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Lynn Swann resigned as USC’s athletics director today after three years but Fred Glass gets a pass for ELEVEN years of crappy results. Some schools have standards.
Looks like it was a lot more than just winning games or facilities.


https://www.sportingnews.com/us/amp/ncaa-football/news/lynn-swanns-resignation-at-usc-was-inevitable-culmination-controversial-tenure-as-ad/t3njp9ndj0g31anf5fp24cmbp?__twitter_impression=true

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What a cover up! I mean, drop ceilings aren’t even mentioned!


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16 hours ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

I don't want to get too far off topic here, but the other day on the Dan Patrick Show, he said he had a source who was speculating that the Southern Cal president (who's from Akron) might go after Gene Smith (Ohio State AD), who, in turn, would bring Urban Meyer to La La Land. 

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19 minutes ago, Iugradman said:

TEN years under Glass and the football program is no better.

Yes, that is a reasonably accurate statement, but when has the IU football program ever been better under any AD's regime?  Our last winning season was in 2007 with Bill Lynch.  Before that, you have to go back to Bill Mallory who had 6 winning seasons from 1987-1994.   I didn't bother researching who the AD was at that time, but maybe we should re-hire him if he's even still alive.  This isn't a Fred Glass issue, it's simply Indiana football.   

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/indiana/index.html

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54 minutes ago, Iugradman said:

TEN years under Glass and the football program is no better.

Glass is an idiot, but this isn't unique to him.  At this point IUFB could be a verb meaning inept.

I'm not surprised IUFB is like this; Glass had to be woken up from his nap to not even pretend to do a search, and frankly it's still IUFB.

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On 9/11/2019 at 1:31 PM, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Money is necessary, not sufficient. Sure, it doesn't guarantee that your program will be successful. But, if you refuse to spend money then your program is going to struggle. I can't think of any top programs that don't spend a ton of money on football. It's an arms race. If we don't play along then we're going to get left in the dust. 

Okay....  Again for those in the back.   Indiana is not a top football program.   Indiana has not refused to spend money.  There are less than a handful of schools that are top programs in football AND basketball in large part because there's not enough money to go around.   Fred Glass has zero to do with the fact that Indiana gets many kids not recruited by the "football schools."   Would YOU choose Indiana over Ohio State or Michigan or Penn State?  Other kids don't, either.   Spending enough money to get Indiana into that class would take at least $800 million, and probably closer to $ 1 billion.  New stadium, and all that goes with it.  Big name coaches, recruiting budget, etc.   If Indiana had a "football only' facility, do they win this game?    Do they all of a sudden become "a top program?"   No...no they do not.

I'm not saying hiring Tom Allen was the right move, but if some of you think Indiana is ever going to be Ohio State or a program that can consistently beat them...and still be a top basketball school (find me in 2 years), you're on a fool's errand.

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2 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Okay....  Again for those in the back.   Indiana is not a top football program.   Indiana has not refused to spend money.  There are less than a handful of schools that are top programs in football AND basketball in large part because there's not enough money to go around.   Fred Glass has zero to do with the fact that Indiana gets many kids not recruited by the "football schools."   Would YOU choose Indiana over Ohio State or Michigan or Penn State?  Other kids don't, either.   Spending enough money to get Indiana into that class would take at least $800 million, and probably closer to $ 1 billion.  New stadium, and all that goes with it.  Big name coaches, recruiting budget, etc.   If Indiana had a "football only' facility, do they win this game?    Do they all of a sudden become "a top program?"   No...no they do not.

I'm not saying hiring Tom Allen was the right move, but if some of you think Indiana is ever going to be Ohio State or a program that can consistently beat them...and still be a top basketball school (find me in 2 years), you're on a fool's errand.

I don't see anyone at all saying that IU is ever going to be an Ohio State tier program. But why can't we be Purdue? What advantages does Purdue have over IU as a program that are unattainable for IU? They took a chance and went out and hired a rising star for a coach. He turned the program over immediately. He's Louisville through and through and yet he turned the job there down to stay at Purdue. 

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Allen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Wilson as a person.

Wilson >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Allen as a coach.


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Hard to say regarding point #2 honestly. Wilson had some awful defenses and still only ever won 6 games. Also, he is now just an offensive coordinator.


