(2017) PF Billy Preston to Kansas

[NoahW35 459]

This is actually an interesting conversation. I think IU has recognized this and there has been sommeeewhaatt of a change to the early offers both in and out of the state. The weird thing about the in-state crowd is whatever strategy you go with, you have to go with. Right now I know of one 2018 situation they've gotten themselves in some trouble with by offering others. These kids all know each other in-state and if player A has and offer player B at the same position sees it as a slap in the face, per se. 

Also, the early recruitment has some backlash with some recruits. For some, it's totally positive. "IU was the first to believe in me, they've been there since the beginning, I'm a hoosier." Others, it gets stale. How you read that going into a recruitment....idk. But there is room for improvement from this staff.

I'm not sure I have the empirical data to support that IU is changing the early offer philosophy- someone could certainly figure it out- but I've heard it's something the staff is aware of.

The 2018 situation is Eric Hunter? Or is there another one? And how big of a deal do you think that is?


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[Brass Cannon 24,068]

Just now, hoosierpap said:

That is what I'm saying. People are referencing IU's "wasted resources" based on recruiting budgets from previous years. IU is ranked 5th or 6th in the country. That is the return on investment. They complained then about the same things. Idk if you're agreeing with me or what the issue is

I'm disagreeing we are discussing the wasted resources these last 6 months or so. Which isn't reflected in rankings yet. If we are by some Miracle a top 5 team next year then yes we are getting the ROI. But if we aren't ranked next year it would be hard to argue that we did get the ROI. 

 

[HoosierTrav 7,619]

It seems that IU could really use a power move at the assistant coach position. Add another great recruiter. Slice still interested in recruiting cbb? He'd kill it here.

[hoosierpap 14,300]

Just now, Brass Cannon said:

I'm disagreeing we are discussing the wasted resources these last 6 months or so. Which isn't reflected in rankings yet. If we are by some Miracle a top 5 team next year then yes we are getting the ROI. But if we aren't ranked next year it would be hard to argue that we did get the ROI. 

 

 

But you haven't seen IU's recruiting budget for the last "6 months or so." And even if you did, that includes 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 kids. Soooo...

 

If you want to say IU shouldn't have visited recruit A...cool. I'm sure the staff has a waaayyy better idea of the situation than me, you, or anyone here. 

[Brass Cannon 24,068]

1 minute ago, HoosierTrav said:

It seems that IU could really use a power move at the assistant coach position. Add another great recruiter. Slice still interested in recruiting cbb? He'd kill it here.

Yeah I like Marting for talent scouting but we need a better salesman. 

[HoosierRob 1,042]

Exactly. Just look at louisvilles recruiting since Kenny went there. I think that was a big loss for IU.

[WayneFleekHoosier 46,828]

Yeah I like Marting for talent scouting but we need a better salesman. 

Martin landed Derrick Rose and countless others for Calipari right??

It's Indiana holding Martin back not the other way around, I presume.

Not that I endorse that type of recruiting but he's capable based on history.


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[HooHooHoo22 3,902]

I could definitely get into the idea of getting better recruiting assistants


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[Brass Cannon 24,068]

Just now, hoosierpap said:

But you haven't seen IU's recruiting budget for the last "6 months or so." And even if you did, that includes 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019 kids. Soooo...

 

If you want to say IU shouldn't have visited recruit A...cool. I'm sure the staff has a waaayyy better idea of the situation than me, you, or anyone here. 

We have literally wasted pretty much all money we have spent on 17 in the last 6 months. I can't imagine that Smith were a very high percentage of that compared with all the traveling about chasing 5 stars and Waters  

A ROI near zero is pretty much universally agreed to be bad. I understand your trying to be positive but we are spending top tier money and getting middle tier recruiting results. I don't see how that can be viewed as acceptable.

 According to an indystar article we spend more than any other school yet we can't get a single 5 star and feel lucky to be in the top 5. Yeah that's a bad ROI

[Brass Cannon 24,068]

4 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Martin landed Derrick Rose and countless others for Calipari right??

It's Indiana holding Martin back not the other way around, I presume.

Not that I endorse that type of recruiting but he's capable based on history.


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Pretty sure Cals sleaze helped Martin with rose. 

[hoosierpap 14,300]

5 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

We have literally wasted pretty much all money we have spent on 17 in the last 6 months. I can't imagine that Smith were a very high percentage of that compared with all the traveling about chasing 5 stars and Waters  

A ROI near zero is pretty much universally agreed to be bad. I understand your trying to be positive but we are spending top tier money and getting middle tier recruiting results. I don't see how that can be viewed as acceptable.

