Money where your mouth is

[raorIU 300]

So I've read a number of posts stating something similar to: "it's time for Crean to get this team under control".  Well, let's hear it.  What exactly is he supposed to do with this situation?

It's the off season and the two latest arrests are integral to the team (do we even have another PG beyond these two?).  Do they miss two games like Hanner?  Plenty have said that short suspension was too short and contributed to the mess further.

Do they get suspended for the non-con next year?  That costs us the Big/ACC game, UL, and SMU - probably anyway.  So, what is the game plan here?  How does Crean fix it?

[BlueDevil 8,652]

For me personally I send them on a run to Los Angeles and back and call it a day. Didn't actually go to jail but it's alarming. Seems like the punishments aren't deterring them from being butt heads.

[CampHoosier 3,697]

Honestly I know Crean runs a clean program. Kids make mistakes. Own up to it and learn from it. Yogi and StanRob did. I said a lot about yogi lying today which I regret. He's a 20 year old in college. We have all been there. Instead of supporting him, I put him down. That's not what I'm about and that's not what we as a fan base should be about. If all my mistakes were documented I wouldn't have a job. I owe an apology to Yogi and the board for my statements. Mistakes are jump off points for improvements. And it wasn't even that big of a deal. Stay strong guys. We all drink. None of us are better than you. Especially me


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[bronkonagurski 894]

So I've read a number of posts stating something similar to: "it's time for Crean to get this team under control".  Well, let's hear it.  What exactly is he supposed to do with this situation?

It's the off season and the two latest arrests are integral to the team (do we even have another PG beyond these two?).  Do they miss two games like Hanner?  Plenty have said that short suspension was too short and contributed to the mess further.

Do they get suspended for the non-con next year?  That costs us the Big/ACC game, UL, and SMU - probably anyway.  So, what is the game plan here?  How does Crean fix it?

 

Suspend them for the ENTIRE non-con schedule?  Over this?  Eh, no thanks.  I do think Hanner's suspension was too short but over-punishing other players as some kind of make up for it isn't going to solve the problem.  If the rumors in the other thread about failed drug tests are true, I think consistency of punishment may be the biggest issue.  Don't play favorites, punish everyone on the same basis.  I think somebody amongst the players needs to step up as a leader too but I don't know who that would be at this point.  My hope has been Yogi would be that guy.  Otherwise I'm not sure who else to look to. 

[Stuhoo 75,677]

Honestly I know Crean runs a clean program. Kids make mistakes. Own up to it and learn from it. Yogi and StanRob did. I said a lot about yogi lying today which I regret. He's a 20 year old in college. We have all been there. Instead of supporting him, I put him down. That's not what I'm about and that's not what we as a fan base should be about. If all my mistakes were documented I wouldn't have a job. I owe an apology to Yogi and the board for my statements. Mistakes are jump off points for improvements. And it wasn't even that big of a deal. Stay strong guys. We all drink. None of us are better than you. Especially me


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You have made a post worthy of your honorable, Liger-like avatar.

 

Kudos

[drewheck 749]

[quote name="raorIU" post="62794" timestamp="1398479166"]So I've read a number of posts stating something similar to: "it's time for Crean to get this team under control". Well, let's hear it. What exactly is he supposed to do with this situation?

It's the off season and the two latest arrests are integral to the team (do we even have another PG beyond these two?). Do they miss two games like Hanner? Plenty have said that short suspension was too short and contributed to the mess further.

Do they get suspended for the non-con next year? That costs us the Big/ACC game, UL, and SMU - probably anyway. So, what is the game plan here? How does Crean fix it?[/quote] bench them on the Canada trip games or don't let them go


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[bronkonagurski 894]

bench them on the Canada trip games or don't let them go


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That is bordering on cutting off the nose to spite the face though.  I think those games up north could be a great chance to develop chemistry on the court.  I'd rather suspend them for one of the two meaningless exhibition games in Bloomington.

