Indiana vs Nebraska 1/14/19 6:30pm FS1

[WayneFleekHoosier 46,828]

I agree in principle, but a different starting five won't help if they can't make shots. Tonight, no matter who played, we couldn't make shots.

Yeah but I don’t care. Normal starters aren’t doing anything well.

Tonight Justin Smith took first 2 shots, I believe. Both were awful.

Nebraska wins tip and a simple screen dive open for uncontested dunk.

Give me guys that are going to hustle at the very least and play defense even if the offense is stone cold.

It’s a matter of energy.

But yes, your point is valid that we don’t have shot makers. It’s awful.


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[Uspshoosier 44,308]

Except they aren’t a good program. They’ve gotten the benefit of Indiana not being good and the Big Ten being down the last several years.


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They went 12-6 in league last year and still missed the tourney. Can you be a good program and have 0 tournament wins in your history? Miles did a good job of constructing a roster with transfers to where he has a team that can compete in the B1G when they are all Seniors. I had them finishing top 5 this year in the B1G. If they are to win a the first tournament game in their history this year will the year. Team will look different next year


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[Demo 17,453]

29 minutes ago, Bailey7878 said:

Davis was never going to be healthy this year and we knew that. In fact i thought the talk was redshirting. So we needed a big body grad transfer not a role player from st marys. That was a big mistake.

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You’re right about Fitzner, though I think they probably wanted him because Randy Bennett does a lot of the same stuff as Archie and they thought he would be able to just go. But the Prilleresque athleticism was too much to overcome. I really wanted a grad transfer PG. Rob is not ready for this. Love Watson, and he was just way too good for Rob and Green tonight. 

[Old Friend 8,389]

2 hours ago, Crimson and Cream said:

Watched the presser and Archie just doesn't sound like he likes Moore. Seems like it pains him to give him credit and he wishes he didn't have to play him. I don't get it. He gives you a lot more than Fitzner or even Davis at this point. He was probably our third most impactful player tonight outside of Juwan and Romeo (and probably Rob). 

Help me.   Moore still has a long way to go defensively.  Yeah, he had a bucket in transition and another at the end of a loose ball; but what did he do tonight that was so worthy of "credit?"    He, like almost everyone, has a long way to go.

[MikeRoberts 6,834]

Help me.   Moore still has a long way to go defensively.  Yeah, he had a bucket in transition and another at the end of a loose ball; but what did he do tonight that was so worthy of "credit?"    He, like almost everyone, has a long way to go.

Outside of Langford and Morgan we don’t have much period. Phinisee and a few others might be great down the road but outside of our big two, we can’t rely on much offensively or defensively.

We could be a great team but that means others developing and playing with confidence and consistency and it isn’t happening


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[Whoozhers 3,638]

Had our chances. RL’s 3 would’ve cut the lead to 2 but was an uber clank. After that miss.... they ran up the score on us big. AGAIN. Drained any energy or momentum we had instantly.
Woke up this morning wondering if we practice and if so, what do we do in practice? Anybody ever seen them practice??

Disgruntled? Yes.
Hopeful? Trying to be.....Saturday will tell.





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[JSHoosier 19,580]

10 hours ago, Joe DeLow said:

This team is ending up being a major waste of talent. Archie better get to fixin that offense or he won’t be around long.


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Glass is still AD (sadly), so about 10 years is what he'd have.

[Napleshoosier 9,808]

People have been ignoring what they are seeing all season long. We haven’t been good except for 1 game. This team could very easily miss the tournament. And no, I’m not overreacting.

So glad I was at my Sons BB practice and didn’t watch this live. The fast forward button saved me tons of anger and frustration.


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I’ve been expecting a NIT birth since the Duke game. I hope I’m surprised.


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[Napleshoosier 9,808]

Adam Herbert chose Sampson.  For one reason and one reason only.
Indiana has STILL not recovered from giving Mike Davis the job when Knight was fired.  

Miles f-Brand still sticking us from the grave!


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[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

This team MUST find additional scoring options outside of Romeo and Juwan.. Maybe even a spot up 3 point shooter or two.

Not sure if anyone else heard it, but coming out of a timeout, they showed Miles talking to his team, and all he said was "we know they are going to get the ball to Morgan and Langford, the usual cast of characters," (something like that). It's so painfully obvious what IU is looking to do on every possession. If I know it and Miles knows it... So does every other team in the country.

THIS ISN'T HE A-10 ANYMORE, COACH!