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3 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

I don't see anyone at all saying that IU is ever going to be an Ohio State tier program. But why can't we be Purdue? What advantages does Purdue have over IU as a program that are unattainable for IU? They took a chance and went out and hired a rising star for a coach. He turned the program over immediately. He's Louisville through and through and yet he turned the job there down to stay at Purdue. 

Before last season, Indiana beat Purdue 4 straight times and their record between 2013-2018 was 22-52.   Help me.  

People are using this game as a barometer and using "top programs" as examples.   I see the same few guys making points along those lines.

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3 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Before last season, Indiana beat Purdue 4 straight times and their record between 2013-2018 was 22-52.   Help me.  

People are using this game as a barometer and using "top programs" as examples.   I see the same few guys making points along those lines.

Exactly. They go 22-53 during that stretch and right after hiring Brohm they win 7 games. Their players didn't magically improve. That's the difference coaching can make. Allen, meanwhile, has taken us backwards. 

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8 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Exactly. They go 22-53 during that stretch and right after hiring Brohm they win 7 games. Their players didn't magically improve. That's the difference coaching can make. Allen, meanwhile, has taken us backwards. 

So your entire argument is based on basically half a season and one loss, right?   Think we need a better sample size before saying Indiana's not in Purdue's league.  Purdue lost to Nevada and blew a 24-7 lead in doing so.  

Wilson had Indiana at 6-6 twice.  Before that?  1-11, 5-7, 4-8, 5-7.    How exactly has Allen taken them backwards?   One game per season when using a 2 season sample you get to cherry pick?  That's what you're doing, after all.  If Indiana finishes 6-6 this season and gets to a bowl, what then?  Your point will be incorrect.   Recruiting classes continue to improve.  Coaches are making more money.  Facilities have been upgraded significantly.  You guys are b*tching for the sake of b*tching.

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16 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

So your entire argument is based on basically half a season and one loss, right?   Think we need a better sample size before saying Indiana's not in Purdue's league.  Purdue lost to Nevada and blew a 24-7 lead in doing so.  

Wilson had Indiana at 6-6 twice.  Before that?  1-11, 5-7, 4-8, 5-7.    How exactly has Allen taken them backwards?   One game per season when using a 2 season sample you get to cherry pick?  That's what you're doing, after all.  If Indiana finishes 6-6 this season and gets to a bowl, what then?  Your point will be incorrect.   Recruiting classes continue to improve.  Coaches are making more money.  Facilities have been upgraded significantly.  You guys are b*tching for the sake of b*tching.

Recruiting classss continue to improve and yet 1) we're still outrecruited by most other conference teams and 2) the defense continues to regress. Did you watch the defense? It looked horrible against both Ball State and Ohio State. Allen was hired because Glass didn't want to lose his defensive coaching abilities, and yet we've gotten worse since he started. Our facilities also still lag behind the majority of other schools in our conference.

We're not complaining for the sake of complaining. We're complaining because IU is putting a really bad product on the field and we want that to change. Did you see the pregame video of Coach Allen? It was honestly embarrassing to watch. Embarrassing on the field and off. 

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1 hour ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Recruiting classss continue to improve and yet 1) we're still outrecruited by most other conference teams and 2) the defense continues to regress. Did you watch the defense? It looked horrible against both Ball State and Ohio State. Allen was hired because Glass didn't want to lose his defensive coaching abilities, and yet we've gotten worse since he started. Our facilities also still lag behind the majority of other schools in our conference.

We're not complaining for the sake of complaining. We're complaining because IU is putting a really bad product on the field and we want that to change. Did you see the pregame video of Coach Allen? It was honestly embarrassing to watch. Embarrassing on the field and off. 

Yes you are.  There are....2-3 of you who can't seem to accept reality from what you wish for.  5-7 is not a really bad product.  52-0 and  34-24 is not a really bad product.   Today, we were completely out classed.  I saw it as well as you did, but we're not comparing ourselves to Ohio State...you said so yourself.    You're asking for 1-2 more wins a year if I understand you right.  So we go from "really bad" to what you wish for with 1 win?  A better performance against Purdue or Minnesota last year, and we're all good, right?  

I have not defended and will not defend Tom Allen.  You don't have to put words in my mouth.  

