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Sam_Boger

PITT Transfer Josh Newkirk is headed to IU!

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My 2016-17 IU rotation (If 247 is right, and if nothing else unforeseen happens like tranfers and injuries)
G Josh Newkirk 6-1
G Curtis Jones 6-3
G Robert Johnson 6-3
F Collin Hartman 6-7
F Thomas Bryant 6-10
Sixth F Emmitt Holt 6-7

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Don't know what this means, but it has to show at least some concern on the staff's behalf that our point guard situation is not strong on the recruiting trail. The offense Crean has run for the last 6 seasons is almost completely dependent on either points off the break or points off penetration. This kid's a little bigger than Yogi is, and has experience handling the ball at a high D1 level. At worst, a stop-gap. At best, a relatively productive 2-year player.

What we do not need (and I think this gets missed a lot) is a group of 5 kids on the floor, all of whom need the ball and are looking to score all the time. If this kid can simply run an offense, guard somebody, and lead...he'll help. And having a year on the practice floor with this system can't hurt. This has to play out, just like Grant does.


Old Friend, I believe in giving credit where it is due.... I like and agree with you on this.

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I recommend reading "a closer look" on inside the hall. Quotes like, "he looked lost out there", "he regressed" don't impress much.

Would be a good player as our 11th, 12th, 13th, but as our starting PG I'm not pleased.

And those that are impressed don't have high enough expectations for what we could be.

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So we're going to go from All-B1G to above average, and you're okay with that......


My higher character theory seems to be out the window. But, to answer this... No I'm not accepting this. I'm banking on us getting CuJo or Brown(?) I just like the pick up. A solid back up pg is Nice

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I recommend reading "a closer look" on inside the hall. Quotes like, "he looked lost out there", "he regressed" don't impress much.

Would be a good player as our 11th, 12th, 13th, but as our starting PG I'm not pleased.

And those that are impressed don't have high enough expectations for what we could be.

All of this can depend on a system and what makes a kid comfortable.   I've never known of a point guard who "looked lost" in the open floor or didn't like a penetration style of offense.    Kind of don't care for the broad brush painting of everyone who doesn't agree with you.  I promise you, everyone on this board has high expectations, and I, for one, have been all over Crean about that for several years.  It's just that I don't fly off the handle and paint every picture as an absolute because of some random tidbit devoid of context.   Crean has failed miserably on the floor in every season save one.  No argument.   But until we see a kid on the floor and how he does in whatever system we're running when he's eligible, to say those who are "impressed" (your word) don't have high enough expectations is comical.   "The Movement" should be all the proof you need that things don't always work out on the floor like they look on paper.

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You have your opinion and I have mine. I am not going on 1 thing to base my opinion. I watch a lot of college basketball. I've seen him play. He is an upgrade from Stan Robinson, he is not Yogi Ferrell. Those quotes about him regressing and looking lost aren't my opinions. Those are in the write up. He is a bad free throw shooter as far as PGs go. He has microsurgery on his knee.

He is okay. He may even turn out decent but he is currently a fledgling backup point guard from Pittsburgh who crumpled under the pressure of more minutes. Blamed the system and left the program. Forgive me for not being enamored.

I don't need 5 star players but I want players to be excited about and this is a big risk with some odds but low odds of being a homerun.

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You have your opinion and I have mine. I am not going on 1 thing to base my opinion. I watch a lot of college basketball. I've seen him play. He is an upgrade from Stan Robinson, he is not Yogi Ferrell. Those quotes about him regressing and looking lost aren't my opinions. Those are in the write up. He is a bad free throw shooter as far as PGs go. He has microsurgery on his knee.

He is okay. He may even turn out decent but he is currently a fledgling backup point guard from Pittsburgh who crumpled under the pressure of more minutes. Blamed the system and left the program. Forgive me for not being enamored.

I don't need 5 star players but I want players to be excited about and this is a big risk with some odds but low odds of being a homerun.

