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mdn82

This Thread Is About Coaches

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There isn’t a right or wrong answer here. People’s opinion are going to differ. Most analysts praised him for the job he did with a limited roster (again no right or wrong answer if you think it was limited or not). A couple even said if it wasn’t for Holtman they would of voted him coach of the year in the B1G. If u expected more I have no problem with that just like I have no problem with someone who didn’t have higher expectations


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I can get behind this. I just get annoyed by those who say my opinion isn't valid because they don't like it. I hated what I saw on the court. I don't understand how somebody can be pleased with the results, but to each his own.

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9 minutes ago, Josh said:

 


I can get behind this. I just get annoyed by those who say my opinion isn't valid because they don't like it. I hated what I saw on the court. I don't understand how somebody can be pleased with the results, but to each his own.

 

Nobody is pleased that we lost those games. We just aren’t going to jump off the bandwagon before it gets going. The way you present your opinion makes it seem like you don’t support Archie bc you didn’t expect bad losses in year one. You’re not giving him a chance. You can be skeptical and share your opinion. But everyone else has the right to come back at you with their opinion. If you can’t take that, then that’s a you issue. My vote is for you to keep posting bc I like to debate. 

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13 minutes ago, Josh said:

 


Ok. And I think it's too soon to say he's done a great job. We can only grade what we've seen. I didn't see a passing grade.

I basically agree with this, though if by not seeing a passing grade you mean that you saw a failing one, I wouldn't go that far. Of course we shouldn't be losing to the Fort Wayne's and ISU's of the world, certainly not at home. But better teams lose to lesser teams all the time. The #1 seed in the tournament just lost by 22 on a neutral floor to a team that would have caused a collective aneurysm on this board if we'd lost to them. Wichita St lost to Marshall. and Gregg Marshall is as good as it gets. It happens.

There are a couple of things that I'm curoius about going forward. I'm not a fan philosophically of pack line defense. I'm also curious why with the exception of McRoberts every single rotation player shot a lower percentage from 3 this year than last year. That would indicate a gap in the skill development piece. I also didn't like the way he coached a few games this year. Liked the strategic piece in the Purdue game particularly. Didn't like it in either Illinois game. Seemed  rigid in sticking with some things that weren't working.

But he's young and he's smart. If he evaluates his year and grows, he can be the guy long-term. If he doesn't, maybe not. I'm not ready to call it either way. 

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Nobody is pleased that we lost those games. We just aren’t going to jump off the bandwagon before it gets going. The way you present your opinion makes it seem like you don’t support Archie bc you didn’t expect bad losses in year one. You’re not giving him a chance. You can be skeptical and share your opinion. But everyone else has the right to come back at you with their opinion. If you can’t take that, then that’s a you issue. My vote is for you to keep posting bc I like to debate. 


All of that is fair. I appreciate other opinions. I'm not one to say that an opinion isn't valid due to some imaginary time limit on forming a differing opinion. I'm good.

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I can get behind this. I just get annoyed by those who say my opinion isn't valid because they don't like it. I hated what I saw on the court. I don't understand how somebody can be pleased with the results, but to each his own.
for me it’s as simple as seeing progress from the beginning of the year (I was at the Indiana st game). They were thinking too much instead of just playing the game of basketball. Certain guys had to step up and unfortunately that didn’t happen. When it became clear Newkirk didn’t take a step and Hartman wasn’t going to be the player he has been in the past then for me it was clear we were going to be a mediocre team. CAM instilled a culture and laid a foundation for his program moving forward. I loved the fight they showed against teams that were clearly better then they were they just didn’t know how to win. Moving forward hopefully they do. For some I think seeing Holtman having his success at Ohio St rubbed salt in the wound. It’s tough for some to see another team have success when the team u are emotionally invested in doesn’t do the same right away. Mediocre teams pretty much show that they can lose to anyone at anytime. B1G teams from 6-14 fall into that category. Some might saw Rutgers as a team that IU should of ran out of the gym but for me playing Rutgers in New York was going to be a game between 2 mediocre teams and anything can happen. That team had more Quad 1 wins then IU had and took Mich st to OT on the road.


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20 minutes ago, Josh said:

 


I can get behind this. I just get annoyed by those who say my opinion isn't valid because they don't like it. I hated what I saw on the court. I don't understand how somebody can be pleased with the results, but to each his own.

 

Let’s put this into perspective for you with new coaches. Here are some terrible losses by some hall of fame coaches when they took over a new program. 

Coach K: in year 2 Duke lost to Appalachian State, Princeton, Davidson, and Stetson. In year 3 he lost to Wagner. 

Bob Knight: In year 1 at IU lost to Northern Illinois and Princeton. 

Jim Calhoun: year 1 at UConn lost to Yale, Boston U, Hartford, and St Peter’s. 

Tom Izzo: year 1 at MSU lost to Santa Clara, Detroit Mercy, Central Michigan, and Fresno State. 

I’m not saying Archie will be those guys. What I am saying, is it would have been premature to write those guys off, just like it would be too early to write of any coach in year 1. Bad losses happen to every coach, at a higher rate at the beginning of their tenure at a university. 

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Let’s put this into perspective for you with new coaches. Here are some terrible losses by some hall of fame coaches when they took over a new program. 
Coach K: in year 2 Duke lost to Appalachian State, Princeton, Davidson, and Stetson. In year 3 he lost to Wagner. 
Bob Knight: In year 1 at IU lost to Northern Illinois and Princeton. 
Jim Calhoun: year 1 at UConn lost to Yale, Boston U, Hartford, and St Peter’s. 
Tom Izzo: year 1 at MSU lost to Santa Clara, Detroit Mercy, Central Michigan, and Fresno State. 
I’m not saying Archie will be those guys. What I am saying, is it would have been premature to write those guys off, just like it would be too early to write of any coach in year 1. Bad losses happen to every coach, at a higher rate at the beginning of their tenure at a university. 