Recruiting classes are now consistently in the top 40; and honestly?  I think Indiana is a top 40 program as it relates to talent.  If Indiana were in the Big 12 or ACC?  Different outcome.  In the Big Ten East?  We are what we are.  So again, help me understand why I'm missing the point by saying you're comparing Indiana to Ohio State.   There are 3 programs in the Big Ten that basically start every season 0-3.  Indiana has been better than the other two.  

Our facilities still lag behind whose?   Overall...basketball and football (and you do have to combine them), who are we behind?    It's not the majority of our conference.  I know for sure we have better facilities in total than Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Rutgers, Minnesota, and Iowa.  I'm not sure about Maryland.   Michigan, OSU, and Penn State sell close to 700,000 football tickets a year and have revenue streams we don't have.  It's not an arms race, but resources are different. 

Why throw the lion's share of your money behind football for the sake of 1 more win?   The available funds are FAR better spent for the men's basketball program, and I know you understand the economics of that.  Indiana University Sports Properties is still top 10 in the country if not top 5; and it's 97% because of men's basketball.   That's the program that drives our bus, and wishing that weren't true won't change it.   

You want to hire a new coach?  Fine.  If Indiana goes 5-7 or worse again, I wouldn't argue.  What I WOULD argue is who we can get.   Not many high level coaches will come to a program whose ceiling is 4th in its own division.  Not any coach who'd stay, anyway.   Because....unless you really ARE saying Indiana can consistently beat the "big 3," that's our reality.   What you want is one more win against a western division team which we didn't get a year ago, and Purdue did....so you're jealous?  Angry?  Whatever it is.....you have to be realistic, and you have to understand the whole of Indiana's athletic situation.   Not acknowledging that on your part does not equal missing the point on my part.

 

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5 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Yes you are.  There are....2-3 of you who can't seem to accept reality from what you wish for.  5-7 is not a really bad product.  52-0 and  34-24 is not a really bad product.   Today, we were completely out classed.  I saw it as well as you did, but we're not comparing ourselves to Ohio State...you said so yourself.    You're asking for 1-2 more wins a year if I understand you right.  So we go from "really bad" to what you wish for with 1 win?  A better performance against Purdue or Minnesota last year, and we're all good, right?  

I have not defended and will not defend Tom Allen.  You don't have to put words in my mouth.  

Recruiting classes are now consistently in the top 40; and honestly?  I think Indiana is a top 40 program as it relates to talent.  If Indiana were in the Big 12 or ACC?  Different outcome.  In the Big Ten East?  We are what we are.  So again, help me understand why I'm missing the point by saying you're comparing Indiana to Ohio State.   There are 3 programs in the Big Ten that basically start every season 0-3.  Indiana has been better than the other two.  

Our facilities still lag behind whose?   Overall...basketball and football (and you do have to combine them), who are we behind?    Why throw the lion's share of your money behind football for the sake of 1 more win?   The available funds are FAR better spent for the men's basketball program, and I know you understand the economics of that.  Indiana University Sports Properties is still top 10 in the country if not top 5; and it's 97% because of men's basketball.   That's the program that drives our bus, and wishing that weren't true won't change it.   

You want to hire a new coach?  Fine.  If Indiana goes 5-7 or worse again, I wouldn't argue.  What I WOULD argue is who we can get.   Not many high level coaches will come to a program whose ceiling is 4th in its own division.  Not any coach who'd stay, anyway.   Because....unless you really ARE saying Indiana can consistently beat the "big 3," that's our reality.   What you want is one more win against a western division team which we didn't get a year ago, and Purdue did....so you're jealous?  Angry?  Whatever it is.....you have to be realistic, and you have to understand the whole of Indiana's athletic situation.   Not acknowledging that on your part does not equal missing the point on my part.

 

You continue to completely miss the point. Why bring basketball facilities up in a conversation about football? It makes zero sense. Yeah, the basketball facilities are good. Has nothing to do with a conversation about football though. 

5-7 is a really bad product when we have to schedule 3 terrible teams to win 5 games. There's a huge difference between 5-7 and 7-5. And we don't start out 0-3 every single year. Penn State and Michigan are not impossible to beat. We lost by 11 to Michigan last year, 7 in OT in 2017, and 10 in 2016. We're not going to consistently beat those teams, but there's no reason we can't occasionally beat some of them. Yet we never do. 