 According to an indystar article we spend more than any other school yet we can't get a single 5 star and feel lucky to be in the top 5. Yeah that's a bad ROI

 

Again, you're missing my point. I'm not trying to be positive. I'm also not trying to be negative. 

[Brass Cannon 24,068]

Just now, hoosierpap said:

Again, you're missing my point. I'm not trying to be positive. I'm also not trying to be negative. 

I'm not trying to be negative either I'm being realistic. 

Mom ecstatic we are number 5 in the rankings but I'm also concerned that because we have misused all this money we spent for 2017 that we are headed back to the Perea years. 

Those years we had the 5 stars but no supporting cast. Now I fear we will be the opposite a solid supporting cast without their X factor. 

[hoosierpap 14,300]

2 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

I'm not trying to be negative either I'm being realistic. 

Mom ecstatic we are number 5 in the rankings but I'm also concerned that because we have misused all this money we spent for 2017 that we are headed back to the Perea years. 

Those years we had the 5 stars but no supporting cast. Now I fear we will be the opposite a solid supporting cast without their X factor. 

 

You don't know IU's recruiting budget this year, you don't know the end result of the class. That is the reality. 

[Brass Cannon 24,068]

Just now, hoosierpap said:

You don't know IU's recruiting budget this year, you don't know the end result of the class. That is the reality. 

I know it was high and I know that we aren't in the mix for any remaining elite level talents. 

So as of now the ROI is low. I will be the first to say that's changed if we get an elite level talent. 

[Uspshoosier 44,309]

I know it was high and I know that we aren't in the mix for any remaining elite level talents. 

So as of now the ROI is low. I will be the first to say that's changed if we get an elite level talent. 

Not in the mix in your eyes? Diallo has us in top 6. Maybe it's a long shot maybe it's not but as a coach if someone like that puts you in his top 6 are u saying the coach should call him and say no thanks I don't want iu to be in your top 6 because the fan base thinks u r wasted money in 2017. Personally I would try like hell to sell him on visiting and if it doesn't work well that's recruiting u win some u lose some. Lately we have lost more then we have won. I wonder if Miami hurricane fans on their message boards were asking if they were wasting money on Lonnie walker when every recruiting service had him going to Arizona or Kentucky.

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[WayneFleekHoosier 46,828]

Not in the mix in your eyes? Diallo has us in top 6. Maybe it's a long shot maybe it's not but as a coach if someone like that puts you in his top 6 are u saying the coach should call him and say no thanks I don't want iu to be in your top 6 because the fan base thinks u r wasted money in 2017. Personally I would try like hell to sell him on visiting and if it doesn't work well that's recruiting u win some u lose some. Lately we have lost more then we have won. I wonder if Miami hurricane fans on there message boards were asking if they were wasting money on Lonnie walker when every recruiting service had him going to Arizona or Kentucky.

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Miami has recruiting momentum. They beat IU for Bruce Brown.

Fwiw-Not being serious. Just having a bit of fun.

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[Uspshoosier 44,309]

Miami has recruiting momentum. They beat IU for Bruce Brown.

Fwiw-Not being serious. Just having a bit of fun.

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I know They also pulled a home town 5 star last class with huell


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[mdn82 25,461]

I know it was high and I know that we aren't in the mix for any remaining elite level talents. 

So as of now the ROI is low. I will be the first to say that's changed if we get an elite level talent. 

How do we know if the ROI is low until they get on campus? By recruiting services? By our perception of misses? I think that is what Pap is saying. We have to wait and see for sure before making concrete claims. The ROI on 2012 and 2013 looked great on paper, and it was not. That's on Crean. Plus, each years recruiting budget isn't specific to the year you are in unless you live and die by the Freshman like Calipari. For IU we have to create relationships 4 years in advance. It didn't take local coaches one year to dislike Crean. It will take longer than one year to build stronger relationships. It will take a few years to determine ROI on 2017 class. All we can do is keep winning in conference and hopefully more on a national level to become a more adequate option for higher end players. IMO


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[HoosierAloha 29,897]

I don't think 2013 was a bad year in the talent. It was so messed up chemistry wise. Hartman has been a good player. Troy had some really good games for IU. Vonleh was a contributor for a year.

[8bucks 6,143]

I don't think 2013 was a bad year in the talent. It was so messed up chemistry wise. Hartman has been a good player. Troy had some really good games for IU. Vonleh was a contributor for a year.

2013 was ok but when you couple it with 2012 then you have a problem. Too many of those kids did not contribute and consumed important roster spots.

Those years seem a bit of anomaly compared to Creans other classes so hopefully Crean can find the right kids to allow us to compete for BT titles regularly