[JSHoosier 19,575]

I think Hanner's suspension was too short.  As for these two, I'd let them go on the Canada trip but they might not play in the first game.  Oh, and they'd have to write an essay explaining how they thought basketball players at friggin' Indiana could slip a fake ID past someone.  Or maybe I'd arrange it so they have to work with the campus grounds crew.

[IU Hoosier41 14,465]

[quote name="BlueDevil2aHoosier" post="62795" timestamp="1398479272"]For me personally I send them on a run to Los Angeles and back and call it a day. Didn't actually go to jail but it's alarming. Seems like the punishments aren't deterring them from being butt heads.[/quote]

Took close to UCLA... We don't want those Yogi rumors going again :)


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[Dunn Woods 92]

what is he supposed to do with this situation?

 

he is supposed to save his job by finding the needle in the haystack

 

from here on out there can be no more off-the-court issues of any kind. From here on out we must develop the players we bring in and get them to maximize their abilities. From here on out we need to retain the players we feel are worthy to offer scholarships in the first place. No more players suspended by the NCAA. No more investigations into relationships between players and random non-scholastic third parties. No more arrests for operating motor vehicles while impaired. No more mid-season transfers. No more disrespecting our opponents after games with brash handshakes or outright trash talk. No more collectively taking care of the basketball like a really bad homeowner takes care of his/her lawn. No more roster mismanagement (no shooting in 2013/2014 and no legitimate big men in 2014/2015). No more players making really dumb decisions with regards to their social lives. No more home losses to Penn St, Northwestern, and Nebraska. No more assistant coaches who are recruiters first and teachers second.

 

I'm sure I'm leaving off a few other requirements of the job Crean must satisfy in order to get me off the ledge but I think everything I typed above is a good starting point

[IU Hoosier41 14,465]

[quote name="JSHoosier" post="62831" timestamp="1398489133"]I think Hanner's suspension was too short. As for these two, I'd let them go on the Canada trip but they might not play in the first game. Oh, and they'd have to write an essay explaining how they thought basketball players at friggin' Indiana could slip a fake ID past someone. Or maybe I'd arrange it so they have to work with the campus grounds crew.[/quote]

They weren't trying to slip by anyone. Everyone knows who they are, and that they are underage. They need SOMETHING to show they are 21 so the bars can let them in. The bars know they aren't 21, everyone there does.


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[HoosierSadaseci 2,258]

Not sure why kids feel they need to drink when they're underage, I never did when I was younger...though I don't even drink now, still don't know what the big deal is about alcohol. 

[schoosier 3,445]

Rule 1. Keep the parties at home.
Rule 2. Do not smoke weed until you get to the NBA.

[KelleyHoosh 2,263]

[quote name="schoosier" post="62839" timestamp="1398513953"]Rule 1. Keep the parties at home.
Rule 2. Do not smoke weed until you get to the NBA.[/quote]

I completely agree on the first point but sad as it may be the second may be asking too much. I'd say something more like, don't smoke weed ESPECIALLY during the NCAA tournament when the suspension can be a half a year. Oh and if the school tests you and you're positive you sit for four games and make the whole team run til they thoroughly hate you


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[PointBlank 116]

Due to the previous infractions within the basketball program, I believe CTC has to impose a bigger penalty than just missing a couple of meaningless games. CTC deserves better than what the players are giving in return. CTC shares in the blame for the lack of discipline on this team but he can't be with these guys 24/7.

 

To date and what has been made public, there has been 3 players with alleged positive drug tests, 3 players arrested for alcohol offenses 2 of which were charged with possessing fake IDs. This works out to a very unacceptable percentage of offenses for the limited number of players on the team, even if one has departed.

 

Hanner's punishment was too light. Even though underage drinking isn't a capital offense, these charges are currently the cherry on top of a team which has some issues and a severe lacking in discipline. If I were CTC, I would inform Yogi to not even consider being  a team captain next season. I would suspend the duo at least five games if not seven even if it hurt the team performance. The two of them can learn from the bench. This is an accumulative factor discipline situation and the two should have known better and expected stronger disciplinary actions due to the previous team issues.