[MikeRoberts 6,834]

This team MUST find additional scoring options outside of Romeo and Juwan.. Maybe even a spot up 3 point shooter or two.
Not sure if anyone else heard it, but coming out of a timeout, they showed Miles talking to his team, and all he said was "we know they are going to get the ball to Morgan and Langford, the usual cast of characters," (something like that). It's so painfully obvious what IU is looking to do on every possession. If I know it and Miles knows it... So does every other team in the country.
THIS ISN'T HE A-10 ANYMORE, COACH!

We need sets to get Durham and Phinisee open looks behind the 3 point line. They should each be taking 5 a game assuming we run plays for them to be open


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[LamarCheeks 16,856]

Let me start by saying I like Archie. I thought he was a good hire. I could be wrong -- I often am -- but when he came aboard, I thought it was a good move. There were two guys I really would've loved to have -- Tony Bennett, Brad Stevens -- and they weren't happening, so given the remaining pool, I thought Archie was among the best options. I'm still in his corner, but last night really concerns me. Those guys just acted as if they didn't want to be there, and oftentimes, I think that's a reflection on the coach. There was no fire in their belly and no sense of urgency. You're playing in the nation's best conference in front of 17,000-plus fans -- how can that not get you fired up to play? And please don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying Crean is better than Archie -- no way, no how -- and I'm so old now that I can't necessarily remember nine and 10 years ago, but even when we were gawdawful in FCTC's early years, it seems that at least we played hard. No matter what our problems were last night, I think most everyone can agree: That team did NOT play hard. That's what frustrated the bejabbers out of me.  

P.S. One of the things we lack most is a consistent outside shooter. Living out in the commonwealth, I see him play (on TV) quite often, but just imagine how good Kyle Guy would look in the cream & crimson. When he crosses the half-court line, he's in range. And he doesn't need much room -- he can shoot off the dribble and off screens. FCTC really blew it there. 

[Old Friend 8,389]

5 hours ago, Joe DeLow said:

Well Moore is young, very athletic and very long. He was a good spark off the bench last night and the crowd absolutely loved him. Everyone around me at the game was wanting him to play and loved seeing him go in. If Archie actually played him he could get better on the defensive end and catch up to the speed of the game. He can end up being a good weak side shot blocker and if this team would learn to run a pick and roll correctly, he could end up catching lobs off a screen. Not playing him is just going to hurt him. Fitz is who he is at this point in his career. Moore has the potential to be a contributor the next two years.


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Here's where we differ.  You said "if Archie actually played him" as if there is a compelling reason Archie should.  Players earn their playing time in practice.  If a kid's not playing, especially in a position of obvious need, there's a reason.   Moore's energy notwithstanding, if he's not showing himself ready when none of us are watching, he's not going to get those minutes yet.    If he needs to play extended minutes "because we have nobody else," I think we'd see why he hasn't played much.  

Moore's role right now is "spark off the bench."  Extended minutes for a kid who's not ready for them is always detrimental; and Moore was absolutely lost defensively last night.  Very few will focus on that because they saw the two buckets (both of which were in "open" situations, where he can thrive like anyone else); but I don't think this falls on blaming Archie for not playing him.

We're all frustrated.  I don't think Moore is the answer yet.    I do think Archie needs to spend some time this week figuring out what kind of coach he is.  The slow starts and obvious lack of offensive production fall absolutely on him.

[Maedhros 612]

No one knows what goes on in practice. Not even media, as practices are closed. We assume Clifton isn't showing anything in practice because he doesn't see the floor during games. In the absence of any other reason, it's the best one available. But it's still just an assumption.

I don't get to see practice, so I have judge what I see in games. I see a player just as lost as Fitzner on defense, but without the opportunity to learn on the job. Fitzner is in his final season and has played 2,134 minutes in his career. He is who he is. Clifton is a sophomore given just 92 minutes so far in his career. Yet in that small sample he's the best rebounder on the team, a capable shot blocker, and efficient from the field. Fitzner is none of those things. The one thing he does that Clifton doesn't is shoot the three, and that's completely disappeared in Big Ten play. So even if their defense is equally poor - and the metrics actually favor Clifton - I don't at all understand why you wouldn't run out the kid who has something else to offer, and who still has upside yet to be developed. Some lessons can only be learned through meaningful minutes in live games, and for some kids the best motivator is opportunity.

[KzooHoosier82 972]

14 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

His entire system gives up rebounds it’s part of the philosophy but that doesn’t work at this level. 

