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I thoroughly enjoyed watching Indiana become a basketball juggernaut while growing up. It was fun to watch a group of kids who chose to play for Indiana and/or a specific coach become successful as a team and make a name for Indiana basketball, which despite its recent lack of success, is still considered a blue blood by many due to its past success and still has a significant name in college basketball. Watching kids play for a school regardless of money was fun for me. I’m not against players being able to advertise for organizations and be paid, and I think this should be allowed. I didn’t expect this to so quickly become a league where the richest donors could form a team like we see from NBA owners and managers, but without the limits and restrictions we see in the NBA.

I stopped watching professional sports long ago (way back when baseball players went on strike because bench warmers were only making a million dollars per year at the time and they acted as though they truly believed their families may go hungry…and elite players were complaining because they felt they deserved 7 million instead of 5). I just became disinterested in grown men acting like they’re being paid a peasant’s earnings and struggling financially when their sense of entitlement and their ego was not being massaged well enough. Sure, players should bring in some (a lot) of that ridiculous money the owners of professional franchises make because they’re the product that is selling tickets and merchandise…but, I didn’t want to read about and listen to players complaining they aren’t earning enough when one year of a bench warmer’s salary today would set someone like myself up handsomely for life (someone who doesn’t need a pole barn full of luxury vehicles and multiple mansions to feel like I’m valued).

My eyes have been opened, and I now realize where things will likely go based on where things have already gone in a matter of weeks. If this becomes a league where players are running after the highest bidder and no restrictions are put in place (and no governing body is willing or capable of creating AND KEEPING some control over it), then this will be similar to what I experienced decades ago with professional sports. I don’t have to continue watching it, because I have a choice, but I will miss it. 

It’s not only about winning (at all costs) for me. I enjoyed watching a team form and gel together under strong leadership and tutelage through practice and hard work. A blend of differing levels of talent becoming a unit and wearing a jersey because they committed to a team without financial incentives. Now, it seems more likely to watch teams assemble and disassemble even more so than what we’ve seen with the transfer portal minus the NIL deals, with the best players running to the universities with the wealthiest donor pool. As some have said already, there will be professional “G-League” teams competing for championships each year and the universities with smaller donor pools will have almost no chance of creating their own Cinderella stories many of us love in March. It is what it is, and there are two sides to look at it from. Some will agree with me while others won’t. I don’t like professional sports for my own reasons, and this is what college basketball will most likely resemble going forward if nothing is done to change the way this NIL money is being offered. Again, some will be fine with it, and I’m fine with them being fine with it. It just changes college basketball for me, the only sport I still watch religiously.  And, yes, I know there have always been bidding wars amongst some of the elite teams, and it has always disgusted me…but when the entire collegiate atmosphere is at the mercy of a bidding war for the best players, it will probably free up more of my time and I’ll find other things to do. 

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Haven't posted in quite some time, lurked a lot though!

 

NIL to me was players could be featured on advertisements, in commercials, or brand their own clothing, etc. They could make money off of their name, image, or likeness.

I didn't see "contracts" coming, or whatever Miami gave to Pack. College basketball players are no longer "amateurs" and never will be again.

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5 minutes ago, Coach Robby said:

Yeah? Just handing out money isn't  exactly the definition of "NIL"

What do you think getting paid for name, image and likeness means? Schools have been making millions of dollars off the names, photos, etc. of college basketball and football for years. Now a healthy portion of those millions go to the players instead. It is totally predictable. Anyone who didn't see it was totally blind or naive.

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1 minute ago, Honkyman said:

What do you think getting paid for name, image and likeness means? Schools have been making millions of dollars off the names, photos, etc. of college basketball and football for years. Now a healthy portion of those millions go to the players instead. It is totally predictable. Anyone who didn't see it was totally blind or naive.

I get that part. But signing contracts with alumni? Just wild to me, that's all. 

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The NCAA simply made legal what had been under-the-table conduct. In this world of ultra-competitive college sports, it is perfectly natural that many schools will do whatever they think they can get away with to attract talent. 

