Jump to content

Thanks for visiting BtownBanners.com!  We noticed you have AdBlock enabled.  While ads can be annoying, we utilize them to provide these forums free of charge to you!  Please consider removing your AdBlock for BtownBanners or consider signing up to donate and help BtownBanners stay alive!  Thank you!

Recommended Posts

Name an offer that Archie has given which seemed like a huge stretch. The fact that Jake didn't pan out doesn't mean he was a stretch offer. Yes, not every guy that comes to Indiana is going to work out as hoped, but if Archie continues to target and attract the types of guys he's gotten so far, he'll be successful overall. No coach is batting 1.000 in recruiting. Jake was always going to be a longer term project, and he didn't want to stick around and wait. That's not a shot at him, he's welcome to do whatever he thinks is best for himself, but I don't think he was much worse than expected his freshman year. I expected him to be the last guy off the bench. But he had offers from 21 schools, including Miami, Seton Hall, Xavier, Virginia Tech, etc., and was a top 150 player. He was an in-demand player. Similarly, Damezi may have had a bad freshman year, but he was a fringe top-100 guy. Nobody said that he couldn't play coming out of high school. Maybe it's Archie's fault that he didn't develop, maybe it's Damezi's, maybe he just needs more time, but he was being recruited by high major schools too. Judging recruiting success by how guys perform their freshmen years is not a good way to do it. Hopefully Damezi turns it around. Maybe he ends up a complete bust, but plenty of guys have gone from inconsequential freshman years to being valuable players.

 

You are now changing it to “name a kid that Archie offered that seemed like a stretch”. It’s about the kids ability to perform at Indiana university, not high school rankings and how many other offers a kid had. It’s his job to sort through all of that and determine who can produce at IU. Nothing else matters, that’s why I don’t question any offers whether it’s to a 200+ ranked kid or a McDonald’s all-american. I wait to see what the kid does at IU and some are good and some are not. The ones that are not good we’re not good offers.

 

Archie is not infallible, he has made bad offers.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You don’t think it had anything to do with the fact that we were SUPER thin on bodies all year and he almost never saw the floor?

He was either not very good at all or Archie was making a colossal mistake by not playing him.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

But not every player is expected to contribute immediately. Forrester definitely wasn't, and he was never expected to, but the potential was and still is there. He needed to add serious weight. A year off will probably be really good for him. The fact that he couldn't contribute as a freshman doesn't make him a mistake. Plenty of guys redshirt as freshmen, and nobody looks down at that. Jake essentially redshirted


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:

So what are you basing your comment on then? It sounds like you are basing it on a players high school ranking and how many other offers the kid has vs how the kid actually performs in college. I would assume the later is the more accurate assessment and in that case, yes, Archie has made offers and accepted commitments from kids that are not very good.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

The point was that brass cannon has been bringing up the narrative of Miller making 'Crean like desperation offers'.  That is 100% not the case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So what are you basing your comment on then? It sounds like you are basing it on a players high school ranking and how many other offers the kid has vs how the kid actually performs in college. I would assume the later is the more accurate assessment and in that case, yes, Archie has made offers and accepted commitments from kids that are not very good.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Sure. So has Coach K, Cal, and everybody who has ever coached. These guys can't predict the future, and every high school player is being evaluated on potential. Not all develop as expected.NBA execs know that the 1st round is a crapshoot, which is why teams like the Sixers just acquired as many picks as possible, and so college basketball will be even more so.

There's a difference between a top 100 Damezi Anderson not working out and Grant Gelon not working out. One is just prospect randomness, and the other is a bad process. Archie has not proven to have a bad process, at least with recruiting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:


You don’t think it had anything to do with the fact that we were SUPER thin on bodies all year and he almost never saw the floor?

He was either not very good at all or Archie was making a colossal mistake by not playing him.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

He was a freshman. Not all freshmen are ready to contribute from day 1. He wasn't a top 25 recruit. People talk a lot about how they want to "get old and stay old", but then they cast players off as terrible when they don't immediately contribute. Plenty of players who played sparingly their first year or two went on to make great contributions as upperclassmen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

He was a freshman. Not all freshmen are ready to contribute from day 1. He wasn't a top 25 recruit. People talk a lot about how they want to "get old and stay old", but then they cast players off as terrible when they don't immediately contribute. Plenty of players who played sparingly their first year or two went on to make great contributions as upperclassmen. 

