Game Thread: 09/21 12:00PM ET Indiana vs UConn BTN

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

All I know is, I'll take Ramsey over those unbearable years with Rich "he's got an NFL caliber arm" Lagow.

Certainly. Lagow was not a winning QB. I would have taken Zander Diamont over him all day everyday.


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[Aaron 4,147]

4 hours ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

He certainly has a much better arm than Ramsey. I'm hoping we get to see him against one of those good big 10 teams soon because I want to see how he does. Who knows what's going on with his injury. 

I kind of do from some stuff I heard behind the scenes. No one really knows how long he will be out but its from Maryland on we really need him. Will probably lose to MSU and beat Rutgers regardless of QB. It is a bit more severe then IU is letting on but I don't believe it is season ending although no one knows but could be a few more weeks or he could play next week (it all depends on his pain tolerance). It is definitely his shoulder but not sure what. 

As for today no way to judge how good or bad IU is given there opponent. UConn is really bad starting with maybe the worst QB I have ever seen between being super inaccurate with multiple overthrows and making terrible decisions (the backwards throw across his body to the opposite side of the field when the pocket broke down and the shovel pass INT we scored on to name a couple). 

We took care of business so that is good but no way to take much other than being one game closer to bowl eligibility.

 

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

1 hour ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Literally don’t see anyone saying that. What people are saying is that he’s at least as good as Ramsey, and that he gives us a better chance of winning.

People believe Ramsey equals another missed bowl and Penix is at least a chance at making it.

That’s far different than people “acting like he’s a savior”


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Look at some of the posts from people in this thread. Take jbell, for example:

"I agree. I’m just baffled this line is 27.5...general public must not know Penix isn’t playing. No chance we cover."

Or this one from Joe:

"If Penix doesn’t play, it’ll be a struggle to win."

That's treating Penix as the savior and acting like there is an enormous gap between the two. Penix has played a game and a half against really bad competition this year and you've got folks acting like he's a superstar in the making. Ramsey has also played a game and a half against really bad competition. He's gone 36-41 for 473 yards and 5 touchdowns in those 6 quarters. Old Friend loves to bring up YPA.. Well, that's good for a 11.5 YPA. He sucked against Ohio state last week, but Penix sucked the one time he faced a legitimate team too. No one has come out and said word for word "he's our savior", but they make it obvious that they believe it in their comments. 

[Alford Bailey 12,246]

I called the Penix injury concerning after the video surfaced. Imagine trying to throw as hard as you can with a tweaked muscle. These things can drag on. Ive had a shoulder injury that was technically nothing serious but took a year to heal even with therapy.

[Old Friend 8,389]

2 hours ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Look at some of the posts from people in this thread. Take jbell, for example:

"I agree. I’m just baffled this line is 27.5...general public must not know Penix isn’t playing. No chance we cover."

Or this one from Joe:

"If Penix doesn’t play, it’ll be a struggle to win."

That's treating Penix as the savior and acting like there is an enormous gap between the two. Penix has played a game and a half against really bad competition this year and you've got folks acting like he's a superstar in the making. Ramsey has also played a game and a half against really bad competition. He's gone 36-41 for 473 yards and 5 touchdowns in those 6 quarters. Old Friend loves to bring up YPA.. Well, that's good for a 11.5 YPA. He sucked against Ohio state last week, but Penix sucked the one time he faced a legitimate team too. No one has come out and said word for word "he's our savior", but they make it obvious that they believe it in their comments. 

You saw his throw to a wide open Hale, right?   That's the reason.  Any arm strength at all, that's a touchdown.  YAY!!   He had good TPA against UConn!   Still doesn't change that he was dead last a year ago in the power 5 conferences.

Penix isn't any kind of savior, but unless you're blind or have an agenda, it's pretty obvious why he was chosen as the starter.  There is nothing Ramsey can do that Penix can't, but Penix is a much better athlete with a much better arm than captain checkdown.  

Your inferences do not equal others' meaning.  That's on you.  Ramsey was fine in games Indiana won by a combined 90-3.  But if you can't see his deficiencies and inability to throw the ball accurately and consistently beyond 10-15 yards, you're not looking.  UConn and EIU are awful football teams.

