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The one thing about player development is the player has to want to get better. You have the weight room, you have the practice courts, you have the best of everything the university has to offer. The coach can tell you what to work on, can put in the right drills but you have to do the work and put in the time Crean gets the credit for developing VO, but he didn't do anything. I watch VO spend an hour on ball handling, an hour getting a 1000 shots up every summer day. I think the whole coach's role in player development is overrated. As coach Knight use to say the light bulb either comes on or it doesn't.

Yep, 26 pages in 3 days. Here's the cliff-notes version for all the stragglers: - A lot of people are pretty ticked at Archie -Some people are upset that a lot of people are ticked at Archie - Kentucky fans are psychopaths. ( Nothing new there, but I always like to point that out). - The Chicago Cubs never had a manager for more than 6 seasons during their 108 year World Series drought - Mdn and Josh are having drinks at Nips house in Florida in June or July. I think we should all crash the party.

It looks like the ghost from IU's past and future both had hard nights last night. Crean's team celebrates at halftime like they won the NC, then lays an egg in the 2nd half. Chris Beard's TT team had to work awful hard to get to 50 points. The great Chris Holtman has now lost 3 in a row. It's a long season, every team has ups and downs. Were 11-3 with a win tonight could be 12-3.

You forgot about the part where Chris is actually a tanning bed salesman. That is the most useful info on this whole thread, in my opinion

typical highlight clip, but you can see why they’d kick the tires on him. Great pg size/body. Good looking athlete. Looks to be able to create. Also seems like he might have some edge to him. And, God knows, this team could use some edge.

I think we need a parking lot fight.... Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

Yeah I don’t think they are crean’s players. I do think they are players Archie would not have gone out and recruited in normal circumstances. All in all they are his responsibility now and it is year three and they have had plenty of time in his system. But also it is important to remember that the 2017 recruiting class is a major reason Tom Crean was seen as a lame duck and many said he could no longer recruit because he had a class of Al Durham, Justin Smith, and Clifton Moore. Fans were up in arms about how terrible of a class it was and how Crean missed terribly on that the class. Myself included. So it kinda fits whatever narrative you want. They were seen as a failure of a class when crean recruited them. But now the narrative is that Archie has them they are his kids and they haven’t developed and it’s all his fault. Well three years ago people weren’t expecting jack from this class... now it’s the foundation of the team and people can’t figure out why they aren’t great players and this isn’t a great team. The fact they are the foundation of the team is the bigger concern as I had hoped Archie could have developed other players better. Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Reading this thread is like watching a trainwreck. You know you shouldn't, but you just can't stop yourself.

As much as I try to refrain from linking to other message boards, here are two extensive threads from this week that y'all may find insightful: ;) https://247sports.com/college/ohio-state/board/123/Contents/is-holtman-the-answer-141589343/ https://247sports.com/college/louisville/board/103990/Contents/what-is-macks-buyout-141811041/

Kentucky going to be like we aren’t playing Georgia anymore unless it’s neutral sites even though it’s a conference opponent Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

Blackhawk Christian started the game with a suffocating full court press and kept it up for the entire first half and at the half led Adams Central (2-5) 38-9. They didn't press in the second half but it really didn't matter as the final score was 73-24. Furst opened the 4th Q but quickly went to the bench for the remainder of the game. He finished with 18 pts. on 8-10 FG; 2-2 FT; 8 reb; 3 asst; 1 TO; 5 stls; 4 blks. He had a couple of opportunities to demonstrate that he can put the ball on the floor and take it to the bucket. I really like what I see in this kid.

Plus, with Patberg getting a sixth year we'll have our heart and soul for another year! Coming from a culture of winning like Notre Dame, she's definitely brought that attitude with her! Couldn't agree more about the trajectory.