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42 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

What do you think getting paid for name, image and likeness means? Schools have been making millions of dollars off the names, photos, etc. of college basketball and football for years. Now a healthy portion of those millions go to the players instead. It is totally predictable. Anyone who didn't see it was totally blind or naive.

I thought it meant players would look for advertising opportunities to use their name, image and likeness while in school. I expected it to give an incentive for some “on the cusp” NBA prospects to stay at their university awhile longer. I didn’t realize wealthy donors would be allowed to throw money at teenagers enticing them to leave their current schools to attend the donor’s favorite school. It’s poaching, pure and simple. It’s happened in private high schools and prep schools for years, and it’s happened under the table in college sports for years, but that doesn’t mean I should have expected (or wanted) this NIL to become a free-for-all with no restrictions or limitations in place by any governing body. To let the highest bidder “steal” players from their current schools by handing them a bag of cash to enroll in the donors’ favorite schools was not what I had in mind and not what I hoped for. Of course it was going to happen, but it’s become so apparent it will openly happen and as a teenager I would have looked to make mine too. I don’t blame the students, and I can’t blame the donors. I can only blame the lame organization that has never had any real control and has always played favorites for its own economical gain.

I know I’m not blind, so I guess you’re calling me naive. Thanks for the name calling. I thought that was something this forum didn’t approve of. My feelings aren’t hurt, so it’s all good, but calling people blind and naive is inappropriate, in my humble opinion. 

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On 4/23/2022 at 6:21 PM, HoosierDribbler said:

I can't imagine the player making a few bucks off of tee-shirts not resenting the guy making $400,000. Sadly, playing for the name on the front of the jersey is a thing of the past.

2 thoughts on this.

1. Cheating becomes legit so the advantages other blue bloods had by cheating is over. NIL should benefit IU as much as anyone.

2. Indiana still won’t add players names to the backs of our jerseys.

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10 hours ago, MikeRoberts said:

I would, of course want to be relevant and fun again. But do we really want another G-League? 
 

the NCAA was different than the G -League and NBA and I loved it.  Fearful the NCAA comes crashing downs. It’s complete anarchy right now 

I guess I don’t view it as another G-League. I view it as IU and others can now compete with Duke and UK on a regular basis because some schools have been doing this for decades, while claiming to do the right thing. The NCAA turned a blind eye or couldn’t do anything about it because of limitations of not having subpoena power. 
 

I think the market will eventually level out. It may take a couple of years. If you think basketball is bad, go take a look at football. 
 

After listening to a few podcasts it appears at some point most think the NCAA will be separate from the power 5. The NCAA already doesn’t have a say in the college football playoffs. So someone will either have to reform the NCAA or they will get left by the conferences with the most money. The NCAA tournament is a cash cow though. It will be interesting. 

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27 minutes ago, ray said:

people blind and naive is inappropriate

Sorry you feel that way. Maybe I should have simply said, given how some colleges have conducted themselves in recruiting athletes over the past several decades, it is amazing that anyone would be surprised some schools would take advantage of NIL. Many observers predicted this outcome.

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2 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Sorry you feel that way. Maybe I should have simply said, given how some colleges have conducted themselves in recruiting athletes over the past several decades, it is amazing that anyone would be surprised some schools would take advantage of NIL. Many observers predicted this outcome.

No worries. 

I should have said I, too, expected the dirty to stay dirty and for the NCAA to have no control. I just didn’t want the whole thing to be tarnished by the filth and to have donors forming teams by pulling players from their previous commitments to play for the donor’s favorite universities.  It was going to happen in the dark or in the light either way, but with so much light being shed on recent “acquisitions” I can’t be (naive) and assume many more students won’t look to jump ships for better financial gains (nor would I…many of us leave jobs for more lucrative opportunities, so I don’t blame student athletes for doing the same). I just know when students see announcements of Florida (or whomever) having donors floating larger bags of cash, some students will be reluctant to maintain loyalty to their commitments, and coupled with the transfer portal being what it now is, it will make for less than ideal (and competitive) March Madness (in my opinion). Then again, who is to say the players running for the most bank will have a cohesive unit and not be outplayed by the lower earners?

