forced.

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[JSHoosier 19,565]

11 hours ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

 

 

I dont think any girl consents to 10 possibly up to 20 guys honestly. That part is clear. She went to the apartment with the recruit and the football player which seems like if either of the first two he was the one pressuring her. All I'm saying is the video of her asking what to do w her gum and then making sure to say the recruit left saying this school is messed up doesn't sound like she had ill will towards him or that he sexually assaulted her. I just hope justice is served to those who came in after the first two and even he should be held accountable for not kicking everyone out. He did reach out to her multiple times so I hope he doesn't get looked at the same as the guys that sounded like pathetic pieces of well ya. It is sad that none of them understood how this would affect their futures. Sadly though there doesn't sound like enough to charge most of them with no bruises or anything showing it was forced.

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There are definitely still questions, but there will likely be a lot we never know (there always is).  I wouldn't read to much into her asking what to do with her gum, she could've been uncomfortable talking about it; there's a reason things like this many times don't get reported.

Frankly if I'm being honest what happened could have an effect on her for a long time to come (if she ever gets over it, so to speak) so the recruit losing an IU scholarship is small change, it's a privilege to begin with.  The IU staff obviously isn't the only one uncomfortable with his involvement since other programs backed off as well.

[Hovadipo 52,946]

There is a HUGE difference between what constitutes a successful criminal prosecution, and where a football program feels comfortable drawing the line with who they want in their locker room for four years

My entire point. Thank you, Stu.

I don't think he raped her after reading the report. I never have. But a football program doesn't need a conviction to decide that they don't want someone at their school. Two other schools allegedly did it. My point stems from pulling the scholly only, not whether he should be in legal trouble. If a school can pull a scholly for wanting one guy and not the other, they can sure as hell pull one for evidence of an underage kid hammered on an official visit doing the things he allegedly did.


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[Stuhoo 75,564]

4 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

 

My entire point. Thank you, Stu.

I don't think he raped her after reading the report. I never have. But a football program doesn't need a conviction to decide that they don't want someone at their school. Two other schools allegedly did it. My point stems from pulling the scholly only, not whether he should be in legal trouble. If a school can pull a scholly for wanting one guy and not the other, they can sure as hell pull one for evidence of an underage kid hammered on an official visit doing the things he allegedly did.


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Bingo.

A recruit who is a guest at a school where he is trying to show worthiness for a four year scholarship should not be wasted and double-teaming a drunk co-ed. There is not much larger a red flag than that.

 

[bhaggard89 869]

 

Bingo.

A recruit who is a guest at a school where he is trying to show worthiness for a four year scholarship should not be wasted and double-teaming a drunk co-ed. There is not much larger a red flag than that.

 

Bro that ain't double teaming. That was Three 6 Mafia "run a train" territory. (For the record, I think every single guy involved here is in the wrong.)


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[Hoosierfan2017 19,887]

How does him signing financial aid papers affect the situation if we did indeed pull his scholarship? 

[Yogi's Picnic Basket 5,004]

How does him signing financial aid papers affect the situation if we did indeed pull his scholarship? 

Doesn't matter we can still pull it. Demetrius Robertson the WR for Cal signed papers w 4 different schools last year. ND, GT, Georgia & Cal so that will have no affect. If we don't want him we don't have to take him.

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[Hovadipo 52,946]

Bro that ain't double teaming. That was Three 6 Mafia "run a train" territory. (For the record, I think every single guy involved here is in the wrong.)


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Not to mention, there were multiple "run" references made throughout the night in text messages. (Hafiz wasn't involved in those to my knowledge, just saying.)


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[Dalton26 16,891]

Bro that ain't double teaming. That was Three 6 Mafia "run a train" territory. (For the record, I think every single guy involved here is in the wrong.)


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That's kinda where I'm at with it. What he did may very well have been consensual(I lean more towards the side that he had consensual sex with her) but him saying it's fucked up and leaving without doing anything to help her makes him 100% in the wrong and just as at fault.

[lucel15 3,052]

I thought sex with recruit was consensual. Then it went to a higher level once that got over. I thought I read that in the first reports.


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[Josh 12,360]

I dont think any girl consents to 10 possibly up to 20 guys honestly. That part is clear.

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You and I hang out with different girls.

Bro that ain't double teaming. That was Three 6 Mafia "run a train" territory. (For the record, I think every single guy involved here is in the wrong.)


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Nah, that wasn't a train, it was an Eiffel Tower

[TrueHoosier62 1,592]

I don't like that the kid was in any way involved in such an act, but to a degree, I have to allow for the poor decision making of hormonally driven teenagers, (at least where there has been some level of consent, as apparently there was). Stupid actions for sure, but I can't see ruining his playing career over it. I wonder, if IU pulled his scholarship offer, and the kid could pay his own way, would he still be welcome on the team?