 

I am not a CTC apologists, but he deserves much better than what he is receiving from the players currently on the team. This current issue which was brought on by Yogi and Stan has taken away valued time from CTC's recruiting, and just might have made landing a player a little tougher if the prospective recruit's parents want their son in an environment which includes discipline and not a me first attitude. Team captains are not me first people, it is about the team and being able to think ahead.

[JuwantGrimeShakes? 533]

Due to the previous infractions within the basketball program, I believe CTC has to impose a bigger penalty than just missing a couple of meaningless games. CTC deserves better than what the players are giving in return. CTC shares in the blame for the lack of discipline on this team but he can't be with these guys 24/7.

 

To date and what has been made public, there has been 3 players with alleged positive drug tests, 3 players arrested for alcohol offenses 2 of which were charged with possessing fake IDs. This works out to a very unacceptable percentage of offenses for the limited number of players on the team, even if one has departed.

 

Hanner's punishment was too light. Even though underage drinking isn't a capital offense, these charges are currently the cherry on top of a team which has some issues and a severe lacking in discipline. If I were CTC, I would inform Yogi to not even consider being  a team captain next season. I would suspend the duo at least five games if not seven even if it hurt the team performance. The two of them can learn from the bench. This is an accumulative factor discipline situation and the two should have known better and expected stronger disciplinary actions due to the previous team issues.

 

I am not a CTC apologists, but he deserves much better than what he is receiving from the players currently on the team. This current issue which was brought on by Yogi and Stan has taken away valued time from CTC's recruiting, and just might have made landing a player a little tougher if the prospective recruit's parents want their son in an environment which includes discipline and not a me first attitude. Team captains are not me first people, it is about the team and being able to think ahead.

Seven games? Crean can kiss his job goodbye at that point. The team will never have worked with 40% of the starters until the schedule starts mattering. Another dropped season. A flaming hot seat. Not to mention the message being "I'd rather you drive drunk two weeks after you turn twenty-one than drink two weeks before you do". I'm not saying they shouldn't be punished, but suspensions hurt everyone and destroy team chemistry. JBJ and RJ aren't going to want to be friendly with YF and SR after they lose 5 or 6 games because of them.

That just isn't how you discipline kids and have them actually learn anything. 6 am sprints for a month. Heck, you can use the punishment to make alcohol averse to them by having them take a drink between each sprint. Throwing up alcohol 100 times over the course of a month will keep you off of it for awhile.

[2Much 165]

While some game suspensions will put their punishment in the public eye, I don't know that it's really the answer to "getting the team under control."  I think that looks something more like "If you're under 21 and I hear rumors or see a picture on social media of any of you drinking alcohol or even inside a bar, the excise police will be the last of your worries" and, specifically, Yogi and Stan (and Hanner) are in their residence hall rooms and able to answer their landline dorm phones at any point after midnight every night of the week for the rest of this semester and any time they're on campus for summer session.  And you'd better believe they would get called several times a week at all times of the night (you'd better sleep with it by your bed so you can answer it at 3:00 in the morning if I call) by every member of the coaching staff.  If being a member of this team is truly important to you and you honestly "regret your mistakes" and "take responsibility for your actions," this is how you can prove it to the coaching staff and to the rest of your teammates.

[Kineticz 87]

Maybe make them sit out of the Hoosier hysteria event... The kids really seem to love it and it would reinforce the need to take responsibility without jeopardizing the rest of the team. Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

[colonel06 1,913]

I have an older friend (heck I'm old) that is a returning "indiana snowbird" arriving back in town this week. I'm sure our first cup of coffee is going to go something like this:

 

   "Mike, Mike, Mike, now tell me honestly, do you think back in the day that Coach (Knight) would have put up with this nonsense from his young men (not kids) for 1 minute?"

 

   "Can you see Quinn, Isaiah or Alford, Coaches key leaders doing anything like that?  It's a sad time ain't it Mike?"

 

    " Andy, in a way yes it is.  I can say that Coach was clear on the hot stove rule!  In the players you just mentioned the parents not known to baby their "kids" would also used a little KITA motivation as well!"