I think it’s past due for students to be given the opportunity to make money using their name, image, and likeness. A college student can start a TikTok or YouTube account, pose for Playboy, or start an OnlyFans and profit without the university or NCAA having any control of their earnings, so why should student athletes be restricted (even if they’re using the exposure of the university to gain). I also understand Indiana has an advantage over most. Still, even with “my team” with a distinctive advantage, I didn’t want donors to be allowed to form their own teams. Once a student athlete is enrolled, then let the money fly (and have some sense of control over it), but in my opinion, to pull students away from their previous commitments by offering more money out of the gate will further tarnish the sport I love. If Indiana can be caught making an extra phone call to a recruit, then why can’t someone stop others from delivering promises to bribe student athletes? The answer is, they could and could have all along…but the economical benefits were enough for the NCAA to overlook whatever they wanted to overlook.

Again, it’s all nothing more than an opinion. I just wish there was a way to reign in the Wild West that college sports will become. There will always be those dirty “players”, but now it’s become so much easier to play dirty. Someone mentioned the Power 5 separating from the NCAA. If that happens, then maybe we’ll have two tournaments. In which case, I’ll watch the one with the most fair competition.

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2 hours ago, ray said:

I thoroughly enjoyed watching Indiana become a basketball juggernaut while growing up. It was fun to watch a group of kids who chose to play for Indiana and/or a specific coach become successful as a team and make a name for Indiana basketball, which despite its recent lack of success, is still considered a blue blood by many due to its past success and still has a significant name in college basketball. Watching kids play for a school regardless of money was fun for me. I’m not against players being able to advertise for organizations and be paid, and I think this should be allowed. I didn’t expect this to so quickly become a league where the richest donors could form a team like we see from NBA owners and managers, but without the limits and restrictions we see in the NBA.

I stopped watching professional sports long ago (way back when baseball players went on strike because bench warmers were only making a million dollars per year at the time and they acted as though they truly believed their families may go hungry…and elite players were complaining because they felt they deserved 7 million instead of 5). I just became disinterested in grown men acting like they’re being paid a peasant’s earnings and struggling financially when their sense of entitlement and their ego was not being massaged well enough. Sure, players should bring in some (a lot) of that ridiculous money the owners of professional franchises make because they’re the product that is selling tickets and merchandise…but, I didn’t want to read about and listen to players complaining they aren’t earning enough when one year of a bench warmer’s salary today would set someone like myself up handsomely for life (someone who doesn’t need a pole barn full of luxury vehicles and multiple mansions to feel like I’m valued).

My eyes have been opened, and I now realize where things will likely go based on where things have already gone in a matter of weeks. If this becomes a league where players are running after the highest bidder and no restrictions are put in place (and no governing body is willing or capable of creating AND KEEPING some control over it), then this will be similar to what I experienced decades ago with professional sports. I don’t have to continue watching it, because I have a choice, but I will miss it. 

It’s not only about winning (at all costs) for me. I enjoyed watching a team form and gel together under strong leadership and tutelage through practice and hard work. A blend of differing levels of talent becoming a unit and wearing a jersey because they committed to a team without financial incentives. Now, it seems more likely to watch teams assemble and disassemble even more so than what we’ve seen with the transfer portal minus the NIL deals, with the best players running to the universities with the wealthiest donor pool. As some have said already, there will be professional “G-League” teams competing for championships each year and the universities with smaller donor pools will have almost no chance of creating their own Cinderella stories many of us love in March. It is what it is, and there are two sides to look at it from. Some will agree with me while others won’t. I don’t like professional sports for my own reasons, and this is what college basketball will most likely resemble going forward if nothing is done to change the way this NIL money is being offered. Again, some will be fine with it, and I’m fine with them being fine with it. It just changes college basketball for me, the only sport I still watch religiously.  And, yes, I know there have always been bidding wars amongst some of the elite teams, and it has always disgusted me…but when the entire collegiate atmosphere is at the mercy of a bidding war for the best players, it will probably free up more of my time and I’ll find other things to do. 