I get it, and we're more aligned than you think we are.  I don't think this kid's a home run, but I don't think it's fair to assume he'll be lost in our system because he "looked lost" in another.   Different sport, but Jerry Hughes "looked lost" as a Colt and made the pro bowl as a Bill.   I don't think he's any more than a stop-gap, and I think it's unfair to be overly critical before he's played in his first practice.   He'll have a year to work with the kids on the team; and I'm assuming we'll start to improve the quality of player we're signing.  Again...he's a piece.  If it ends up that we're counting on him to play major minutes and assume Yogi's production, I agree 100%.   I just don't think that's the case, and I don't think any team needs 13 five-star players because all of them would be used to dominating the ball.   That's not good for anyone.

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I'm not huge on this guy,but what we don't need to have is people saying "he's not yogi" no college has the luck to have one of the best pg in the nation play for them every 4 years. That being said I would rather have someone better to be the pg of the future, but we can do worse then this guy.

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I get it, and we're more aligned than you think we are. I don't think this kid's a home run, but I don't think it's fair to assume he'll be lost in our system because he "looked lost" in another. Different sport, but Jerry Hughes "looked lost" as a Colt and made the pro bowl as a Bill. I don't think he's any more than a stop-gap, and I think it's unfair to be overly critical before he's played in his first practice. He'll have a year to work with the kids on the team; and I'm assuming we'll start to improve the quality of player we're signing. Again...he's a piece. If it ends up that we're counting on him to play major minutes and assume Yogi's production, I agree 100%. I just don't think that's the case, and I don't think any team needs 13 five-star players because all of them would be used to dominating the ball. That's not good for anyone.

I can live with this and I do think he can be better for us than he was for Pitt (he better be). But his resume/live action does nothing to convince me he will be great. To me it's another weird impulse signing by Crean. As Newkirk's father said, few schools had reached out to him. There is a very good reason for that. Sadly. Now if UK, Duke, Arizona, Kansas jumped in on him that would be another great sign. Heck, even MSU, O$U, UL, UConn jumped in that would be good.

There are a number of signs that this is another classic reach by Crean. He's been doing that more and more lately, if you've noticed.

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I can live with this and I do think he can be better for us than he was for Pitt (he better be). But his resume/live action does nothing to convince me he will be great. To me it's another weird impulse signing by Crean. As Newkirk's father said, few schools had reached out to him. There is a very good reason for that. Sadly. Now if UK, Duke, Arizona, Kansas jumped in on him that would be another great sign. Heck, even MSU, O$U, UL, UConn jumped in that would be good.

There are a number of signs that this is another classic reach by Crean. He's been doing that more and more lately, if you've noticed.

1)   You will never hear me argue "pro Crean."   Not a fan.  At all.  I'm "pro kid" all the time, and I like what Grant brings to the table...as a piece.  Not a center piece.  

 

2)  I don't think anyone (I know I didn't) said this kid would be "great."   And I completely agree that he looks like an impulse signing borne of desperation.   If Crean thinks this is his 30-minute per night answer at point guard, then we have a huge problem.  

 

The reality, Fleek?  I had another identity for a long time, and I mercilessly blasted Crean year in and year out.  Got crushed for it.  Lots of drama surrounding my opinion of the man that didn't look altogether different than yours does.  I don't know if you were around or not, but there were a ton of people who didn't care for my opinion of Crean, nor my posts which provided evidence on why I felt the way I did.  Mostly surrounding a horrible half-court offense, "looking completely lost" against a Syracuse zone he'd seen before AND which had been exposed by Butler 2 years prior, horrible halftime adjustments or a complete lack of them, an inability to defend without fouling, a lack of local focus on recruiting and subsequent loss of tons of local talent and the "right kids," which spawned desperation that looked like Peter Jurkin, Stanford Robinson, Tim Prilller, Jeremiah April, and Bawa Muniru; lack of movement of ball or people, lack of true understanding of Indiana's culture, and generally acting like an arrogant prick.  (Which is one reason I found the feel-good story yesterday somewhat laughable)   There were plenty of other reasons.  But there was way too much drama that got way too personal.

 

Basically, it was obvious very few people truly wanted to hear anything other than "Crean's awesome," so I've been a little softer on him here because I have no interest in stirring that pot again....even though I think time has proven me to be correct in my early assessment which occurred when I watched Verdell Jones stand on offense for 20+ seconds at a time.   Believe it or not, it's nice to see guys like you because I agree with you, and maybe I have more allies than I thought.

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