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Just now, Hoosierfan2017 said:

You continue to completely miss the point. Why bring basketball facilities up in a conversation about football? It makes zero sense. Yeah, the basketball facilities are good. Has nothing to do with a conversation about football though. 

5-7 is a really bad product when we have to schedule 3 terrible teams to win 5 games. There's a huge difference between 5-7 and 7-5. And we don't start out 0-3 every single year. Penn State and Michigan are not impossible to beat. We lost by 11 to Michigan last year, 7 in OT in 2017, and 10 in 2016. We're not going to consistently beat those teams, but there's no reason we can't occasionally beat some of them. Yet we never do. 

You ask me this question and tell me I'm missing the point?    That's funny.  

I know what Indiana is.  I also know what you want them to be.  You first need to accept the realities of the situation, which you haven't done.     We haven't beaten those teams much in over 100 years of trying.   You think "throwing money at it" is the solution, but won't answer the very simple question of "who can we get?"   

You don't like the answer, and I get that, but ignoring it does not mean I'm missing the point.  We do start 0-3 every year.  That's not me missing the point, that's you in denial.  We may win against those teams, but it'll only be once in a while and an anomaly.   No matter how much money we throw at it?  Those 3 will always have WAY more.  Nobody in the west can come close to the money those 3 programs have....like it or not.

No, quite the contrary I absolutely understand your point, and if Indiana winds up 6-6 and goes to a bowl, it'll be a moot one.   Indiana is not a top football program.  It will never BE a top football program.  This is a "fire Fred Glass" thread, and I find it very ironic that he hired Kevin Wilson, who you claimed had Indiana in a better place; and now want him fired because the program is essentially in the SAME place, but BETTER than past history....without being able to tell me who they can go get.  I don't care who was available.  I want you to tell me....with a straight face that you believe Indiana's ceiling is something different than 4th in its own division; THEN tell me what coach is coming here with that reality hanging over his head.

YOUR point is very different than THE point; which is the problems in this situation are WAY above Fred Glass.

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10 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

You ask me this question and tell me I'm missing the point?    That's funny.  

I know what Indiana is.  I also know what you want them to be.  You first need to accept the realities of the situation, which you haven't done.     We haven't beaten those teams much in over 100 years of trying.   You think "throwing money at it" is the solution, but won't answer the very simple question of "who can we get?"   

You don't like the answer, and I get that, but ignoring it does not mean I'm missing the point.  We do start 0-3 every year.  That's not me missing the point, that's you in denial.  We may win against those teams, but it'll only be once in a while and an anomaly.   No matter how much money we throw at it?  Those 3 will always have WAY more.  Nobody in the west can come close to the money those 3 programs have....like it or not.

No, quite the contrary I absolutely understand your point, and if Indiana winds up 6-6 and goes to a bowl, it'll be a moot one.   Indiana is not a top football program.  It will never BE a top football program.  This is a "fire Fred Glass" thread, and I find it very ironic that he hired Kevin Wilson, who you claimed had Indiana in a better place; and now want him fired because the program is essentially in the SAME place, but BETTER than past history....without being able to tell me who they can go get.  I don't care who was available.  I want you to tell me....with a straight face that you believe Indiana's ceiling is something different than 4th in its own division; THEN tell me what coach is coming here with that reality hanging over his head.

YOUR point is very different than THE point; which is the problems in this situation are WAY above Fred Glass.

Saying we start out every year 0-3 is a defeatist mentality. I have no interest in thinking like that. You keep mentioning IU's "ceiling". I don't care what our ceiling is. If you approach the issue like we have a ceiling then you're doing it wrong from the beginning.  

IU football has sucked for 100 years. Northwestern sucked for a really long time. Then they hired a great coach. They went to 6 bowl games in their history before him. They've been to 9 with him. 9 bowl games in 13 years, and three 10 win seasons. 

Who can we get? Who knows. You won't ever find out who you can get when you pull a Fted Glass and don't even conduct a coaching search. That's a great way to never find out who you could get. I doubt Kansas thought they could get Les Miles, until they did. 

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C'mon boys. The argument stops here.

It's the DROP CEILINGS.

It really is. We’ve cheaped out in just about everything we’ve done sans the basketball recruiting budget.

If leadership had the same attention to detail and desire to win as the fans we would be in a lot better place. Slapping lipstick on a pig apparently is enough to appease some here

 

 

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