IMO, at most you could say that Miller misjudged on Forrester's desire to do what it was going to take to be on the court.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exactly.
Offers for Jake Forrester included:
Seton Hall, Indiana, Virginia Tech, South Carolina, Arizona State, Vanderbilt, Miami (FL), Minnesota, Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Kansas State, Central Florida, Providence, Penn State, and Temple.  Ranked #147 by 247 compositie.
Offers for Grant Gelon included:
No other D1 offers when he signed.  Ended up ranked #391.
Offers for Tim Priller:
Incarnate Word
Offers for Jeremiah Priller:
Don't think he had any D1 offers.
Saying Forrester 'wasn't good' is a ex post facto point.  Saying Priller, April, and Grant weren't good was an ipso facto statement.  BIG difference.
Should also be mentioned that Miller wanted Forrester to redshirt.  It was Forrester and his dad that balked at it.
 

Who cares about other offers? That doesn’t make a player good or a fit for a program, neither does their high school ranking.

Again, I don’t care what a kid is ranked or what other schools are interested, I care about the end result of whether we prioritize the right kids for this team and needs. If a kid is a great talent but doesn’t want to work, he is a mistake. If he is a great talent but doesn’t understand his role or doesn’t mesh well with the coaches and team then he is a mistake. If he is a gym day that isn’t a great player but is a great teammate and practice player maybe he is a great decision.

Ranking or no ranking, the kid needs to be a fit on so many levels and that is the job of the coaching staff to determine. With Forester for example, he obviously was not a great fit beyond his lack of skill. There had to have been numerous glaring issues with him beyond his lack of skill and that makes him a bad decision. So, in many ways, a Gelon may have been a better fit at the end of the bench.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, brumdog45 said:

The point was that brass cannon has been bringing up the narrative of Miller making 'Crean like desperation offers'.  That is 100% not the case.

Actually I never said that. 

I said that people are against creaning yet support going after players that lead to it. 

So basically you are trying to prove me wrong about something I never said. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Actually I never said that. 
I said that people are against creaning yet support going after players that lead to it. 
So basically you are trying to prove me wrong about something I never said. 

Which players are we going after that would lead to it?


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Actually I never said that. 

I said that people are against creaning yet support going after players that lead to it. 

So basically you are trying to prove me wrong about something I never said. 

Your first post on the subject:

"Out of curiosity what exactly screams contributor to people here?

No other schools with interest"

I'll sit back and wait how this post doesn't scream of calling it a desperation recruit.  

So let's add on the following tidbits that you have said here:

1.  you are apparently not defining 'creaning' as anyone on here does.

2.  you say 'we don't know if Moore, Forrester, and Curtis Jones weren't 'creaned''

3.  you said that Van Zyl didn't have 'other schools with interest' and an insider posts that there are a dozen high majors with interest, that wasn't met with you by 'guess I was wrong', but rather 'which ones?'

What you state as being 'realistic' and not 'pessimistic' simply isn't the case.  You express possibility of 'creaning' players with no proof while skepticism when someone actually following the situation of Van Zyl says that he is being followed by multiple HMs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, brumdog45 said:

Your first post on the subject:

"Out of curiosity what exactly screams contributor to people here?

No other schools with interest"

I'll sit back and wait how this post doesn't scream of calling it a desperation recruit.  AND when an insider posted that there were 'a dozen HMs' interested, you seemed pretty quick to be skeptical of it.

That, along with your definition of 'creaning' being something that pretty much nobody else defines it.........

You making up something in your head that I never said sounds like a you issue. 

Your inability to not create your own narrative is pretty remarkable. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/4/2019 at 6:07 PM, Brass Cannon said:

Out of curiosity what exactly screams contributor to people here?

No other schools with interest

Lack of an updated 247 page

Lackluster numbers 

 

Yeah, I'm making things up.........

Yeah, I'm the one with issues.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, mdn82 said:


Which players are we going after that would lead to it?


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Not sure we are. Never said Archie was. Said this fan base seems to get excited every time every time we look at a flyer thinking that they will be the biggest diamond in the rough ever. 

Obviously Archie isn’t sure or else this guy would have an offer yet already on this board are chomping to lock him up so that he can be a contributor. 

Yet everything about him indicates he would most likely be a Priller. 

Taking flyers on guys like that is what leads to creaming because you can’t tie up that scholarship for 4 years. 

Its just like Gelon people looked for the silver lining and supported it when all the offer did was guarantee a creaning down the road. 

Dont support recruiting kids that are obvious creaning fodder then claim to be against the practice. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, brumdog45 said:

Yeah, I'm making things up.........

Yeah, I'm the one with issues.

And what about that post proves anything...about anything other than this fan base is the sports equivalent of the loser that starts stalking a girl because she showed a little bit of interest. 

Every recruit that comes to campus is better than the experts predict somehow. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, brumdog45 said:

So, you accuse me of making something up you said and when I post the direct quote you don't acknowledge that you were wrong.

Don't fret, ebridges, I'm done responding to him.  Sorry for the side bar.

Lol if you think that post was me criticizing Archie I got some land to sell you. If anything it was criticizing the IU fanbase

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×