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sweetpain

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Then unless he's improved drastically at the skills required to play the wing, this is going to be another painful season of offense. 

His calling card will be defense. That’ll be his biggest asset to the team. I find it funny that somehow having Archie as a coach is a red flag offensively but now it’s up to Justin Smith... Smith will be playing the 3/4 all season.


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7 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:


His calling card will be defense. That’ll be his biggest asset to the team. I find it funny that somehow having Archie as a coach is a red flag offensively but now it’s up to Justin Smith... Smith will be playing the 3/4 all season.


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His calling card is defense, but he can't play the 3 unless he's drastically improved at ball handling, decision making in traffic, being an offensive creator off of ball screens, passing, shooting etc. 

In the offense the guards and wings (1,2 & 3) are responsible for coming off ball screens and creating offense for themselves and others. They're responsible for handling the ball in traffic, attacking the basket and making decisions with the ball. I like aspects of Smith's game, and he can absolutely be a key, valuable player for IU, but not only has he not shown an ability to do those things, he's actually shown he's pretty bad at them. 

I'll be really surprised if Archie is playing three guys together for extended minutes that can't handle the ball and create offense off of ball screens. 

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19 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Smith needs to play with urgency and quick twitch on D.

No more loafing in transition.

He needs to learn to use his athleticism on O and D.


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All true, but I'm just not seeing that as being extraordinarily likely. Justin Smith frustrates me to no end.

 

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15 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

 

All true, but I'm just not seeing that as being extraordinarily likely. Justin Smith frustrates me to no end.

 

This is where I'm at. I'd say "energy guy off the bench" but he's not really an energy guy. If Race and JH are ready to go, he may just be a "bench" guy. His effort and body language last year were infuriating.

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His calling card is defense, but he can't play the 3 unless he's drastically improved at ball handling, decision making in traffic, being an offensive creator off of ball screens, passing, shooting etc. 
In the offense the guards and wings (1,2 & 3) are responsible for coming off ball screens and creating offense for themselves and others. They're responsible for handling the ball in traffic, attacking the basket and making decisions with the ball. I like aspects of Smith's game, and he can absolutely be a key, valuable player for IU, but not only has he not shown an ability to do those things, he's actually shown he's pretty bad at them. 
I'll be really surprised if Archie is playing three guys together for extended minutes that can't handle the ball and create offense off of ball screens. 

Not exactly. Smith basically never needs to dribble at the 3 or 4. We are acting like Archie knows how to coach an offense. Our offense is going to be limited whether Smith can dribble or not. It really makes no difference. Our defense is going to have to be fantastic. Like one of the absolute best and Smiths athleticism and length at the 3/4 is going to be a part of that. If we average more than 73 a game, be happy.


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Not exactly. Smith basically never needs to dribble at the 3 or 4. We are acting like Archie knows how to coach an offense. Our offense is going to be limited whether Smith can dribble or not. It really makes no difference. Our defense is going to have to be fantastic. Like one of the absolute best and Smiths athleticism and length at the 3/4 is going to be a part of that. If we average more than 73 a game, be happy.


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I would be ecstatic if we averaged 73 a game because we haven’t done it yet under Archie.


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I'll be really surprised if Archie is playing three guys together for extended minutes that can't handle the ball and create offense off of ball screens. 

Archie started McRoberts for most of two seasons and he couldn't create any offense.

 

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I would be ecstatic if we averaged 73 a game because we haven’t done it yet under Archie.


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That’s kinda my point. The offense is likely not going to be very good no matter who is on the floor. Might as well play to our strengths On defense.


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2 hours ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:


Not exactly. Smith basically never needs to dribble at the 3 or 4. We are acting like Archie knows how to coach an offense. Our offense is going to be limited whether Smith can dribble or not. It really makes no difference. Our defense is going to have to be fantastic. Like one of the absolute best and Smiths athleticism and length at the 3/4 is going to be a part of that. If we average more than 73 a game, be happy.


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There's no 3/4. The '3' is a wing spot, the '4' is a forward spot. They're different roles with different skill sets. Smith has the skill sets to play forward (4), not the wing (3). As mentioned, at the wing spot you're in a role where you're coming off ball screens handling the ball and creating. At the forward spot, where Smith played all of last season, like literally all of his minutes, you're on the perimeter but you're the one setting the ball screens and either diving to the basket to finish a play or fading for the perimeter shot. 

Smith is a forward in terms of skill set, not a wing. Your comments are Archie are just ridiculous. 

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I’ve seen enough set plays work to know that Archie can coach offense.


This team lacks “basketball players.” We need better shooters. Better passers. Just better fundamental guys. Even Crean didn’t figure that out. He just loaded up on shooters and said “bombs away.”


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There's no 3/4. The '3' is a wing spot, the '4' is a forward spot. They're different roles with different skill sets. Smith has the skill sets to play forward (4), not the wing (3). As mentioned, at the wing spot you're in a role where you're coming off ball screens handling the ball and creating. At the forward spot, where Smith played all of last season, like literally all of his minutes, you're on the perimeter but you're the one setting the ball screens and either diving to the basket to finish a play or fading for the perimeter shot. 
Smith is a forward in terms of skill set, not a wing. Your comments are Archie are just ridiculous. 

Well the 3 is typically a small forward. But I guess the word “forward” means nothing. And where do small forwards play at? The wing and out on the perimeter. Some are shooters and some are slashers. Smith is a guy who should be looking for lanes to cut when Phinisee and Green get in the lane. Sure you can be a 3 and be a shooting guard because Al and Romeo did it plenty last season. Both are considered SG’s and wings. Just like a SF is considered a wing. In fact, nowadays a 4, PF or small ball forward can be considered a wing depending on the type of offense you run and who that player is. Smith doesn’t play on the block. And plays the 3/4 depending on the personnel on the court.


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I’ve seen enough set plays work to know that Archie can coach offense.


This team lacks “basketball players.” We need better shooters. Better passers. Just better fundamental guys. Even Crean didn’t figure that out. He just loaded up on shooters and said “bombs away.”


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Archie can coach offense? Is that why so many of his teams haven’t been great offenses? Crean could coach an offense. We saw that. That’s yet to be seen from an Archie coached team. At Dayton or Indiana.


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Archie can coach offense? Is that why so many of his teams haven’t been great offenses? Crean could coach an offense. We saw that. That’s yet to be seen from an Archie coached team. At Dayton or Indiana.


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How many of his teams have had a lot of good scorers?


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56 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:


Well the 3 is typically a small forward. But I guess the word “forward” means nothing. And where do small forwards play at? The wing and out on the perimeter. Some are shooters and some are slashers. Smith is a guy who should be looking for lanes to cut when Phinisee and Green get in the lane. Sure you can be a 3 and be a shooting guard because Al and Romeo did it plenty last season. Both are considered SG’s and wings. Just like a SF is considered a wing. In fact, nowadays a 4, PF or small ball forward can be considered a wing depending on the type of offense you run and who that player is. Smith doesn’t play on the block. And plays the 3/4 depending on the personnel on the court.


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You’re still not understanding it. Yes, both the wings (2 and 3) and the forwards (4’s) are on the perimeter,  but their roles on the perimeter are much different. They are not interchangeable. The 2/3’s are, the 4 plays a different role in the offense.  

The slasher role you’re describing is not a wing, it’s a forward. The wings are coming off ball screens, handling it in traffic, and either shooting, attacking the basket and/or delivering the ball to the slasher. That is not Justin Smith’s skillset. 

Smith is a forward. The forwards reverse the ball and then set ball screens for the wings and then either slash/roll to the basket or flare. That is Smith’s role and skillset. 

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