Zach Osterman made the best point I have ever heard on Matt Denison's show when it comes to Football and maintaining this. He compared the experience of the Gator Bowl to when IU baseball went to Florida St. in baseball for the Super Regional prior to College World Series. He said it caused IU to see what top baseball programs 'behave' like with commitment and it caused IU to make many of those changes to become that. He said things like IU adding a director of opp and additional staff and continued improvements to Bart Kaufman Field are just some of the examples. As a result, IU while not getting back to the College World Series saw these commitments to the program and they have made us the premier program in the conference for the most part and a constant tournament team since after rarely being one prior to that. I often compare IU baseball to Butler basketball with their rise and Butler made some investments as well that has kept them a step up and stayed there. My fear is whether IU football is like Northwestern basketball a few yrs ago and the second they had success they fell apart. If IU does not want that to happen in football it needs to invest more in the program and take lessons from the Gator Bowl on what better teams do if we want to continue to step it up much like IU baseball did when it went to Florida St. I know people like to pan on the administration but it certainly stepped up to bat (pardon the pun) to give baseball everything it needs to succeed and hopefully with football it will do the same now and we can maintain this. The upping of Tom Allen and assistant salaries is a great first step and now we need to keep investing to keep this going.

I saw this in another thread, but I didn't want to derail it. Why are Juatin and Al labeled as Crean players? I know he signed them, but Archie actively recruited them to stay with IU. They didn't play a single minute for Crean. They could have easily been let out of their LOIs for Archie to bring in McKinley Wright or whoever he wanted. Instead, Archie decided that he wanted them on his team and actively worked to make sure they would become his players. Blaming Crean at all for them is just another excuse imo.

OMG other fan bases can demand high standards too and be just as looney as we are!! Again our fan base is 100% not the issue.

There was much cause for celebration Tuesday night for the Southridge boys basketball team. Not only did the Raiders (6-6) move back to .500 with a 53-50 win against the Princeton Tigers, but junior guard Colson Montgomery became Southridge's all-time leading scorer. Montgomery finished with 21 points, which puts him at 1,270 points for his career. The old record was held by 2003 graduate Reid Siskel, who finished with 1,263 points.

Guess whose team is down seven at the half against Nebraska? https://images.app.goo.gl/aWdeoTgK7Dgm4yFXA

Pikiell is doing a flat out great job. That program was deader than a doornail when he got there. So impressed with how well coached they are.

Not going into further discussion on this one either

Is he tanning bed salesman or a “tanning bed salesman?” Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Yeah, for whatever reason Indiana basketball is soft. Was Charmin soft under Crean and isn’t much stronger or tougher under Archie. I guess it’s the type of kid or players we recruit, but I’d love to be a physical, tough team. Been asking for DOGS for years. PS-ideally I don’t want recruiting failures to lead us to Juco often or ever. Sent from my iPad using BtownBanners

Ok it seemed as if you were suggesting that it would negatively impact recruiting but to me all schools have these. I just looked and Louisville has one and there were a lot of negative comments posted this weekend. I just get tired of folks blaming our fans. We are not any different from any passionate fan base. Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Anyone think any of the announcers that made a big deal about IU’s non-conference SOS being in the 300’s will say anything about their Non-conference SOS being top 50 now? This is why I would suggest people wait until conference play until they judge a non conference schedule Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

I was hesitant on Brunk impacting the program before the season. I’m sold that he is good for the program and we could use more players with his attitude. I’ve seen Archie chew into him a few times and loved the way he responded. I really hope that is rubbing off on TJD and a few of the other younger players. It would go a long way in changing the culture. Also, I’ll be shocked if he’s not named a team captain next season. He might not be blessed with the physical abilities as others are but he’s blessed with heart and determination. Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

If we could entertain Moorhead that’d be awesome. If he wants to take a step back and call plays again...I think IU is in a great position for him to have talent returning at QB, WR, RB, and TE which he uses in his offense. OL will also get a boost from grad transfer and two bookend OTs. A lot to like if you’re an OC