The fact is what we're talking about is entertainment.  And now, the entertainers are being paid $$$ for their performance beyond the scholarship, which is viewed as less valuable and more optional by many of them.

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23 minutes ago, rayl456 said:

The fact is what we're talking about is entertainment.  And now, the entertainers are being paid $$$ for their performance beyond the scholarship, which is viewed as less valuable and more optional by many of them.

I completely agree. And as I’ve said, I don’t blame the student athletes and I think they should run for the most money and earn what they can while they can. I know I would.

I just think it will make the entertainment less entertaining for me (and I’m sure many others) unless they discover a method of creating some sense of fairness. If I’m watching a team that is constantly having its best performers swayed to leave for more earnings, then it becomes a lot like watching minor league baseball…never knowing what product will be on the field. And for a lot of schools, this is exactly what will happen to their rosters on an annual basis. And it’s already happening with the ability to transfer and instantly have eligibility. Couple instantly eligible transfer opportunities with donors persuading them to leave and we’ll have teams even further stacked and smaller schools having their rosters turn over even more frequently, which makes March Madness less entertaining (and competitive) for me personally.

Personally, at this point, and if it’s going to spiral out of control like I imagine it will, then I like the idea of separating the Power 5 and NCAA. I’m sure there will be big spenders popping up in smaller conferences too, but the separation will at least reduce the impact the “Yankees” of college basketball have on universities with smaller donor pools.

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5 minutes ago, ray said:

I completely agree. And as I’ve said, I don’t blame the student athletes and I think they should run for the most money and earn what they can while they can. I know I would.

I just think it will make the entertainment less entertaining for me (and I’m sure many others) unless they discover a method of creating some sense of fairness. If I’m watching a team that is constantly having its best performers swayed to leave for more earnings, then it becomes a lot like watching minor league baseball…never knowing what product will be on the field. And for a lot of schools, this is exactly what will happen to their rosters on an annual basis. And it’s already happening with the ability to transfer and instantly have eligibility. Couple instantly eligible transfer opportunities with donors persuading them to leave and we’ll have teams even further stacked and smaller schools having their rosters turn over even more frequently, which makes March Madness less entertaining (and competitive) for me personally.

Personally, at this point, and if it’s going to spiral out of control like I imagine it will, then I like the idea of separating the Power 5 and NCAA. I’m sure there will be big spenders popping up in smaller conferences too, but the separation will at least reduce the impact the “Yankees” of college basketball have on universities with smaller donor pools.

Yeah, I just keep telling myself to have some patience and let things run wild...see where they end up.  The college basketball game has been moving towards the NBA style, so I'm willing to wait and see the outcome of this.  Right now it feels like it's a moving target.  

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Ok I think everyone needs to take a huge step back and see the forest for the trees. For all the talk about NIL creating a "free agency" dynamic, its not at all what is happening, at least outside of Pack/Wong at Miami

Most transfers aren't happening because of NIL money. Most transfers are happening due to 1) coaching changes (sometimes did try to stick it out for a year or 2 after the coach that recruited them left), 2) players transferring upward to higher caliber schools because those kinds of offers weren't there coming out of HS, and 3) and players transferring downward to get more playing time.

For the most part, we haven't been really seeing players chase money, and NIL is having nowhere near the impact that some are claiming

 

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1 hour ago, PB1230 said:

Ok I think everyone needs to take a huge step back and see the forest for the trees. For all the talk about NIL creating a "free agency" dynamic, its not at all what is happening, at least outside of Pack/Wong at Miami

Most transfers aren't happening because of NIL money. Most transfers are happening due to 1) coaching changes (sometimes did try to stick it out for a year or 2 after the coach that recruited them left), 2) players transferring upward to higher caliber schools because those kinds of offers weren't there coming out of HS, and 3) and players transferring downward to get more playing time.

