Injury Updates

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

3 minutes ago, cthomas said:

I think it would be useful if someone from the athletic department would explain what the concussion protocol at IU consists of. Something as as serious as this should probably be mandated by the NCAA and administered in a consistent manner. Maybe it is and is just not public knowledge. It is usually where a lack of information exists that speculation runs rampant.

That information is out there. Pretty sure USPS has posted it already but here it is

https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/2017-18CProto65_IndianaU_Protocol_20170803.pdf

 

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

11 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Everybody saying IU is being overly cautious is saying that. Albeit indirectly. 

Not true at all. I am 100% saying IU is being overly cautious with the protocol and how they are administering it.

I am absolutely NOT saying (even indirectly) that I care more about winning games than I do the players health.

I am saying I believe the players are safe and healthy and because of the over cautious nature IU is implementing they are still not allowed to practice or play.

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

1 minute ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

I disagree. People don't want IU to rush players back before they're healthy, we're just confused by what's going on. The bump Rob took didn't look serious at all but it's got him out for 2+ weeks. It's just odd to me. 

What’s so mysterious. Obviously the ability to judge a concussion by outer appearance is limited. He was clearly tested for a concussion and has one. 

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

Just now, Str8Hoosiers said:

Not true at all. I am 100% saying IU is being overly cautious with the protocol and how they are administering it.

I am absolutely NOT saying (even indirectly) that I care more about winning games than I do the players health.

I am saying I believe the players are safe and healthy and because of the over cautious nature IU is implementing they are still not allowed to practice or play.

Are you a doctor?  And if so have you examined these patients. Because otherwise you can’t possibly make that determination 

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

I think it would be useful if someone from the athletic department would explain what the concussion protocol at IU consists of. Something as as serious as this should probably be mandated by the NCAA and administered in a consistent manner. Maybe it is and is just not public knowledge. It is usually where a lack of information exists that speculation runs rampant.

Google is your friend.

As of 2015, don’t know if it’s been updated: http://sidearm.sites.s3.amazonaws.com/iuhoosiers.com/documents/2015/8/6/IUConcussionPolicy.pdf

Indiana has made a few student athlete friendly moves in the past few years that weren’t NCAA administered such as the Student Athlete Bill of Rights.


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[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

Just now, Brass Cannon said:

What’s so mysterious. Obviously the ability to judge a concussion by outer appearance is limited. He was clearly tested for a concussion and has one. 

This is the problem... the testing...

The baseline. The protocol... 

You say he was clear tested and has 1, but by everything I have seen he clearly doesn't have 1... but because some test or some baseline in some test that isn't perfected says so then he is out.

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

Just now, Str8Hoosiers said:

This is the problem... the testing...

The baseline. The protocol... 

You say he was clear tested and has 1, but by everything I have seen he clearly doesn't have 1... but because some test or some baseline in some test that isn't perfected says so then he is out.

What have you seen?  And what makes you qualified to diagnose concussions. 

[Baltimore Hoosier 986]

30 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

He’s confirmed out. Let’s just hope he’s back by Wednesday so he has some time to get the rust off before Maryland

Not good.

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

8 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

What’s so mysterious. Obviously the ability to judge a concussion by outer appearance is limited. He was clearly tested for a concussion and has one. 

I have doubts that he even had a concussion. If the test is like the one brumdog45's son took for the tennis team, you could be perfectly healthy and still fail it. The "baseline" they use isn't a player's true baseline because they make you take it until you get a certain score. If we want to make sure that a player is back to their pre-injury state, what sense does it make to not use their true baseline? 

If a player is really concussed then absolutely hold them out until they're completely healthy. What is frustrating to me is that I suspect Rob is healthy but is being kept out due to an overly cautious medical staff and a flawed test. 

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

1 minute ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

I have doubts that he even had a concussion. If the test is like the one brumdog45's son took for the tennis team, you could be perfectly healthy and still fail it. The "baseline" they use isn't a player's true baseline because they make you take it until you get a certain score. If we want to make sure that a player is back to their pre-injury state, what sense does it make to not use their true baseline? 

If a player is really concussed then absolutely hold them out until they're completely healthy. What is frustrating to me is that I suspect Rob is healthy but is being kept out due to an overly cautious medical staff and a flawed test. 

So you think your suspicions are more valid than what at this point is probably multiple doctors diagnosis. Interesting. 

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

7 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

So you think your suspicions are more valid than what at this point is probably multiple doctors diagnosis. Interesting. 

That's not at all what I'm saying. I've said before that I could very well be wrong. This is all just me speculating. That's what message boards are for. If IU has put in a strict protocol then the doctors have no choice but to be overly cautious. 

When it comes to concussions, I don't know why people aren't allowed to question what's going on without being accused of not caring about players' safety. It's like this taboo subject we're not allowed to push back against at all. It's entirely possible to have doubts about the protocol while also wanting players to be healthy before they're put back into action. 