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

7 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

You saw his throw to a wide open Hale, right?   That's the reason.  Any arm strength at all, that's a touchdown.  YAY!!   He had good TPA against UConn!   Still doesn't change that he was dead last a year ago in the power 5 conferences.

Penix isn't any kind of savior, but unless you're blind or have an agenda, it's pretty obvious why he was chosen as the starter.  There is nothing Ramsey can do that Penix can't, but Penix is a much better athlete with a much better arm than captain checkdown.  

Your inferences do not equal others' meaning.  That's on you.  Ramsey was fine in games Indiana won by a combined 90-3.  But if you can't see his deficiencies and inability to throw the ball accurately and consistently beyond 10-15 yards, you're not looking.  UConn and EIU are awful football teams.

The pass to Hale was one pass. Did you see some of his other passes? If you're going to pull the "UConn and EIU are awful football teams" card to argue against Ramsey then you have to do the same thing with Penix. Penix has only had success against awful football teams. By that token we shouldn't put any stock in how Penix did against them. 

And I wouldn't call an 88% completion percentage and an 11.5 YPA "fine". 

[Old Friend 8,389]

1 minute ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

The pass to Hale was one pass. Did you see some of his other passes? If you're going to pull the "UConn and EIU are awful football teams" card to argue against Ramsey then you have to do the same thing with Penix. Penix has only had success against awful football teams. By that token we shouldn't put any stock in how Penix did against them. 

 

So what it was one pass?  It was weak and showed what I've been telling you for 2 years.  I could have made the throw Ramsey made.  I also saw him look to check downs early and often.  I saw him throw the ball less than 10 feet several times.  

Penix hasn't had a chance to succeed because he hasn't played against good football teams yet.  Who are you trying to fool?  This isn't a discussion about results except you brought up YPA, which was balooned by a horrible team today and against EIU.  It was 4.9 last week.  4.9!   (Do I have to tell you how awful that is?  Penix was 8.2 against BSU and 9.85 v EIU.  Ransey was 6.4 for the season last year.)  Was that a serious comment that was supposed to prove something??   Ramsey was dead last a year ago in YPA in the power 5 conferences.  

I'm not pulling any card...I'm giving you facts.  Indiana has won two games 90-3 in which Ramsey has looked decent.  I'm not putting any stock at all in what on field results have been.  I'm telling you the same thing I told you last year.  Ramsey's arm's very weak and below average.  And it is.  The radio crew said so today, the TV crew said so today, and you can either acknowledge that or you can't.  Allen himself said it wasn't a decision made because of what Ramsey can't do but what Penix can...which is throw the football WAY better.

[Alford Bailey 12,246]

We REALLLLLY need to see Penix against a good team this year.

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

28 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

So what it was one pass?  It was weak and showed what I've been telling you for 2 years.  I could have made the throw Ramsey made.  I also saw him look to check downs early and often.  I saw him throw the ball less than 10 feet several times.  

Penix hasn't had a chance to succeed because he hasn't played against good football teams yet.  Who are you trying to fool?  This isn't a discussion about results except you brought up YPA, which was balooned by a horrible team today and against EIU.  It was 4.9 last week.  4.9!   (Do I have to tell you how awful that is?  Penix was 8.2 against BSU and 9.85 v EIU.  Ransey was 6.4 for the season last year.)  Was that a serious comment that was supposed to prove something??   Ramsey was dead last a year ago in YPA in the power 5 conferences.  

I'm not pulling any card...I'm giving you facts.  Indiana has won two games 90-3 in which Ramsey has looked decent.  I'm not putting any stock at all in what on field results have been.  I'm telling you the same thing I told you last year.  Ramsey's arm's very weak and below average.  And it is.  The radio crew said so today, the TV crew said so today, and you can either acknowledge that or you can't.  Allen himself said it wasn't a decision made because of what Ramsey can't do but what Penix can...which is throw the football WAY better.

Your opinion stated in an authoritative and condescending manner isn't a fact. It's still just an opinion.

In what world is completing 88% of your passes and throwing 11.5 yards per attempt looking "decent"? If that was Penix putting up those numbers you'd be telling everyone in earshot how it proves he's the right choice over Ramsey. But sense it's Ramsey, you "don't put any stock in it". 