For the most part, we haven't been really seeing players chase money, and NIL is having nowhere near the impact that some are claiming

 

But, soon it will be:

4) more money

 

I believe it’s inevitable now. Why wouldn’t many players want to chase the money if it’s being offered?

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8 hours ago, ray said:

I thoroughly enjoyed watching Indiana become a basketball juggernaut while growing up. It was fun to watch a group of kids who chose to play for Indiana and/or a specific coach become successful as a team and make a name for Indiana basketball, which despite its recent lack of success, is still considered a blue blood by many due to its past success and still has a significant name in college basketball. Watching kids play for a school regardless of money was fun for me. I’m not against players being able to advertise for organizations and be paid, and I think this should be allowed. I didn’t expect this to so quickly become a league where the richest donors could form a team like we see from NBA owners and managers, but without the limits and restrictions we see in the NBA.

I stopped watching professional sports long ago (way back when baseball players went on strike because bench warmers were only making a million dollars per year at the time and they acted as though they truly believed their families may go hungry…and elite players were complaining because they felt they deserved 7 million instead of 5). I just became disinterested in grown men acting like they’re being paid a peasant’s earnings and struggling financially when their sense of entitlement and their ego was not being massaged well enough. Sure, players should bring in some (a lot) of that ridiculous money the owners of professional franchises make because they’re the product that is selling tickets and merchandise…but, I didn’t want to read about and listen to players complaining they aren’t earning enough when one year of a bench warmer’s salary today would set someone like myself up handsomely for life (someone who doesn’t need a pole barn full of luxury vehicles and multiple mansions to feel like I’m valued).

My eyes have been opened, and I now realize where things will likely go based on where things have already gone in a matter of weeks. If this becomes a league where players are running after the highest bidder and no restrictions are put in place (and no governing body is willing or capable of creating AND KEEPING some control over it), then this will be similar to what I experienced decades ago with professional sports. I don’t have to continue watching it, because I have a choice, but I will miss it. 

It’s not only about winning (at all costs) for me. I enjoyed watching a team form and gel together under strong leadership and tutelage through practice and hard work. A blend of differing levels of talent becoming a unit and wearing a jersey because they committed to a team without financial incentives. Now, it seems more likely to watch teams assemble and disassemble even more so than what we’ve seen with the transfer portal minus the NIL deals, with the best players running to the universities with the wealthiest donor pool. As some have said already, there will be professional “G-League” teams competing for championships each year and the universities with smaller donor pools will have almost no chance of creating their own Cinderella stories many of us love in March. It is what it is, and there are two sides to look at it from. Some will agree with me while others won’t. I don’t like professional sports for my own reasons, and this is what college basketball will most likely resemble going forward if nothing is done to change the way this NIL money is being offered. Again, some will be fine with it, and I’m fine with them being fine with it. It just changes college basketball for me, the only sport I still watch religiously.  And, yes, I know there have always been bidding wars amongst some of the elite teams, and it has always disgusted me…but when the entire collegiate atmosphere is at the mercy of a bidding war for the best players, it will probably free up more of my time and I’ll find other things to do. 

Very well said and feel the same way.  For me if they want to get paid then go play professionally some where.  Leave the college game for players who actually wants to play for your program and get an education.

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For me I wish the NCAA would have tried to stop the cheating instead of just throwing their hands up and say everyone can just cheat.

20 years ago the NCAA should have grown a pair and put their foot down.  They needed to work with the NBA and work it out that players go straight to the NBA or if they go to college they had to stay in 3 years. It seemed to work well in baseball so it could on basketball as well.  It would have allowed the kids who only cared about money and going to the NBA go pro. It would have kept them out of the college game where they didn't want to be in the first place.

Second they needed to actually enforce the rules and have harsh punishments for rule breakers.

1) If a program gets caught with level 1 infractions they get 3 years probation which includes 3 years of post season ban.  Second offense they get the death penalty and couldn't apply for reinstatement for 5 years 

2) A coach gets caught with a level 1 infraction loses his job with a 5 year show clause. The second offense would result in a lifetime ban from coaching college basketball.

They should have just put me on charge and we could have still have the college game we use to live.

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