If you let your man go by and thus get taken on by another defender you HAVE to locate his man as soon as possible and defend, and/or box out. Morgan and Green are the absolute worst at doing this. They'll let their guy drive into the help side defense and just stand there expecting the missed shot to come to them. Meanwhile the help-side defender (usually Smith) goes up for the block and no one is there to get a rebound. The pack-line defense is not designed to give up rebounds and uncontested put backs...that is a product of not executing the pack-line properly. 

[Old Friend 8,389]

55 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

So what would be the difference of giving Moore the minutes you’d normally give Fitzner? Fitzner rarely shoots anymore and can’t play a lick of defense in any way. We are at a point in the season where tough decisions need to be made. Because we are getting into the territory of not making the tourney. Playing Moore would be a risk but a risk worth taking because it could be very helpful the next two seasons.


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Difference is Fitzner is worlds stronger and Archie thinks those minutes should be his.   Fitzner may not be very good, but he is in the right places and can at least provide post resistance.   Same can't be said for Moore right now, and a kid in the wrong place hurts the overall team.   He's (Fitzner) also a decent passer and still a threat from outside, even as his slump has gone on embarassingly long.  

I don't agree with your last.  Playing kids who aren't ready generally doesn't help them.   That said, if Archie thinks a change needs to be made, a change will be made.   I'm not against playing Moore a few more minutes, but I would like to see his defensive awareness improve.

[VO5 8,272]

11 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Difference is Fitzner is worlds stronger and Archie thinks those minutes should be his.   Fitzner may not be very good, but he is in the right places and can at least provide post resistance.   Same can't be said for Moore right now, and a kid in the wrong place hurts the overall team.   He's (Fitzner) also a decent passer and still a threat from outside, even as his slump has gone on embarassingly long.  

I don't agree with your last.  Playing kids who aren't ready generally doesn't help them.   That said, if Archie thinks a change needs to be made, a change will be made.   I'm not against playing Moore a few more minutes, but I would like to see his defensive awareness improve.

Fitzner is not stronger at all. He consistently doesn’t box out his man and loses boards to guys smaller than him. Fitzner couldn’t back down and score on Glynn Watson last night, who he has about 9 inches on. He isn’t a good defender either. His help side defense is awful.

There is zero reason to play Fitzner over Moore at this point. Moore will have defensive lapses, but Fitzner gives up just as much with his lack of rebounding and bad helpside defense. 

Idc if Fitzner can hit 3s. He has to do it in games and outside of the Marquette and duke games, I don’t recall him hitting many at all. So he’s a complete liability on the court.

[Bailey7878 2,506]

I’ve been expecting a NIT birth since the Duke game. I hope I’m surprised.


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At this point I am expecting NIT as well making three years in a row of no NCAA. I think today I finally excepted the fact we are just an average middle of the pack big ten team. We have not been a blueblood since 1994 and may very likely never will be again. Tough to swallow but it is reality.

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[Hoosierfan2017 19,903]

11 minutes ago, VO5 said:

Fitzner is not stronger at all. He consistently doesn’t box out his man and loses boards to guys smaller than him. Fitzner couldn’t back down and score on Glynn Watson last night, who he has about 9 inches on. He isn’t a good defender either. His help side defense is awful.

There is zero reason to play Fitzner over Moore at this point. Moore will have defensive lapses, but Fitzner gives up just as much with his lack of rebounding and bad helpside defense. 

Idc if Fitzner can hit 3s. He has to do it in games and outside of the Marquette and duke games, I don’t recall him hitting many at all. So he’s a complete liability on the court.

Fwiw, outside of the Duke and Marquette games, he's 3-19 on 3s in 15 games. He's definitely been a huge disappointment, but grad transfers are a mixed bag. They don't always turn out like Max or Zeisloft. Sometimes they're like Evan Gordon. 

I've been an Archie supporter, but I have no clue why he keeps getting minutes. He gives us nothing, and he won't be back next year. Even if the young post players also give us nothing there's an opportunity for them to learn and give us something in the years to come. 

[Bailey7878 2,506]

Fitzner is not stronger at all. He consistently doesn’t box out his man and loses boards to guys smaller than him. Fitzner couldn’t back down and score on Glynn Watson last night, who he has about 9 inches on. He isn’t a good defender either. His help side defense is awful.
There is zero reason to play Fitzner over Moore at this point. Moore will have defensive lapses, but Fitzner gives up just as much with his lack of rebounding and bad helpside defense. 
Idc if Fitzner can hit 3s. He has to do it in games and outside of the Marquette and duke games, I don’t recall him hitting many at all. So he’s a complete liability on the court.

Fitzner is just a bad bbal player. I have said a million times there was a reason he did not start at St. Mary's. Still will never understand what archie saw in him.

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