Oh, I get your perspective. That doesn't mean this season was better than a D+

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36 minutes ago, Josh said:

 


Oh, I get your perspective. That doesn't mean this season was better than a D+

 

From a W-L perspective, I don’t think people would disagree. Archie would probably agree too. I think most had this season in perspective before the season or they realized after ISU that the team was just not good. So they started looking at the actual coaching being done and system being put in place. 

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@CoachingChanges is reporting Shaka to Louisville. If you check their timeline, they’ve been days ahead on some of the other coaching announcements. 

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5 minutes ago, BH33 said:

@CoachingChanges is reporting Shaka to Louisville. If you check their timeline, they’ve been days ahead on some of the other coaching announcements. 

After watching Shaka totally blow the Nevada game I'm completely skeptical of him as a HC. Had a great roster this year and totally wasted it. They were lucky to get in the tourney. 

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Confusing timeline...

“Ace guru source

“I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around this, but one of the people I trust the most says Shaka to Louisville is 100% done.”

I think that’s enough to make the call

Shaka will be next head coach of the Louisville Cardinals”

 

then, this one like 5 min later:

“Not happening Mack to Louisville has been done for weeks, delay is only to give this Xavier team a shot to go deep and finish the season on a high note for everyone”

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@CoachingChanges is reporting Shaka to Louisville. If you check their timeline, they’ve been days ahead on some of the other coaching announcements. 


I saw somewhere in the Twitterverse this morning they were "reportedly" pursuing....Bryce Drew. That thread then went directly to "Romeo to Louisville?!"

Ha. Dummies.


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10 minutes ago, BH33 said:

@CoachingChanges is reporting Shaka to Louisville. If you check their timeline, they’ve been days ahead on some of the other coaching announcements. 

If he isn’t being pushed out, is that even worth it? You have everything in Austin you’d have at Louisville (minus the crazy fanbase, which might be a good thing) and no sanctions.

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1 minute ago, Hovadipo said:

If he isn’t being pushed out, is that even worth it? You have everything in Austin you’d have at Louisville (minus the crazy fanbase, which might be a good thing) and no sanctions.

Proximity to better recruiting?

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7 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Proximity to better recruiting?

Texas isn’t Indiana, but there’s a ton of talent down there too. And with the amount of money that athletic department rakes in, it shouldn’t be hard to recruit there. 

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6 hours ago, Josh said:

 


Yes, our players were playing in a new system. Same as Ohio State's players. Same as Butler's players. Same as many other teams. Ours didn't find any success. What's the difference there?

I'm not so upset that they lost their first game to far inferior talent. It's the blowout fashion in which they did. Then the blowout loss to Fort Wayne. And yes, Rutgers beat us pretty convincingly in the Big Ten tourney. All of these were really embarrassing.

Looking at the season, there is plenty of reason to be disappointed. I really can't find one for optimism. Perhaps I should be telling the optimistic ones that it's way too early for their excitement? Because imo, I have seen nothing optimistic except that Archie is Not Crean.

 

How is Ohio State different that we were this season?  Because Chris Holtmann took over for Thad Matta.  Both products of the system at Butler; and not very different.  Indiana's was a polar opposite from what they were used to.

Then, take into account what they had coming back and what we had coming back.  Losses to FW and ISU were almost identical. Pack line is sometimes vulnerable to teams getting hot from behind the line, and both did.  

Defense improved immeasurably; especially late.  Miller spending a lot more time recruiting locally, and has had some success.  Turnovers were way down.  Morgan made a monumental leap.  Durham improved throughout the season.  Finished 6th in the Big Ten despite having Davis and Hartman (two players we were counting on) out or a non factor for most of the Big Ten season.  I thought our overall effort was better.    I saw enough to let everything play out.

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I can get behind this. I just get annoyed by those who say my opinion isn't valid because they don't like it. I hated what I saw on the court. I don't understand how somebody can be pleased with the results, but to each his own.
You would have really hated it with Crean at the helm. I don't think any coach would have been successful with this roster.

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for me it’s as simple as seeing progress from the beginning of the year (I was at the Indiana st game). They were thinking too much instead of just playing the game of basketball. Certain guys had to step up and unfortunately that didn’t happen. When it became clear Newkirk didn’t take a step and Hartman wasn’t going to be the player he has been in the past then for me it was clear we were going to be a mediocre team. CAM instilled a culture and laid a foundation for his program moving forward. I loved the fight they showed against teams that were clearly better then they were they just didn’t know how to win. Moving forward hopefully they do. For some I think seeing Holtman having his success at Ohio St rubbed salt in the wound. It’s tough for some to see another team have success when the team u are emotionally invested in doesn’t do the same right away. Mediocre teams pretty much show that they can lose to anyone at anytime. B1G teams from 6-14 fall into that category. Some might saw Rutgers as a team that IU should of ran out of the gym but for me playing Rutgers in New York was going to be a game between 2 mediocre teams and anything can happen. That team had more Quad 1 wins then IU had and took Mich st to OT on the road.


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Great post.

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After watching Shaka totally blow the Nevada game I'm completely skeptical of him as a HC. Had a great roster this year and totally wasted it. They were lucky to get in the tourney. 
I've never been a big fan of his. After that run with VCU in the tournament, I haven't seen a whole of succes.

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