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

2 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

That's not at all what I'm saying. I've said before that I could very well be wrong. This is all just me speculating. That's what message boards are for. If IU has put in a strict protocol then the doctors have no choice but to be overly cautious. 

As should be done with kids and their literal mental and emotional health. 

[Chips&Dipo 1,448]

The amount of neurological experts on here is amazing. When it comes to the health of a young man, I will go with the experts.

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

3 minutes ago, Andowen1990IU said:

The amount of neurological experts on here is amazing. When it comes to the health of a young man, I will go with the experts.

If we're only supposed to opine about things we're experts on then this site and every other sports site would have to be shut down. We're not D1 coaches or players, and we're not talking heads on ESPN, so by the same logic we shouldn't be giving our opinions on college basketball. 

[Chips&Dipo 1,448]

2 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

If we're only supposed to opine about things we're experts on then this site and every other sports site would have to be shut down. We're not D1 coaches or players, and we're not talking heads on ESPN, so by the same logic we shouldn't be giving our opinions on college basketball. 

You really think discussing casual fandom of a sport played by kids is the same as saying you are more right than a doctor or a scientist? Especially when it comes to the health of a young man? 

Edited January 4, 2019 by Andowen1990IU

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

3 minutes ago, Andowen1990IU said:

You really think discussing casual fandom of a sport played by kids is the same as saying you are more right than a doctor or a scientist? Especially when it comes to the health of a young man? 

Who has said they're more right than doctors or scientists? And yes, I do think it's about the same. None of us have the power to force Rob, Race or any other player to come back early from injury. We're just dudes giving opinions on a message board. 

Also, doctors have been wrong before. I don't think they're wrong about concussions, but just because a doctor says something doesn't make it true. Plus, doctors have different opinions. They don't all believe the exact same thing when it comes to concussions/concussion research. 

[Chips&Dipo 1,448]

4 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Who has said they're more right than doctors or scientists? And yes, I do think it's about the same. None of us have the power to force Rob, Race or any other player to come back early from injury. We're just dudes giving opinions on a message board. 

Also, doctors have been wrong before. I don't think they're wrong about concussions, but just because a doctor says something doesn't make it true. Plus, doctors have different opinions. They don't all believe the exact same thing when it comes to concussions/concussion research. 

Everyone here is implying they are more right than doctors and scientists by saying that IU is being overly cautious and should allow Rob to play when IU is following the recommendation of a Doctor. 

Also doctors and scientists can be wrong, but they are usually proven wrong by other doctors and scientists. If our society made more decisions after looking at scientific facts (agreeing and conflicting facts) instead of their armchair quarter back gut, we would all be in a better place.  Don't insinuate that a doctors don't know what they are talking about by quoting some fat o-line coach who is only famous because of a funny video (I know not you).

[Hoosierfan2017 19,886]

11 minutes ago, Andowen1990IU said:

Everyone here is implying they are more right than doctors and scientists by saying that IU is being overly cautious and should allow Rob to play when IU is following the recommendation of a Doctor. 

Also doctors and scientists can be wrong, but they are usually proven wrong by other doctors and scientists. If our society made more decisions after looking at scientific facts (agreeing and conflicting facts) instead of their armchair quarter back gut, we would all be in a better place.  Don't insinuate that a doctors don't know what they are talking about by quoting some fat o-line coach who is only famous because of a funny video (I know not you).

It could be that IU decided to be overly cautious because of the player safety issues we had under Coach Wilson. Heck, maybe we're not actually being overly cautious, other schools and pro leagues might not be cautious enough, making it look like we're overly cautious when we're doing what we're supposed to do. I really don't know. Whatever the reality is, I just hope Rob can get healthy and cleared soon. 

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

1 hour ago, Brass Cannon said:

What have you seen?  And what makes you qualified to diagnose concussions. 

I have seen MANY cases of somebody being diagnosed with a concussion and then later told the diagnosis was wrong and they NEVER actually had a concussion. I have heard stories from others on the testing procedures and how it is not a true baseline (see others posts above as additional examples).

I personally am NOT qualified to make any diagnosis and I am not making a diagnosis. i am saying the ones that are could be wrong. And even the medical Professionals and experts don't agree on the subject at all. Once you put the strict protocols in place that IU has apparently done then it no longer matters what a doctor says... the protocols overwrite the doctors opinions or diagnosis.

[Brass Cannon 24,064]

7 minutes ago, Str8Hoosiers said:

I have seen MANY cases of somebody being diagnosed with a concussion and then later told the diagnosis was wrong and they NEVER actually had a concussion. I have heard stories from others on the testing procedures and how it is not a true baseline (see others posts above as additional examples).

I personally am NOT qualified to make any diagnosis and I am not making a diagnosis. i am saying the ones that are could be wrong. And even the medical Professionals and experts don't agree on the subject at all. Once you put the strict protocols in place that IU has apparently done then it no longer matters what a doctor says... the protocols overwrite the doctors opinions or diagnosis.

So you literally have nothing but antecdotal evidence and yet strongly suspect Rob is just fine.