Penix played against Penn State last year and went 9-19 for 94 yards.  We haven't seen him against a good team since then because he can't stay healthy. People act like he's a superstar in the making because of 6 good quarters against crappy teams while simultaneously saying Ramsey's performance in 6 quarters against crappy teams doesn't count  

You were obsessed with YPA last year but now his YPA this year isn't relevant? 9.1 YPA today and 16.1 against EIU. So, better against crappy teams than Penix. Since you no longer have that argument on your side you decide you're "not putting any stock in what happens on the field". 

[Stuhoo 75,560]

Let me summarize for you all:

Ramsey is a good back up, a fantastic team mate , and did a nice job today. He is also extraordinarily limited.  His arm strength  sucks. 

Penix has the chance to be an exceptional football player. He hasn’t proven it yet, but with Penix we have hope. 

 As the saying goes,  “Hope is not a strategy.” However, it’s Indiana football and that’s the best we can do. 

 

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

3 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Let me summarize for you all:

Ramsey is a good back up, a fantastic team mate , and did a nice job today. He is also extraordinarily limited.  His arm strength  sucks. 

Penix has the chance to be an exceptional football player. He hasn’t proven it yet, but with Penix we have hope. 

 As the saying goes,  “Hope is not a strategy.” However, it’s Indiana football and that’s the best we can do. 

 

This is not an accurate summary. Zander Diamont was "extraordinarily limited". Peyton Ramsey isn't. 

[Stuhoo 75,560]

20 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

This is not an accurate summary. Zander Diamont was "extraordinarily limited". Peyton Ramsey isn't. 

Okay; agreed ... if Diamont was “extraordinarily limited,” I shall amend and conclude that Ramsey is “more than a bit limited.”

 

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

3 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Okay; agreed ... if Diamont was “extraordinarily limited,” I shall amend and conclude that Ramsey is “more than a bit limited.”

 

Ramsey is an average quarterback. IU is an average football team. Maybe Penix will be an above average quarterback. If he ever stays healthy we will find out. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,182]

This is not an accurate summary. Zander Diamont was "extraordinarily limited". Peyton Ramsey isn't. 

No both arm. Ramsey has still had the arm strength of a high school Sophomore while Diamont was like a HS freshman. Ramsey is a Junior in college. You should have more zip on your passes than he does. You shouldn’t have to heave a 20 yard pass. It’s an eye test thing.


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[Brass Cannon 24,064]

29 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

No both arm. Ramsey has still had the arm strength of a high school Sophomore while Diamont was like a HS freshman. Ramsey is a Junior in college. You should have more zip on your passes than he does. You shouldn’t have to heave a 20 yard pass. It’s an eye test thing.


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Shame there’s no other important qualities that make a successful quality than Arm Strength. Guess that’s why Jamarcus Russel took the league by storm 

[Stuhoo 75,560]

3 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Shame there’s no other important qualities that make a successful quality than Arm Strength. Guess that’s why Jamarcus Russel took the league by storm 

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/AquXgE6GUxbkMbJT9

 

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

37 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

No both arm. Ramsey has still had the arm strength of a high school Sophomore while Diamont was like a HS freshman. Ramsey is a Junior in college. You should have more zip on your passes than he does. You shouldn’t have to heave a 20 yard pass. It’s an eye test thing.


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The "eye test" is the least reliable way to evaluate someone's performance. Your eyes see what they want to see.

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

5 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/AquXgE6GUxbkMbJT9

 

Not a red herring. It’s a fallacy to say a QB can’t be good without tons of arm strength.  Some of Peyton Manning’s best years came after the injury that sapped a great deal of his arm strength. 

[jk34 1,105]

How about we talk about the talent on that side of  the ball. I believe we have weapons all over the field. I want whatever quarterback that's going to get the ball in the hands of the playmakers. Penix not only has a great arm, but he also opens up the running game bythe R/O, and keeping plays alive. Especially on 3rd down.

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

16 minutes ago, jk34 said:

How about we talk about the talent on that side of  the ball. I believe we have weapons all over the field. I want whatever quarterback that's going to get the ball in the hands of the playmakers. Penix not only has a great arm, but he also opens up the running game bythe R/O, and keeping plays alive. Especially on 3rd down.

Can he do that and stay on the field though. It doesn’t do the team any good if he’s constantly out because of that play style.